Astarion: too stupid to live?

[Mander]

TLDR: what was your in-game reason for letting Astarion live when he tried to bite you?

Looong post:

As of now, I believe Astarion’s characterization is the worst among all of our companions. The suspension of disbelief was already crippled on his first introduction: “I’m a magistrate in the city…” saith the not so clever vampire spawn after trying to knife us, showing us how good he is with a blade…
Yeah, Astarion, the infamous magistrate with proficiency in sleight of hand… SUUURE you’re a magistrate. I’ll even believe you’re the batman of Baldur’s Gate.
I know it wasn’t the intention of the writing team, but Astarion came out as an arrogant fool that think us too dumb to see through his lies (both from a metagaming standpoint, which is acceptable, but also from characterization, which is less so). AND THEN, the imbecile not only tries to feed on us, but he is also so poor of a predator that he wakes us up, AND he has the naivete to say “It’s not what it looks like, I swear!”
Everyone (bar those who look at Astarion and think, “I can fix him”) should stake him right then and there.
I mean… we’re survivors struggling together, many with enormous secrets (Shadowheart, Gale, Wyll…), but each more o less ready to help the team.
And then comes Astarion in the night, vampire unveiled, who tries to nibble on people who are ready to murderize everything in their path AFTER escaping the crash of a Nautiloid. Astarion, my man… wtf? Just say you need blood and I’ll give you some absolute cultists to dine on, just as we’re providing for Gale. It’s not so hard.
“But you can trust me!”
Sure. Come here, you bimbo vampire: I’ve just the right wood for you.
And yes: I’m saddened to have staked him, but only because the rest of the team is pretty content to have me perform a Van Helsing on Astarion. They couldn’t care less about him…

None the less, I’m really struggling in finding any justification so early in-game for letting someone live after trying to open me like a cold one, especially from a role-playing standpoint.
Sympathy for Astarion can exist and grow, sure (even if his “I hate you, vampire dad” act is a little cringy in some dialogue), but only if we accept to act as dumbasses in our early deals with him.
And normally, dumbasses do not survive the kind of prologues we’re subjected to…
So yeah… I’m really trying to find a reason to not stake Astarion. And I’m failing. And I’m sorry for that.

[⇧⇨⇩⇩⇩]

Origineel geplaatst door Boon: Safeword:

Origineel geplaatst door morrganstain:

Yea its called fasting. Its not that hard. Might seem unimaginable for a priviliged fatso whos never missed a meal in their life I guess. XD

Yes, and after fasting you're going to be HUNGRY. You don't want to just take a nibble on something and then be told that's all you get. I'm not interested in another edgelord pretending they don't understand human needs and sensations in order to miss the point entirely.

If you have some willpower its not hard at all. In fact the body kind of adjusts to it after a while. Ive done three day fastings and the hardest day is the first. The body is just used to getting stuff all the time. And no, eating just something small after 24h fasting is also not some unmanagable task. Done that too. You just adjust your expectations and isntead of getting upset thats all you get to eat you feel anticipation and thankfullnes that you get to eat this tasty little thing.

[Mander]

Origineel geplaatst door morrganstain:

Origineel geplaatst door Boon: Safeword:

Yes, and after fasting you're going to be HUNGRY. You don't want to just take a nibble on something and then be told that's all you get. I'm not interested in another edgelord pretending they don't understand human needs and sensations in order to miss the point entirely.

If you have some willpower its not hard at all. In fact the body kind of adjusts to it after a while. Ive done three day fastings and the hardest day is the first. The body is just used to getting stuff all the time. And no, eating just something small after 24h fasting is also not some unmanagable task. Done that too. You just adjust your expectations and isntead of getting upset thats all you get to eat you feel anticipation and thankfullnes that you get to eat this tasty little thing.

Let's stop with this discussion here guys.
Outside the scope of the thread.

[⇧⇨⇩⇩⇩]

Origineel geplaatst door Mander:

Origineel geplaatst door morrganstain:

If you have some willpower its not hard at all. In fact the body kind of adjusts to it after a while. Ive done three day fastings and the hardest day is the first. The body is just used to getting stuff all the time. And no, eating just something small after 24h fasting is also not some unmanagable task. Done that too. You just adjust your expectations and isntead of getting upset thats all you get to eat you feel anticipation and thankfullnes that you get to eat this tasty little thing.

Let's stop with this discussion here guys.
Outside the scope of the thread.

No, the thread must grow.

[Mokona]

I dont mind him trying to bite me. I understand vamps got to vamp just so long as he isnt attempting to kill me. My issue with him is how he tries to slit my throat all because he saw me on the ship killing the mind flays and brains. Why did he try to kill me when I'm killing the bad guys that he also wants dead?

[Mander]

Origineel geplaatst door morrganstain:

Origineel geplaatst door Mander:

Let's stop with this discussion here guys.
Outside the scope of the thread.

No, the thread must grow.

^
Yeah, but not with this content pls.
It has become almost a sad stool measuring contest about who can feast longer or more happily.

