Expertise for Rogues?

[mahe4]

I guess it's not implemented yet, but it is basically the main reason to play as rogue.
Also it would be a good idea, to make hide an action instead of a bonus action. it's also one of the main features for 2nd level rogue, to be able to do that as bonus action, together with disengage (and also jump, because why not)

[WlfVenom]

Ya my Rogue got to level 2 and all they got for cunning action was "dash". "Cunning Action" in 5e, which BG3 is supposed to be based on, allows the Rogue to Dash, Disengage, or Hide as a bonus action so not sure what Larian is thinking.

Also having sneak attack as an action is kinda dumb. It should just be automatic if an ally is within a certain distance of the enemy (5 ft as per D&D5e rules)

[mahe4]

Originally posted by WlfVenom:

Ya my Rogue got to level 2 and all they got for cunning action was "dash". "Cunning Action" in 5e, which BG3 is supposed to be based on, allows the Rogue to Dash, Disengage, or Hide as a bonus action so not sure what Larian is thinking.

Also having sneak attack as an action is kinda dumb. It should just be automatic if an ally is within a certain distance of the enemy (5 ft as per D&D5e rules)

totally agree with the sneak attack thingy. not only is it unintuitive to use, it also obfuscates, when sneak attack is actually possible, because you could think, that you could always use it, if it's an ability button.

[WlfVenom]

Ya. They say it uses the 5e rule set but then they fail to follow the 5e rules for certain skills and abilities and it is just weird and jarring.

[Saint]

Originally posted by WlfVenom:

Ya. They say it uses the 5e rule set but then they fail to follow the 5e rules for certain skills and abilities and it is just weird and jarring.

It's early access, they're likely working on balancing hiding as a bonus action and the like.
As for why sneak attack is a separate button: Multiple attacks.

In D&D 5e you can take the attack action with your main-hand dagger, hit, and choose not to sneak attack. Then, you can use your Bonus Action to make a second attack with your offhand weapon, this time activating your sneak attack. Making it a separate button is hopefully their early access solution to this problem.

[Jeidregel]

I play primarily as a ranged rogue, and I agree with the hide skill needing to wait to be a bonus/cunning action. I also can't tell if the damage from a sneak attack is being dealt right. My starting dice roll with a sneak attacks would be (1d6 +3) + 1d6, but I almost only ever get 2+1. I guess it's possible that something is reducing the damage, but with no battle log I can't tell if it's intended or a bug.

[Dakan]

Originally posted by Jeidregel:

I play primarily as a ranged rogue, and I agree with the hide skill needing to wait to be a bonus/cunning action. I also can't tell if the damage from a sneak attack is being dealt right. My starting dice roll with a sneak attacks would be (1d6 +3) + 1d6, but I almost only ever get 2+1. I guess it's possible that something is reducing the damage, but with no battle log I can't tell if it's intended or a bug.

Yeah I stopped using the rogue because I couldn't tell if sneak attack was working most of the time. Also, it sucks that you can't trigger sneak attack with an offhand weapon.

[mahe4]

Originally posted by Jeidregel:

I play primarily as a ranged rogue, and I agree with the hide skill needing to wait to be a bonus/cunning action. I also can't tell if the damage from a sneak attack is being dealt right. My starting dice roll with a sneak attacks would be (1d6 +3) + 1d6, but I almost only ever get 2+1. I guess it's possible that something is reducing the damage, but with no battle log I can't tell if it's intended or a bug.

the weird thing is, that they show the sneak attack damage as seperate attack, in the combat log.
and also, the imps have resistance to non-magical physical damage.
i also wondered why i made nearly no damage against them.

[mahe4]

Originally posted by Saint Karsus:

Originally posted by WlfVenom:

Ya. They say it uses the 5e rule set but then they fail to follow the 5e rules for certain skills and abilities and it is just weird and jarring.

It's early access, they're likely working on balancing hiding as a bonus action and the like.
As for why sneak attack is a separate button: Multiple attacks.

In D&D 5e you can take the attack action with your main-hand dagger, hit, and choose not to sneak attack. Then, you can use your Bonus Action to make a second attack with your offhand weapon, this time activating your sneak attack. Making it a separate button is hopefully their early access solution to this problem.

yeah how important is that choice really?
how often do you attack an enemy and choose not to sneak attack?
the other thing is, that now the rogue is also not sneak attacking on attacks of opportunity.
and that makes a huge difference, as much as the AI is walking around.

[kebab-case]

Originally posted by WlfVenom:

Ya my Rogue got to level 2 and all they got for cunning action was "dash". "Cunning Action" in 5e, which BG3 is supposed to be based on, allows the Rogue to Dash, Disengage, or Hide as a bonus action so not sure what Larian is thinking.

Also having sneak attack as an action is kinda dumb. It should just be automatic if an ally is within a certain distance of the enemy (5 ft as per D&D5e rules)

Totally right.

[dolby]

+1

[Hobocop]

Sneak Attack not being automatic kinda makes sense since you only get it once per turn. Would be a shame to waste all those extra dice on a target with 1HP if you're using a Potion of Speed, or say, have access to Extra Attack through multi-classing later.

[WlfVenom]

Fine, I can somewhat accept that. Tho it is still broken as I have used sneak attack when I really shouldn't be able to and it has worked. Namely when standing out in the open with none of my allies near the enemy I am "sneak" attacking in full view of the enemy I am aiming for and with zero advantage...

So it still needs some work

[Cheb]

+1 the lack of expertise will ruin rogues and bards who want to primarily become skill focusers

[kyson darkwolf]

Also you can choose to sneak attack after your attack and if you miss with your main hand you can try with your off hand to see if you get it then. So it's fine that you get to select it but it should be an option after you hit as it is in 5e

[mahe4]

Originally posted by Hobocop:

Sneak Attack not being automatic kinda makes sense since you only get it once per turn. Would be a shame to waste all those extra dice on a target with 1HP if you're using a Potion of Speed, or say, have access to Extra Attack through multi-classing later.

but that is the thing. you can sneak attack once per *turn*.
that means you could sneak attack on your turn and then sneak attack on somebody elses turn with an attack of opportunity.
and since enemies walk around like crazy, that would make a huge difference.