Not lore friendly, from a DMs perspective this game makes little sense

[ProxyJames]

Just covering the lore the first thing is that astarion does not make sense, from what I understand he is a vampire spawn (a lesser vampire) with a tadpole in his head that makes him immune to sunlight, this is not possible for two reasons
1. illithid tadpoles require a healthy LIVING host, as a vampire spawn astarion is DEAD or rather UNDEAD, the state of decay in his body has been frozen by the magic of the curse but his body is not alive hence the tadpole would die or flee soon after implantation.
2. illithid tadpoles are not magical nor do they effect magic in any way, if a host has a pre existing magical condition (such as vampirism, lycanthropy or any other curse or enchantment) the tadpole would not effect it whatsoever. hence the sun should still burn him and running water would still melt his flesh
the only way he makes sense is that he is a normal human that merely thinks hes a vampire and yes I know he has darkvision he is also possible that he is a half elf or has a magic item that grants darkvision, the teeth can be a result of casting the "alter self" spell more than once or possible using it to permanently change shape

moving on the druids make no sense either....they are in a druids grove.....A DRUIDS GROVE! that is a level 6 spell that should auto murder anything the druids don't like, fog that hiders movement and obscures vision, roots that grasp from the ground, spikes that stab intruders, trees come alive and bash the intruder and gale force winds to repel projectiles and push people back all while being harmless to the druid and those they deem friendly. that is a rough summery of the spell and with that said....how and why are they panicking? how are these worthless goblins kicking there ass? on top of that most basic goblins do not like magic (booyahg as they call it) and tend to avoid it unless it comes from one of there shamans or a hobgoblin devastator in there horde.

going back to the tadpole, many of the player races should be...well fine or just not picked, dwarfs, halflings and sometimes gnomes are normally avoided because it just kills both the tadpole and host, this information was taken from the forgotten relms wiki:
"Some creatures were always considered unacceptable for ceremorphosis. Those included centaurs, derro, duergar, dwarves, giants, halflings, and kuo-toa. Any attempt to conduct ceremorphosis in one of those races invariably resulted in death for the host and the tadpole. Most non-mammalian species were also considered incompatible in principle"

also when it comes to removing said tadpole it should have be fairly easy to remove the tadpoles with that many druids and the main cure for it...well is death by crushing the skull of the host therefore killing the tadpole then using a a spell to restore them to life with a spell such as resurrection or true resurrection, druids do not learn spells, they memorize them all as part of there training so all those druids know the spells needed to cure one of the tadpole they just need to work together and combine there magic on top of that one could find a work around revivify by using a powerful poison to kill the host and tadpole, quickly removing said dead tadpole then use a scroll of revivify (witch the game gives you the poison for the task as well), and on the note of that the wizard gale apparently has a scroll of resurrection so just crush his skull into nothing then use the scroll of resurrection and he should be cured.

also, and this is a little one, the game robs you of a history check on Lae'zel to go: ok shes a githtanki, so that means she is lead by a crazy lich queen who is friends with tiamat the evil dragon goddess that wants to destroy out planet so I should really be attacking her RIGHT NOW.

so overall so far this dev has messed up basic simple 5e rules and messed up basic lore anyone can look up on goggle, this game needs should be A. declared non canon B. canceled and put in the hands of a more competent dev (witch I know they won't because they have pride in there work and they just want money) or C. scrapped and rebuild from the ground up with wizards of the cost taking a more direct hand in the development

they should also offer refunds to those who actually play D&D and get cringe super hard when playing the game

[Coldhands]

This is a lot of arguing over the DM making up some unique conditions and restrictions for the sake of their story. You know, something D&D has always encouraged and been designed around.
If players could fix the central issue the story so far revolves around super easily, it'd be a pretty boring game.

[ProxyJames]

Alealexi eredeti hozzászólása:

ProxyJames eredeti hozzászólása:

1. If they were effected by any type of magic they would have been destroyed on the spot and been considered abominations, hell if they showed even the slightest hint of being magic they would have been destroyed, furthermore shadowfel magic KILLS undead it doesn't make them.

