Wizard v Sorc v Warlock Spellcast Mechanics?

[Loquacious Lasagna]

Just wanted to make sure I understand the mechanical differences between the classes, as I'm used to pathfinder rather than dnd 5e. My understanding is-

Wizards learn all the spells, and anything they somehow don't know, they can pay to learn from a scroll. Do they also get to cast more spells than sorcerers, since they can recover slots?

Sorcerers don't need to prepare spells, but learn very few. They also have access to metamagic, which unlike in pathfinder is something only they can do. However I'm used to sorcerers being able to cast a lot of spells, but from my understanding they generally cast fewer in dnd 5e?

Warlocks are almost hybrid casters and are super different from the other 2. All their spells are upcast to their max spell level automatically, however they can cast basically no spells at all. However however, they get all their slots back from a short rest, and get a bunch of grab bag utility things like the familiar, their pact boons, Eldritch Invocations, etc etc. On top of that they also have way more proficiencies than a normal spellcaster and can actually hit things with a sword if they want to. It seems like Warlocks aren't necessarily intended to be a gish class, but rather are just extremely flexible and intended to kind of fit a variety of different builds and playstyles, from an almost eldritch knight to an eldritch blast machine. Is that accurate?

Thanks in advance! Figuring out what kind of character I want to make is probably going to be half my playtime here lol . . . I might just make a 2 weapon fighter and dual wield salamis instead . . .

[WeenerTuck813]

For the most part you nailed it. There’s a few more nuances, for example it’d be worth mentioning that Warlocks get access to the best damaging cantrip in the game, Eldritch Blast, which can be augmented with some Eldritch invocations and stays on pace damage wise with melee classes.

Also for wizards, they can only learn all ARCANE spells. They can’t learn Bless from a scroll because it’s a divine spell.

[Loquacious Lasagna]

Originally posted by WeenerTuck813:

For the most part you nailed it. There’s a few more nuances, for example it’d be worth mentioning that Warlocks get access to the best damaging cantrip in the game, Eldritch Blast, which can be augmented with some Eldritch invocations and stays on pace damage wise with melee classes.

Also for wizards, they can only learn all ARCANE spells. They can’t learn Bless from a scroll because it’s a divine spell.

Ah ok, so the distinction between divine and arcane spells still exists, cool. I had been given the impression wizards could learn any spell.

And yeah I imagine Eldritch blast scales well, but then again with only a couple spell slots even at high level you kind of need it to lol. I am currently playing a warlock and mostly eldritch blast everything with spells saved for emergency utility, like misty step or sleep

[Recjawjind]

Wizards don't learn all the spells. They get to pick 2 every time they level up to add to their spellbook. They can also scribe scrolls into their spellbook, so long as those scrolls are on the wizard spell list. They then prepare a number of spells equal to their Intelligence modifier + wizard level.

Sorcerers have a smaller spell list, and they learn spells when they level up, as seen in the table on their class description. They do not need to prepare spells though, every spell they learned is always ready to go.

Warlock is pretty accurate, yes. It's an exceptionally popular class to take 2-3 levels in as a muticlass dip if you are already a class thats main stat is charisma, which gives you access to eldritch blast buffed by the invocations you got at level 2, 2 spell slots that come back on a short rest, and if you take a third level, a pact. In this game specifically, pact of the blade will be very useful especially on paladins, since it lets you completely ignore strength and just go full focus on cha. (Unless armor still has stat requirements, which it didnt in early access)

[katzenkrimis]

Originally posted by Loquacious Lasagna:

-And get a bunch of grab bag utility things like the familiar.

-I might just make a 2 weapon fighter.

Don't like those classes. Your last suggestion is best.

If I had to choose between Warlock, Sorcerer, and Wizard, I'd take the Warlock.

Sick of Wizards from using them in the DoS games.

[Loquacious Lasagna]

Originally posted by Recjawjind:

Wizards don't learn all the spells. They get to pick 2 every time they level up to add to their spellbook. They can also scribe scrolls into their spellbook, so long as those scrolls are on the wizard spell list. They then prepare a number of spells equal to their Intelligence modifier + wizard level.

Yes, sorry, I was being hyperbolic. I meant wizards can learn any spell that is scribable into their spell book, in addition to learning them on level up.

Originally posted by katzenkrimis:

Don't like those classes. Your last suggestion is best.

Ah but the allure of beating people to death with two salamis is hard to resist. I can't imagine it will work for long, but as long as it does, oh boy.

