Astarion: too stupid to live?

[Mander]

TLDR: what was your in-game reason for letting Astarion live when he tried to bite you?

Looong post:

As of now, I believe Astarion’s characterization is the worst among all of our companions. The suspension of disbelief was already crippled on his first introduction: “I’m a magistrate in the city…” saith the not so clever vampire spawn after trying to knife us, showing us how good he is with a blade…
Yeah, Astarion, the infamous magistrate with proficiency in sleight of hand… SUUURE you’re a magistrate. I’ll even believe you’re the batman of Baldur’s Gate.
I know it wasn’t the intention of the writing team, but Astarion came out as an arrogant fool that think us too dumb to see through his lies (both from a metagaming standpoint, which is acceptable, but also from characterization, which is less so). AND THEN, the imbecile not only tries to feed on us, but he is also so poor of a predator that he wakes us up, AND he has the naivete to say “It’s not what it looks like, I swear!”
Everyone (bar those who look at Astarion and think, “I can fix him”) should stake him right then and there.
I mean… we’re survivors struggling together, many with enormous secrets (Shadowheart, Gale, Wyll…), but each more o less ready to help the team.
And then comes Astarion in the night, vampire unveiled, who tries to nibble on people who are ready to murderize everything in their path AFTER escaping the crash of a Nautiloid. Astarion, my man… wtf? Just say you need blood and I’ll give you some absolute cultists to dine on, just as we’re providing for Gale. It’s not so hard.
“But you can trust me!”
Sure. Come here, you bimbo vampire: I’ve just the right wood for you.
And yes: I’m saddened to have staked him, but only because the rest of the team is pretty content to have me perform a Van Helsing on Astarion. They couldn’t care less about him…

None the less, I’m really struggling in finding any justification so early in-game for letting someone live after trying to open me like a cold one, especially from a role-playing standpoint.
Sympathy for Astarion can exist and grow, sure (even if his “I hate you, vampire dad” act is a little cringy in some dialogue), but only if we accept to act as dumbasses in our early deals with him.
And normally, dumbasses do not survive the kind of prologues we’re subjected to…
So yeah… I’m really trying to find a reason to not stake Astarion. And I’m failing. And I’m sorry for that.

[RACHMANOVSKI]

Why you're sorry? lmao, if you think he deserves the stake then stake him lmao, nobody here probably gonna convince you otherwise.

[nuther]

Whats confusing is he says he never was allowed to taste human blood. But I think he has tasted it.

[Mander]

Originally posted by RACHMANOVSKI:

Why you're sorry? lmao, if you think he deserves the stake then stake him lmao, nobody here probably gonna convince you otherwise.

I mean... I was hoping the internet hivemind could provide me a reason to let him live.
One reason to let a very bad liar and a poor predator with an illithid affliction, (and a very bad case of self-destructing tendencies) stay alive.
Unfortunately, it appears his fabulous hairs can’t provide any significant advantage against the goblin camp or the druid grove…

[[LUE]Ten]

The only justification I needed was that I didn't want to lose a party member. I still hate Astarion and think the people who like him are crazy, but I am also not someone that goes around murdering companions. Don't blame you if you are though, he deserves it.

[nuther]

Originally posted by Mander:

Originally posted by RACHMANOVSKI:

Why you're sorry? lmao, if you think he deserves the stake then stake him lmao, nobody here probably gonna convince you otherwise.

I mean... I was hoping the internet hivemind could provide me a reason to let him live.
One reason to let a very bad liar and a poor predator with an illithid affliction, (and a very bad case of self-destructing tendencies) stay alive.
Unfortunately, it appears his fabulous hairs can’t provide any significant advantage against the goblin camp or the druid grove…

He is a capable damage dealer in combat especially if you give him poisons to use. Drow poison will drop big bosses.

[Mander]

Originally posted by nuther:

Whats confusing is he says he never was allowed to taste human blood. But I think he has tasted it.

Let me be clearer, and sorry if I wasn’t enough: I couldn’t care less if Astarion is a “good” or a bad character (if he can be reformed or not, in short, OR if he deserves it). Morally grey is the name of the game in BG3 (at least for the companions). It’s just that… he is such a huge dumbass of a character, in a party already plagued with problems…
And at the moment, sparing him seems also the dumb choice, at least from role playing.

[FunkyMonkey]

Yeah, I feel the OP. I don't think there is much reason if you care about more about RP than in combat reasons to ever let Astarion stay in party. I may not kill him every time, but he is certainly not staying in my camp. Which is a bummer, because he is the only one with rogue skills without respecing. Not the worst thing, but just means every playthrough I have to respec someone to take his role.

[Sister of Silence]

I'm a masochist. Loved Abdirak so why not Astarion. Besides look at the alternatives for romance here...Wyll, Gale, Halsin... yeah, no.

ps. I prefer playing evil chars (not murder hobo) so again the choices are rather thin there.
pps. Astarion has the best voice actor

[❛❛Vénttea❜❜]

Originally posted by nuther:

Whats confusing is he says he never was allowed to taste human blood. But I think he has tasted it.