And yet if you look at the in game cinematic you can see there was in fighting between the illithids. Almost if one tried to stop & destroy somethings and was killed by another. It is taboo for illithids to use magic, but it doesn't mean that some are not willing to use it. Much in the case of the Mozgriken is proof that some will use shadowfell magic. In the ship we find a device that is able to transform someone into an illithid instantly without waiting 7 days. This is shown in the trailer for BG3. There is also the fact that there was a pod that was surrounded by magic which is out of place in a mind flayer ship. Maybe some are getting desperate to bring back their empire that they made a deal with I don't know...maybe the dead three....

Fighting among illithid, is common place, that's how they ascend in rank, by killing the one higher rank than the other growing in power witch each kill.
But let's say one of them was committing a taboo and madd tadpoles enhance by magic, that magic would still not effect the vampire curse so the sunlight would still kill him.
Furthermore my whole point is that the devs don't know the lore and messed up.
Warding like the one on the pod is fairly high level, a mind flayer would have to study for a very long time to be able to do that, and as I said they have a hive mind so they would no be able to keep it a secret and be killed near moments after they cast there first spell, and the mind flayer in all the cinematics is very high rank so if it was them the elder brain would have just labotmazed it.
Regardless on how you spin it, it doesn't make sense

[ProxyJames]

Coldhands eredeti hozzászólása:

This is a lot of arguing over the DM making up some unique conditions and restrictions for the sake of their story. You know, something D&D has always encouraged and been designed around.
If players could fix the central issue the story so far revolves around super easily, it'd be a pretty boring game.

Making your own setting and rules for that setting is fine.
But balders gate has pre existing source material witch ritch detailed lore.
By messing the lore and basic rules they ♥♥♥♥♥♥ up alot with the game and caused themselves alot of bugs, coding a simple d20 system would be...well simple, hell obsidian made KoTOR 2 in 14 months and that's a turn based d20 system, the devs even have a pre existing engine from divinity orginal sin 2, then again that too is a unbalanced buggy mess.
That's not to say 5e is not perfectly balanced but it does have a really nice balance scale, some things are really strong early level like tempest clerics being able to max out thunderwave damage at level 2, or circle of the moon druids using bear wild shape with being able to make two attacks for 2d6+5 each, but it falls off later on, this is because you can die in one hit at level 1 and 2, hell 10 goblins with 7 hp each at level 1 is super deadly.
Not to mention later on creatures with legendary actions will kick your ass super hard...witch is why I play super fast and loose at my table lol I'm a "you can try" DM...I'm also a "screw it, you do the thing" kind of guy because I don't like my players to die...come close to death and give them a panic attack yes but not die lol

[Alealexi]

ProxyJames eredeti hozzászólása:

Alealexi eredeti hozzászólása:

And yet if you look at the in game cinematic you can see there was in fighting between the illithids. Almost if one tried to stop & destroy somethings and was killed by another. It is taboo for illithids to use magic, but it doesn't mean that some are not willing to use it. Much in the case of the Mozgriken is proof that some will use shadowfell magic. In the ship we find a device that is able to transform someone into an illithid instantly without waiting 7 days. This is shown in the trailer for BG3. There is also the fact that there was a pod that was surrounded by magic which is out of place in a mind flayer ship. Maybe some are getting desperate to bring back their empire that they made a deal with I don't know...maybe the dead three....

Fighting among illithid, is common place, that's how they ascend in rank, by killing the one higher rank than the other growing in power witch each kill.
But let's say one of them was committing a taboo and madd tadpoles enhance by magic, that magic would still not effect the vampire curse so the sunlight would still kill him.
Furthermore my whole point is that the devs don't know the lore and messed up.
Warding like the one on the pod is fairly high level, a mind flayer would have to study for a very long time to be able to do that, and as I said they have a hive mind so they would no be able to keep it a secret and be killed near moments after they cast there first spell, and the mind flayer in all the cinematics is very high rank so if it was them the elder brain would have just labotmazed it.
Regardless on how you spin it, it doesn't make sense

Fine you do you. Apperantly magic can't make a vampire spawn immune to sun light in an imaginary world because it can't possibly do that. If you want to complain call WotC because only you are right. If only said DM could accept that getting rid of a tadpole infection is no easy task because established lore said so. Jeez you sound like the guys that want a continuation of the bhaalspawn story knowing the established lore says they are all dead and not accepting that.