[Wiwra]

My 1st character was bard, not 100% good one but also not evil, sometimes little selfish but overall pretty good hearted. Astarion gave me bad vibes from 1st encounter( I didnt liked any companions and most Shadowheart when I started to play) he tried to stab you, then bite you and feed on you, if you fail checks he will kill you also. Didnt wanted to say who he was and was very much secretive. t's so EASY to not like him at first and by his actions and logic stake him for that or disband him.
Tho, as 1st time playing, I always want to let know companions good before I will decide their fate, so simple saying: CURIOSITY is what didnt let me kill/left him.

[⇧⇨⇩⇩⇩]

Origineel geplaatst door Mander:

Origineel geplaatst door morrganstain:

No, the thread must grow.

^
Yeah, but not with this content pls.
It has become almost a sad stool measuring contest about who can feast longer or more happily.

Lol is this your first time on the internet? The internet rarely does what you want it to just because you ask. XD

[D YellowMadness]

Origineel geplaatst door Mander:

Origineel geplaatst door morrganstain:

No, the thread must grow.

^
Yeah, but not with this content pls.
It has become almost a sad stool measuring contest about who can feast longer or more happily.

I don't see how. It seems completely relevant to me aside from the fact that I'd argue it's different for a vampire because vampires are implied to have feeding on their mind all the time whenever they're don't have something to feed on & that the urge is stated to get stronger as their hunger grows but that's what debating is for. Pointing out those flaws.

There's a difference between flawed & irrelevant & I don't see the irrelevance.

[Estevan Valladares]

Origineel geplaatst door GayBeard:

Origineel geplaatst door nuther:

Whats confusing is he says he never was allowed to taste human blood. But I think he has tasted it.

you can play as an Origin Astarion or you can simply follow his storyline to the end with him as a companion, in both cases its extremely clear he infact has not had human blood prior to the events of the game. If he does taste human blood at all during the game, is up to you.

According to the Hunter close to the Hag house, his tribe in Rivington, or the prisioners in Cazador mansion, that is not true.
You may also get a hint of that not being true if you hear the two vampire spawn in the Flophouse.

[Estevan Valladares]

Origineel geplaatst door morrganstain:

Origineel geplaatst door Boon: Safeword:

Yes, and after fasting you're going to be HUNGRY. You don't want to just take a nibble on something and then be told that's all you get. I'm not interested in another edgelord pretending they don't understand human needs and sensations in order to miss the point entirely.

If you have some willpower its not hard at all. In fact the body kind of adjusts to it after a while. Ive done three day fastings and the hardest day is the first. The body is just used to getting stuff all the time. And no, eating just something small after 24h fasting is also not some unmanagable task. Done that too. You just adjust your expectations and isntead of getting upset thats all you get to eat you feel anticipation and thankfullnes that you get to eat this tasty little thing.

Willpower ?
If you were not educated to eat all the time, eat because you are sad, eat because you are happy, eat because you are meeting people, eat because you are alone, eat because you are anxious, eat because you "can", eat because "there is food", then fasting is just not eating for a while. You wont even miss the "eating".

It is not hunger you feel when you try to fast.

[Mojo JoJo]

Origineel geplaatst door Estevan Valladares:

According to the Hunter close to the Hag house, his tribe in Rivington, or the prisioners in Cazador mansion, that is not true.
You may also get a hint of that not being true if you hear the two vampire spawn in the Flophouse.

The hunter never mentions anything about astarion eating people, only that astarion attacked their camp and took their children. Also the two vampires in the flophouse are talking about kidnapping someone to eat after the ritual because they believe Cazador when he says they will be free afterwards, so Petras wants to have a meal on standby the moment he is free as it will be his first time tasting one.

Cazador never let any of his spawn 'drink the blood of thinking creatures' as the were all fed rats etc.. Darl (the other spawn in the flophouse) mentions rats or it could be that tiefling one who tries to kidnap astarion later with leon.

I think you need to see those cutscenes again as it couldn't be clearer that when astarion tries to bite you, it's not because he's hungry or wanting to get stronger, (he only says it is to cover himself) it's simply because he wants to see if he can actually break his Master's rules that he has had to abide by for 200yrs.

[DRMEMORY]

As soon as he put a knife to your throat his life should have been forfeit. You really let him hang around long enough to attempt a snack? I can think of a handful of RP-relevant reasons to let him continue breathing, but they all come down to being naive or horny. Stake him.

[Edible Eyebrows]

1. Allies are useful and you believe you can keep him under control (you can)

2. You're also an evil character and you respect his brazen disregard for mortal life.

3. You're playing as a super moral goodie character and you think you can 'fix him'. (You kinda can)

[Ranpo]

Origineel geplaatst door DRMEMORY:

As soon as he put a knife to your throat his life should have been forfeit. You really let him hang around long enough to attempt a snack? I can think of a handful of RP-relevant reasons to let him continue breathing, but they all come down to being naive or horny. Stake him.

You can say that for most of the companions since they either try to kill you or have a nuke that will kill you

[Carynara]

Second chances and all.