Abusing the camp system

[Holy Athena]

Note: I want to point this out, as it seems people are confused. When you click the button to "Camp" you're not camping in that location. You're fast traveling back to your permenant camp in the woods. A safe haven. This is why you're not attacked like in other games like Pathfinder: Kingmaker.

"Quick Rest" However is resting in that area.

----------------------------------


This is a huge problem I had in Divinity, and my honest to goodness only real complaint about BG3.. The camp abuse is real...

After every battle I can just yolo to camp, and no problems.. You don't need heals, you don't need to plan for anything, hell you barely need healers, except for some basic heals to get through some more difficult fights, but then, yolo back to camp after every single battle.. gg...
--------------------

It's honestly the 1 system that really needs fixing and refining, it takes away both immersion, and game-play...

----------

Sure for those of you in the "well duuuuhhh don't abuse it then!" crowd.. that's not the point.. .

To give a good example, Pathfinder: Kingmaker also has a camping system, but I need camping supplies and my people need to be tired enough to want to camp for me to do it. There are mechanics in place engaging me with the mechanic, and making it immersive, and "realistic".

There simply isn't any of that in this game. I was really hoping with this being Baldurs Gate, that they would of fixed this situation.

---------------

Edit:

Changing my suggestion somewhat, after the discussion in the thread.


Camping is like fast traveling to the camp location, since you're always in the same area when caming. which is fine, It's like Dragon Age Origins with the permenant camp, but I'd like to see that only possible from outside caves and other dangerous area's. "Quick rest" option which is there now should be the go to "rest and healing" in unsafe locations. Its quick, no threat, and lets you move on, but can only do it once or twice before you have to go back to camp, and if your party ist aking too much damage or needs to retreat, then they have to exit the cave, or unsafe area, and fast travel to camp.

This leads to an immersive situation where you may need to fall back from your expedition, but you could also just "stop to take a breather" with the quick rest option. (Which is mostly useless at the moment).

[Malaficus Shaikan]

While i agree it is abuseable and need fixing.
Without it wizard are worthless.
There weak enough as it is and without the ability to regain spells between fights there outright worthless.

[ajleuer]

No, absolutely not. Especially not with the way this game (far too liberally) hits your party with environmental damage, damage that without the party camp you'd have no other choice but to blow a health potion on.

Actually, what would make me happy (and would solve your problem as well, though for all I know you might hate it even more) would be automatically regenerating health outside of combat,
à la Dragon Age II.

[Holy Athena]

Originally posted by ajleuer:

No, absolutely not. Especially not with the way this game (far too liberally) hits your party with environmental damage, damage that without the party camp you'd have no other choice but to blow a health potion on.

Actually, what would make me happy (and would solve your problem as well, though for all I know you might hate it even more) would be automatically regenerating health outside of combat,
à la Dragon Age II.

I've not yet come across anything environmental that I couldn't get rid of with magic..

Vines? Burn them.. for example.

Usually water, fire, or even poison will get rid of anything, just gotta use your brain. Games like DA II have got gamers too used to not having to think. Don't have a mage? Flasks will do the trick as well, or a scroll.

Originally posted by Malaficus Shaikan:

While i agree it is abuseable and need fixing.
Without it wizard are worthless.
There weak enough as it is and without the ability to regain spells between fights there outright worthless.

I never said to remove it completely. I'm capable of fighting if I really need too for extended periods even with mages.. It just takes planning, coordination with the team, and using some gold on items.. It's really not difficult at all... Unless you're brainlessly going through the game without thinking.

[Salt Mage]

Originally posted by Malaficus Shaikan:

While i agree it is abuseable and need fixing.
Without it wizard are worthless.
There weak enough as it is and without the ability to regain spells between fights there outright worthless.

Strongly disagree that Wizards are useless.
Cantrips in BG3 are exceedingly overpowered with Fire Bolt lighting the ground (and thus enemies) on fire for extra fire damage and Ray of Frost making ice that can instantly prone an enemy.
Honestly the only spells I've used with Gale so far are Grease, Sleep, and Mage Armor.