[ProxyJames]

Alealexi eredeti hozzászólása:

ProxyJames eredeti hozzászólása:

Fighting among illithid, is common place, that's how they ascend in rank, by killing the one higher rank than the other growing in power witch each kill.
But let's say one of them was committing a taboo and madd tadpoles enhance by magic, that magic would still not effect the vampire curse so the sunlight would still kill him.
Furthermore my whole point is that the devs don't know the lore and messed up.
Warding like the one on the pod is fairly high level, a mind flayer would have to study for a very long time to be able to do that, and as I said they have a hive mind so they would no be able to keep it a secret and be killed near moments after they cast there first spell, and the mind flayer in all the cinematics is very high rank so if it was them the elder brain would have just labotmazed it.
Regardless on how you spin it, it doesn't make sense

Fine you do you. Apperantly magic can't make a vampire spawn immune to sun light in an imaginary world because it can't possibly do that. If you want to complain call WotC because only you are right. If only said DM could accept that getting rid of a tadpole infection is no easy task because established lore said so. Jeez you sound like the guys that want a continuation of the bhaalspawn story knowing the established lore says they are all dead and not accepting that.

I mean there are rules to magic in D&D and the vampire curse is extremely powerful. If strad, a magic vampire lord who took a chunk of land and teleported it off a planet to make his own personal plan of existence cant use that same magic power to make himself immune to sunlight then why would a mind flayer who bearly knows magic be able too?
And like I said earlier they kind of have a hive mind going, the second you think "ima do magic" that's it, you are out, no one likes you and you are exiled or killed. Y your friends, want to block your thoughts? Nope that's sus, show us your thoughts nerd, magic thats stupid get put now.
So to sum up: only something like a Mind flayer lich (yes they are a thing and are a common occurrence to mind flayers who study magic but when they are not being murdered by other mind flayers or githyakie they are being hunted down by something called a marut, they are big nigh unstoppable terminator robot madd by gods and they hate lichs) could cast a enchantment that powerful and maybe somewhere that will happen but not on the mind flayers more treasured and rare artifact of there ships, and even then I don't see the magic altering the vampire curse because you can have several enchantments or curses going at once.

[asagi]

I have a huge issue with the druid grove as well. It makes zero sense to the story. None of the druids are defending the gates. They are leaving it up to the very people they want to kick out. Only 5 of them are casting the ritual and if they were so fearful of the goblins, wouldn't they be manning their defenses while the ritual is being cast?

I mean, you have the grove healer in a cave, you have members turning themselves into bears, other animals to defend, and the grove leader is more concerned with punishing a child over a theft, why the hell are they letting untrained warriors man the gates when if they get overun, the ritual would be f%^&ed.

[ProxyJames]

I just thought of some that kind of says alot about astarion either A. Not actually being a vampire or B. Confirms devs messed up the rules and the lore
That is that vampire spawn are classified as undead, this means that healing from potions of healing and magic like cure wounds has no effect on him and spells like Revivify wont bring him back as he has been dead for way more than a minute and Resurrection stats in its text that it does not work on undead
So if its point A he only thinks hes a vampire...hes is such a dumb edge lord and that is a dumb plot point if B then the devs are stupid

[Jack Hawklight]

So.... In a high fantasy world with all kinds of impossible things in it, you assume that everything has to work a certain way? Even if it is governed by a set of rules as this one is, because it is fantasy and anything is possible, there may be unique deviations from what normal rules are. Or those rules might be subject to change at any time (the multiple additions, supplementary texts).

Trying to logic through a fantasy world, when we have less than a third of the story so far and everything is meant to be mysterious, is just a useless endeavour.

[ProxyJames]

funniesthobo eredeti hozzászólása:

So.... In a high fantasy world with all kinds of impossible things in it, you assume that everything has to work a certain way? Even if it is governed by a set of rules as this one is, because it is fantasy and anything is possible, there may be unique deviations from what normal rules are. Or those rules might be subject to change at any time (the multiple additions, supplementary texts).

