20 years of meta gaming

[Garptain]

This is really effecting alot of people playing BG3 I see people picking mains just to be good at conversation and get what they believe is the right dialogue choice as well as save scumming when you don't succeed convo rolls idk it's depressing.

My main is a monk, I don't save scum my choices, I don't use other high charisma characters to talk unless it makes sense and I have played through the game just fine. You don't need to meta game or save scum you didn't get the wrong choice just because you failed.

Idk the effect of 20+ years of meta gaming is sad and it is sad to watch people optimize the fun out of the game for them selves what I find more weird is how it is generally the casual audience doing this not the hardcore gamers I genuinely would encourage people to give it a go, try not save scumming and meta gaming you'll find the choices leading to very interesting stuff.

[nelvus]

So, you don't like it that other people are enjoying the game in a different way than you?

[Garptain]

Originally posted by nelvus:

So, you don't like it that other people are enjoying the game in a different way than you?

Over used argument that's been debunked, next.

[Orion Invictus]

What makes you think they're not having fun?

[Lord Enclave]

If the Dev's didn't want people to savescum, they shouldn't have put quicksave/load in the game. Simple.

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by Garptain:

20 years of meta gaming
This is really effecting alot of people playing BG3 I see people picking mains just to be good at conversation and get what they believe is the right dialogue choice as well as save scumming when you don't succeed convo rolls idk it's depressing.

My main is a monk, I don't save scum my choices, I don't use other high charisma characters to talk unless it makes sense and I have played through the game just fine. You don't need to meta game or save scum you didn't get the wrong choice just because you failed.

Idk the effect of 20+ years of meta gaming is sad and it is sad to watch people optimize the fun out of the game for them selves what I find more weird is how it is generally the casual audience doing this not the hardcore gamers

Unfortunately no one cares
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1086940/discussions/0/3808408328768732312/

I will never forget those moments of joy when going into an unknown adventure and the thrill of danger around every corner while knowing you can get only so far. And then there is always more later on when you replay the game with a different character. But... I do not know what to say. Players... if I should put it in my words, it feels like players/gamers these days have been corrupted by Ubisoft, where they treat the game more like chores to "finish everything at its best completed in one go without surprises just for a platin badge" rather than an actual adventure.

[Akkarin]

Its not an overused argument, you play you everyone else plays how they want. Dont see why this is an issue.

Too many asses like you who go WAAA everyone should play games the way i do and if they dont then they arent doing it right. Honestly like listening to the whining of a 5 year old.

[Garptain]

Originally posted by Lord Enclave:

If the Dev's didn't want people to savescum, they shouldn't have put quicksave/load in the game. Simple.

This is very basic level thinking that people use to justify a number of bad decisions.

[Dinvan]

*me having fun*
"You aint having as much fun as me because I play like this"
*me continues having fun*

[not harvey]

People say "dont save scum" like the choices isnt a fundamental game design issue.

The game clearly tells you "look, there is this cool thing you can do" then simultaneously says "well, the dice rolled bad, so tough luck".

Of-course most players are going to feel a strong incentive to save scum. The game mechanics encourage it.

Am I really going to open the Necromancy of Thay book, pass the first 2 rolls, fail the 3rd and say "ah well, I guess ill just never find out what this was". No.

Perception checks are a perfect example of this;

In DOS2, perception checks happened in the background, and would only "show" if you got lucky. So if your wits where too low, you would simply cruise through the game happy and content and with no clue that you where missing out on stuff.

But in BG3 they SHOW you that an opportunity was made, and that you failed. Now what do you do? The game just told you that you're missing out on something, but also wont tell you what it is. That's just mean. And when you add that the success or failure was up to random chance, of-course you feel like you need to reload to find out what it was.

It's FOMO design, just without the microtransactions.

The bad side of heavy randomisation in video games has been well documented over a long period of time, and it should be of no surprise that these issues manifest themselves in a game that does nothing to mitigate the effects of RNG on its design.

[Garptain]

Originally posted by アンジェル:

Originally posted by Garptain:

20 years of meta gaming
This is really effecting alot of people playing BG3 I see people picking mains just to be good at conversation and get what they believe is the right dialogue choice as well as save scumming when you don't succeed convo rolls idk it's depressing.

My main is a monk, I don't save scum my choices, I don't use other high charisma characters to talk unless it makes sense and I have played through the game just fine. You don't need to meta game or save scum you didn't get the wrong choice just because you failed.

Idk the effect of 20+ years of meta gaming is sad and it is sad to watch people optimize the fun out of the game for them selves what I find more weird is how it is generally the casual audience doing this not the hardcore gamers

Unfortunately no one cares
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1086940/discussions/0/3808408328768732312/

I will never forget those moments of joy when going into an unknown adventure and the thrill of danger around every corner while knowing you can get only so far. And then there is always more later on when you replay the game with a different character. But... I do not know what to say. Players... if I should put it in my words, it feels like players/gamers these days have been corrupted by Ubisoft, where they treat the game more like chores to "finish everything at its best completed in one go without surprises just for a platin badge" rather than an actual adventure.

Agreed, it's cliche but I absolutely see the effect that MMORPGs and Triple A gaming has had on people in full display with BG3. It's really sad lol

[Orion Invictus]

Originally posted by Garptain:

Originally posted by Lord Enclave:

If the Dev's didn't want people to savescum, they shouldn't have put quicksave/load in the game. Simple.

This is very basic level thinking that people use to justify a number of bad decisions.

Are games not primarily about entertainment/fun any more? When did that change?

[Garptain]

Originally posted by not harvey:

People say "dont save scum" like the choices isnt a fundamental game design issue.

The game clearly tells you "look, there is this cool thing you can do" then simultaneously says "well, the dice rolled bad, so tough luck".

Of-course most players are going to feel strongly incentives to save scum. The game mechanics encourage it.

Am I really going to open the Necromancy of Thay book, pass the first 2 rolls, fail the 3rd and say "ah well, I guess ill just never find out what this was". No.

Perception checks are a perfect example of this;

In DOS2, perception checks happened in the background, and would only "show" if you got lucky. So if your wits where too low, you would simply cruise through the game happy and content and with no clue that you where missing out on stuff.

But in BG3 they SHOW you that an opportunity was made, and that you failed. Now what do you do? The game just told you that you're missing out on something, but also wont tell you what it is. That's just mean. And when you add that the success or failure was up to random chance, of-course you feel like you need to reload to find out what it was.

It's FOMO design, just without the microtransactions.

It's not telling you missed out on something, there is always a alternative to these situations and some times this alternative is better. This is just monkey brain thinking.

[Arise Chicken]

This is the single most redundant post I've ever read in my life. Wahhhhh people are playing the game differently than me and I don't like that i made the choice of spending 100+ hours to change a single decision.

[jcw163]

Joyless powergaming RPGs, the legacy of WoW imo. Wrecked RPG design for years

[Luckiernut]

Good for you! What do you want a medal? You are not impressing anyone.