[Holy Athena]

Originally posted by Salt Mage:

Originally posted by Malaficus Shaikan:

While i agree it is abuseable and need fixing.
Without it wizard are worthless.
There weak enough as it is and without the ability to regain spells between fights there outright worthless.

Strongly disagree that Wizards are useless.
Cantrips in BG3 are exceedingly overpowered with Fire Bolt lighting the ground (and thus enemies) on fire for extra fire damage and Ray of Frost making ice that can instantly prone an enemy.
Honestly the only spells I've used with Gale so far are Grease, Sleep, and Mage Armor.

Yup, mages are pretty OP if you're not blindly going through the game and shutting your brain off.

Tons of environmental stuff to use and lure enemies into as well like oil barrels, etc... just drag the enemies near the barrels, and cast 1 fire spell doesn't even need to be a strong one, and the barrels will 1 shot everything, and if not it'll burn them and make it easy to clean up with ranged weapons and spells.

and only 1 spell required to take out 5+ enemies.

[Salt Mage]

Originally posted by Holy Athena:

Originally posted by Salt Mage:

Strongly disagree that Wizards are useless.
Cantrips in BG3 are exceedingly overpowered with Fire Bolt lighting the ground (and thus enemies) on fire for extra fire damage and Ray of Frost making ice that can instantly prone an enemy.
Honestly the only spells I've used with Gale so far are Grease, Sleep, and Mage Armor.

Yup, mages are pretty OP if you're not blindly going through the game and shutting your brain off.

Tons of environmental stuff to use and lure enemies into as well like oil barrels, etc... just drag the enemies near the barrels, and cast 1 fire spell doesn't even need to be a strong one, and the barrels will 1 shot everything, and if not it'll burn them and make it easy to clean up with ranged weapons and spells.

and only 1 spell required to take out 5+ enemies.

Don't even have to lure them to the barrel, use Mage Hand to throw it (because it can in BG3 for some reason) and it'll blow up on them from a distance.

[Holy Athena]

Originally posted by Salt Mage:

Originally posted by Holy Athena:

Yup, mages are pretty OP if you're not blindly going through the game and shutting your brain off.

Tons of environmental stuff to use and lure enemies into as well like oil barrels, etc... just drag the enemies near the barrels, and cast 1 fire spell doesn't even need to be a strong one, and the barrels will 1 shot everything, and if not it'll burn them and make it easy to clean up with ranged weapons and spells.

and only 1 spell required to take out 5+ enemies.

Don't even have to lure them to the barrel, use Mage Hand to throw it (because it can in BG3 for some reason) and it'll blow up on them from a distance.

It explodes without fire? I thought the oil barrels needed fire to ignite it...

Though I do love my vase throwing Rogue when a wall of fire stops him from crossing.. just pick up crates, and vases and chuck em XD Who needs ranged weapons? (That being said, throwing items actually could use a nerf.. its more OP than ranged weapons since its 100% accurate, almost always knocks them down, and does stupid high damage)

[Malaficus Shaikan]

Originally posted by Salt Mage:

Originally posted by Malaficus Shaikan:

While i agree it is abuseable and need fixing.
Without it wizard are worthless.
There weak enough as it is and without the ability to regain spells between fights there outright worthless.

Strongly disagree that Wizards are useless.
Cantrips in BG3 are exceedingly overpowered with Fire Bolt lighting the ground (and thus enemies) on fire for extra fire damage and Ray of Frost making ice that can instantly prone an enemy.
Honestly the only spells I've used with Gale so far are Grease, Sleep, and Mage Armor.

Probley a me issu.
I just cant wrap my head around the class.
I try and try and try but all i see is spell slots wasted on missed attacks, way to short crowd control and my wizard dying the moment something hits it.

Druid and cleric are fine.
But wizards.
They just seem to do too little for to high of a cost.

[mahe4]

Originally posted by Malaficus Shaikan:

Originally posted by Salt Mage:

Strongly disagree that Wizards are useless.
Cantrips in BG3 are exceedingly overpowered with Fire Bolt lighting the ground (and thus enemies) on fire for extra fire damage and Ray of Frost making ice that can instantly prone an enemy.
Honestly the only spells I've used with Gale so far are Grease, Sleep, and Mage Armor.