That's not actually confusing though. He is a Vampire Spawn that has no free will or reign. He is just a puppet or a thrall.
His Master is a real piece of work and he can only feed if he is allowed to.

The only time he ever had any freedom was ironically being abducted by the Mindflayers that gave him a "Special" Tadpole. Now unless his Master did allow him to drink human blood; we'll never know.

Originally posted by Mander:

I mean... I was hoping the internet hivemind could provide me a reason to let him live.

Honestly if you hate him, it's going to be hard to reason it. The best I could say is that his character is a major appeal to me and his character story as well. He's similar to Shadowheart but instead of hiding through reservation he just hides it with his flamboyant attitude and insecurities.

He's similar to La'Zael. Put up with them long enough to grow on you and eventually you find a reason to like them IF you allow yourself to like them. It's like that one really bad friend we still hang out with a certain reason.

[Mander]

Originally posted by LUETen:

The only justification I needed was that I didn't want to lose a party member. I still hate Astarion and think the people who like him are crazy, but I am also not someone that goes around murdering companions. Don't blame you if you are though, he deserves it.

Originally posted by nuther:

Originally posted by Mander:

I mean... I was hoping the internet hivemind could provide me a reason to let him live.
One reason to let a very bad liar and a poor predator with an illithid affliction, (and a very bad case of self-destructing tendencies) stay alive.
Unfortunately, it appears his fabulous hairs can’t provide any significant advantage against the goblin camp or the druid grove…

He is a capable damage dealer in combat especially if you give him poisons to use. Drow poison will drop big bosses.

I too don't like to murder companions , but meta-gaming reasons are not enough for me.
Not if they force me to play a dumbass. I can play a good character (even a kind one, to allies).
BUt not an idiot one.

[SonnenKätzchen]

Ehh. He has a good character arc though? I saved him so I could see his story play out and I'm so glad I did. Plus he isn't as much of an ass as he lets on. He's a big softy since this is his first time in 200+ years with his own free will.

[Mander]

Originally posted by Sister of Silence:

I'm a masochist. Loved Abdirak so why not Astarion. Besides look at the alternatives for romance here...Wyll, Gale, Halsin... yeah, no.

Yeah... male characters are a little unpalatable as romance options in BG3, I agree (Gale with helicopter ex, and Wyll with stalker Mizora).
Astarion is not better in that regard though.

[FunkyMonkey]

Originally posted by SonnenKätzchen:

Ehh. He has a good character arc though? I saved him so I could see his story play out and I'm so glad I did. Plus he isn't as much of an ass as he lets on. He's a big softy since this is his first time in 200+ years with his own free will.

His story is cool, for at least what I saw of it. I didn't have him in my party outside the Act 3 ending part, though.

Still, I don't think he is gonna see much play from me after that. I don't like to play "evil" playthroughs and I have no reason to keep him around.

[Sister of Silence]

Originally posted by Mander:

Originally posted by Sister of Silence:

I'm a masochist. Loved Abdirak so why not Astarion. Besides look at the alternatives for romance here...Wyll, Gale, Halsin... yeah, no.

Yeah... male characters are a little unpalatable as romance options in BG3, I agree (Gale with helicopter ex, and Wyll with stalker Mizora).
Astarion is not better in that regard though.

Depends on the type of romance you prefer really, I like ascended Astarion, there are people who hate that and go good unascended Astarion which I cannot wrap my brain around.

[Mander]

Originally posted by ❛❛Liechée❜❜:

Honestly if you hate him, it's going to be hard to reason it. The best I could say is that his character is a major appeal to me and his character story as well. He's similar to Shadowheart but instead of hiding through reservation he just hides it with his flamboyant attitude and insecurities.

He's similar to La'Zael. Put up with them long enough to grow on you and eventually you find a reason to like them IF you allow yourself to like them. It's like that one really bad friend we still hang out with a certain reason.

I don't hate Astarion.
I pity him at most. But I pity him also for his stupidity, that made him think that it was such a grand idea to nibble on his very own team. Friendly fire, on top of the many problems we already have? Dumb, imo.

Shadowheart and Lae’Zel are utterly different from him: for starters, they at least try to prove they are competent and are working for the team.
Lae’Zel was a child soldier, with all the stunted emotional baggage and indoctrination it implies, but even she is lucid enough to say: “we’re struggling together. You may be a lower life form, but we can help each other.”
And she is right: we don’t have to sing around the campfire and share hugs and kisses, but we’re a ill composed team of strangers with one objective, survival.
Shadowheart even less: a cleric of the goddess of secrets, who is ready to drop the secrecy and help the team. She compromises her own faith, because she acknowledge that we’re in a pool of brine, with a lot of tadpoles swimming in it.