Trying to logic through a fantasy world, when we have less than a third of the story so far and everything is meant to be mysterious, is just a useless endeavour.

when the reason for these things happening is "don't look at it too hard" that boils down to bad writing and plot. saying "don't look at it too hard" is the worst
there already a bunch of crazy ♥♥♥♥ in D&D, you know there is a illithid dragon!?
there are already a bunch of lore and rules for vampires and illithids and what the game did makes no sense
and like I said earlier there is no way he is a vampire because you can heal him and revive him and that boils down to him being a dumb edge lord witch is bad writing and take away anything cool about him because hes just randomly biting people in the night (witch is bad writing) OR really bad writing screwing up the lore and rules of the game
and as I said the illithid tadpoles being magic also makes 0 sense lore wise, a mind flayer that high ranked up would have never even though about touching magic or he would have been exiled long ago because of the fact they share thoughts, the only way it MAYBE works if they the mind flayer mind controlled a powerful wizard somehow and got them to do it witch I doubt because if your that strong of a wizard mind flayers are not really a threat because of your awesome magic (another reason they hate magic users) and on top of that, no matter what was done to that tadpole, it still needs to live in a healthy living brain to thrive, a vampire spawn brain is not a living brain, and yes Vampiric illithids ARE a thing but they are not made from a tadpole going into a vampire, they are made when a vampire infects a mind flayer with the curse, this also makes the mind flayer dumb as hell because they still need brains AND they need blood so it puts them in a feral state.

Most other people I know don't agree with whats going on in that druids grove either, druids are peaceful most of the time but they will lay down the fury of nature if the grove is attacked and they will defend themselfs, with that many druids in one place not many would mess with them, more so if they have a archdruid, archdruids are respected by many other spellcasters because of there skill, most spellcasters have to use magic incantations and hand symbols to cast even simple spells, archdruids can cast spells without saying a word or moving a finger making there spells impossible to counter, not to mention the sheer power of there spells, even for players they get a impressive set of spells to work with, some of the most powerful in the game so why would a large group of them even be phased by a group of goblins? kicking the people out makes sense because they worship Silvanus and hes kind of a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but on THAT note the druids that worship him SHOULD be eager to kill all the goblins and not hide from him because of his ideology but also going off THAT it doesn't make much sense that some of the followers are dwarfs and half elfs. dwarfs have a few nature gods and before anyone says that there leader chick is a full elf, shes not. Elfs used to be immortal shapeshifters till lolth and her hot topic gang ruined that and they had to pick permanent forms but there "father" (I say that loosely because they are still a shapeshifter and swaps gender when they feel like it) reincarnates them when they die giving back there old memories and the elf gods are literally there brothers and sisters so why would a elf follow a human god other than the fact they are half elfs and mostly hang out with humans.

A plot is good when you can't find any plot holes and when you do find a plot hole there is a logical in world explanation for it, however every time I look at this polt I find another hole in it with no logic behind it so it has bad writing, not lore friendly and the game mechanics and rules have been butchered.

[Jack Hawklight]

ProxyJames eredeti hozzászólása:

funniesthobo eredeti hozzászólása:

So.... In a high fantasy world with all kinds of impossible things in it, you assume that everything has to work a certain way? Even if it is governed by a set of rules as this one is, because it is fantasy and anything is possible, there may be unique deviations from what normal rules are. Or those rules might be subject to change at any time (the multiple additions, supplementary texts).

Trying to logic through a fantasy world, when we have less than a third of the story so far and everything is meant to be mysterious, is just a useless endeavour.

when the reason for these things happening is "don't look at it too hard" that boils down to bad writing and plot. saying "don't look at it too hard" is the worst
there already a bunch of crazy ♥♥♥♥ in D&D, you know there is a illithid dragon!?
there are already a bunch of lore and rules for vampires and illithids and what the game did makes no sense
and like I said earlier there is no way he is a vampire because you can heal him and revive him and that boils down to him being a dumb edge lord witch is bad writing and take away anything cool about him because hes just randomly biting people in the night (witch is bad writing) OR really bad writing screwing up the lore and rules of the game
and as I said the illithid tadpoles being magic also makes 0 sense lore wise, a mind flayer that high ranked up would have never even though about touching magic or he would have been exiled long ago because of the fact they share thoughts, the only way it MAYBE works if they the mind flayer mind controlled a powerful wizard somehow and got them to do it witch I doubt because if your that strong of a wizard mind flayers are not really a threat because of your awesome magic (another reason they hate magic users) and on top of that, no matter what was done to that tadpole, it still needs to live in a healthy living brain to thrive, a vampire spawn brain is not a living brain, and yes Vampiric illithids ARE a thing but they are not made from a tadpole going into a vampire, they are made when a vampire infects a mind flayer with the curse, this also makes the mind flayer dumb as hell because they still need brains AND they need blood so it puts them in a feral state.