Probley a me issu.
I just cant wrap my head around the class.
I try and try and try but all i see is spell slots wasted on missed attacks, way to short crowd control and my wizard dying the moment something hits it.

Druid and cleric are fine.
But wizards.
They just seem to do too little for to high of a cost.

spell choice is king for wizards, that is true. it is definitly not a beginner class.
and the most important lvl1 spell is still missing, yet. Shield.
with shield and mage armor, a wizard will drop a lot less.
and top that off with githyanki as race, to get medium armor proficiency, and you can drop mage armor.

[Sniperfox47]

Originally posted by Holy Athena:

Originally posted by Salt Mage:

Strongly disagree that Wizards are useless.
Cantrips in BG3 are exceedingly overpowered with Fire Bolt lighting the ground (and thus enemies) on fire for extra fire damage and Ray of Frost making ice that can instantly prone an enemy.
Honestly the only spells I've used with Gale so far are Grease, Sleep, and Mage Armor.

Yup, mages are pretty OP if you're not blindly going through the game and shutting your brain off.

Tons of environmental stuff to use and lure enemies into as well like oil barrels, etc... just drag the enemies near the barrels, and cast 1 fire spell doesn't even need to be a strong one, and the barrels will 1 shot everything, and if not it'll burn them and make it easy to clean up with ranged weapons and spells.

and only 1 spell required to take out 5+ enemies.

They don't have the option for the schools of wizard that actually benefit those though. I can't play a conjuration or Transmuation wizard, Im stuck with Evocation or Abjuration. So sure I could take those spells but they wouldn't Synergize with my subclass at all... Had really wanted to build a dual-weilder gish but without feats for Dual Wield not really sure what I'm supposed to do there >.> I guess I could reroll as an Eldritch Knight, but without Booming Blade and Green Flame Blade that seems pretty... underwhelming...

[dolby]

yeah nerf Camp heal to the ground... completely agree and about aoe or whatever reason well think before you do ... The one thing you shouldn't copy from BG 2 you did why is beyond me ... upside down world..

[Sniperfox47]

I mean pretty much every 5e campaign I've been part of this is what happens too. Adventure through like 5 rooms in a dungeon. Short rest and spend 2/3 of your hit dice healing. Go through like 3 more rooms. Act exhausted and beg your DM for a long rest because you've spent all your resources. Despite the fact your characters just woke up and hour and 25 minutes earlier.

[dolby]

Originally posted by Sniperfox47:

I mean pretty much every 5e campaign I've been part of this is what happens too. Adventure through like 5 rooms in a dungeon. Short rest and spend 2/3 of your hit dice healing. Go through like 3 more rooms. Act exhausted and beg your DM for a long rest because you've spent all your resources. Despite the fact your characters just woke up and hour and 25 minutes earlier.

well this DM(larian) needs to say no MORE at least for anything above easy difficulty. Classic difficulty is a joke as it is..

[Warbird]

Camps are no more different than using the Bedrolls in DOS 2 after every fights and for all i know, the game was well received by most players.

The problem with D&D in general is that player characters are so totally weak during the first few levels and they get killed or badly injured with a single swing of sword and you kind of lack healing items.

In Baldur's Gate 1, i remember resting my main chars and Imoen after every single fight done against 1-2 kobolds or gibberlings. When you are a wizard with 5 HP, you want to make sure you are fully healed before any fight.

And of course, spellcasters need to recover their spells.

And no, it is not breaking immersion. It makes perfect sense that a party of adventurers rest and take care of injuries after a battle that went sour.

[abaoabao2010]

Being able to tackle each fight rested is a must for me.

Can you imagine having to reload a game to 5 hours ago because 3 fights ago you did something you had no idea would spell your doom down the line? And no, not having information of that UNTIL you get stuck might be normal for real life, but good D&D gamemasters avoid that. They literally retcon whatever they planned so the game can continue.

A fixed game with fixed terrain decided beforehand cannot actively do that, so locking camp behind some kind of resource or whatever will break the game for people not used to roguelike games.