Most other people I know don't agree with whats going on in that druids grove either, druids are peaceful most of the time but they will lay down the fury of nature if the grove is attacked and they will defend themselfs, with that many druids in one place not many would mess with them, more so if they have a archdruid, archdruids are respected by many other spellcasters because of there skill, most spellcasters have to use magic incantations and hand symbols to cast even simple spells, archdruids can cast spells without saying a word or moving a finger making there spells impossible to counter, not to mention the sheer power of there spells, even for players they get a impressive set of spells to work with, some of the most powerful in the game so why would a large group of them even be phased by a group of goblins? kicking the people out makes sense because they worship Silvanus and hes kind of a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ but on THAT note the druids that worship him SHOULD be eager to kill all the goblins and not hide from him because of his ideology but also going off THAT it doesn't make much sense that some of the followers are dwarfs and half elfs. dwarfs have a few nature gods and before anyone says that there leader chick is a full elf, shes not. Elfs used to be immortal shapeshifters till lolth and her hot topic gang ruined that and they had to pick permanent forms but there "father" (I say that loosely because they are still a shapeshifter and swaps gender when they feel like it) reincarnates them when they die giving back there old memories and the elf gods are literally there brothers and sisters so why would a elf follow a human god other than the fact they are half elfs and mostly hang out with humans.

A plot is good when you can't find any plot holes and when you do find a plot hole there is a logical in world explanation for it, however every time I look at this polt I find another hole in it with no logic behind it so it has bad writing, not lore friendly and the game mechanics and rules have been butchered.

Yeah, I got all that the first time you said it but thanks for the wall of text lol. Doesn't change what I said at all.

Edit: Still only have less than a third of the whole story or unravelling the mystery of why things are happening the way they are.

[ProxyJames]

no what you said boils down to "don't look at it too hard" witch is a excuse for bad writing and gameplay witch this game has both of

[Coldhands]

ProxyJames eredeti hozzászólása:

Coldhands eredeti hozzászólása:

This is a lot of arguing over the DM making up some unique conditions and restrictions for the sake of their story. You know, something D&D has always encouraged and been designed around.
If players could fix the central issue the story so far revolves around super easily, it'd be a pretty boring game.

Making your own setting and rules for that setting is fine.
But balders gate has pre existing source material witch ritch detailed lore.

So does every D&D setting, but that's never meant a DM can't alter stuff to fit the story they want to tell.
If the story in BG3 ends up not making sense based on the rules it lays out itself, then it'll be a bad story.

[ProxyJames]

Coldhands eredeti hozzászólása:

ProxyJames eredeti hozzászólása:

Making your own setting and rules for that setting is fine.
But balders gate has pre existing source material witch ritch detailed lore.

So does every D&D setting, but that's never meant a DM can't alter stuff to fit the story they want to tell.
If the story in BG3 ends up not making sense based on the rules it lays out itself, then it'll be a bad story.

true DM can alter things but for official content like this it has to abide by the ruleset of the world its set in, I do belive I already addressed the fact this game reeks of a edgy 13 year old homebrewing something, maybe some new players will be able to enjoy it but vets will not and any of thoes new players that say: ok I am going to get into D&D, who then play D&D will get butt hurt then trash talk the game because the devs couldn't get the simple easy basic rules right, any way you want to try to spin it it boils down to the devs being incompetent and the game being bad

[Coldhands]

^Obviously "official content like this" does NOT have to abide by the ruleset of the world its set in, because BG3 exists and has made up some new details of how the strange and fantastical elements of the FR work in its story.

[ProxyJames]

So now you point is "it is because it is, forget the fact I k ow nothing about the world of toril and its lore and how things works in it"
You just keep making your points more and more invalid.