[Georgion]

Originally posted by Recjawjind:

Wizards don't learn all the spells. They get to pick 2 every time they level up to add to their spellbook. They can also scribe scrolls into their spellbook, so long as those scrolls are on the wizard spell list. They then prepare a number of spells equal to their Intelligence modifier + wizard level.

Sorcerers have a smaller spell list, and they learn spells when they level up, as seen in the table on their class description. They do not need to prepare spells though, every spell they learned is always ready to go.

Warlock is pretty accurate, yes. It's an exceptionally popular class to take 2-3 levels in as a muticlass dip if you are already a class thats main stat is charisma, which gives you access to eldritch blast buffed by the invocations you got at level 2, 2 spell slots that come back on a short rest, and if you take a third level, a pact. In this game specifically, pact of the blade will be very useful especially on paladins, since it lets you completely ignore strength and just go full focus on cha. (Unless armor still has stat requirements, which it didnt in early access)

QUestion - does wizard intelligence modifier influence only number of spells they can prepare or the "power" of the spells as well?

[Recjawjind]

Originally posted by Loquacious Lasagna:

Originally posted by Recjawjind:

Wizards don't learn all the spells. They get to pick 2 every time they level up to add to their spellbook. They can also scribe scrolls into their spellbook, so long as those scrolls are on the wizard spell list. They then prepare a number of spells equal to their Intelligence modifier + wizard level.

Yes, sorry, I was being hyperbolic. I meant wizards can learn any spell that is scribable into their spell book, in addition to learning them on level up.

Ah, though there is a difference between learning a spell and preparing it, in the specific terminology. A spell a wizard learns is in their spellbook, but not every spell that they learned is prepared and ready to be cast.

There are actually classes that have their entire spell list available at all times to prepare from, namely druids and clerics. They just know all their spells and get to prepare some from that list.

[Recjawjind]

Originally posted by jiri.svasek:

QUestion - does wizard intelligence modifier influence only number of spells they can prepare or the "power" of the spells as well?

It absolutely also influences their power. At least when it comes to damaging spells. Spells that are an attack roll (like firebolt, scorching ray, etc), you get a bonus to, equal to your proficiency bonus (which grows as you level) and your intelligence modifier, meaning a higher intelligence modifier causes you to be more accurate with them.

Spells that cause enemies to make a saving throw (like fireball, disintegrate etc) to resist the effect instead of an attack roll are also influenced. The saving throw difficulty (spell save dc) is 8 + your proficiency bonus + your intelligence modifier. Essentially, enemies have to roll better the higher your intelligence is to resist the effect of the spell.

This is true for every spell in the game I might add. Only, which stat influences it changes depending on your class.

Intelligence for wizards (and eldritch knights)
Wisdom for clerics, druids and rangers (and four elements monks)
Charisma for warlocks, sorcerers, bards and paladins.

[SpaceNvader]

Originally posted by Loquacious Lasagna:

Just wanted to make sure I understand the mechanical differences between the classes, as I'm used to pathfinder rather than dnd 5e. My understanding is-

Wizards learn all the spells, and anything they somehow don't know, they can pay to learn from a scroll. Do they also get to cast more spells than sorcerers, since they can recover slots?

Sorcerers don't need to prepare spells, but learn very few. They also have access to metamagic, which unlike in pathfinder is something only they can do. However I'm used to sorcerers being able to cast a lot of spells, but from my understanding they generally cast fewer in dnd 5e?

Warlocks are almost hybrid casters and are super different from the other 2. All their spells are upcast to their max spell level automatically, however they can cast basically no spells at all. However however, they get all their slots back from a short rest, and get a bunch of grab bag utility things like the familiar, their pact boons, Eldritch Invocations, etc etc. On top of that they also have way more proficiencies than a normal spellcaster and can actually hit things with a sword if they want to. It seems like Warlocks aren't necessarily intended to be a gish class, but rather are just extremely flexible and intended to kind of fit a variety of different builds and playstyles, from an almost eldritch knight to an eldritch blast machine. Is that accurate?

Thanks in advance! Figuring out what kind of character I want to make is probably going to be half my playtime here lol . . . I might just make a 2 weapon fighter and dual wield salamis instead . . .

Sorcerers can create spell slots for casting by spending sorcery points.

[Ragnar]

They have divided spell casters into main casters (wizard, sorcerer, druid, cleric, bard), 1/2 casters (ranger, paladin) and 1/3 casters (fighter and rogue subclass). And then the special warlock. The spell slot progression is the same for all in main caster category. It's half for ranger paladin etc. Wizard have arcane recovery to get some used spell slots back and sorcerer have sorcery points that can do the same, but is mostly used for metamagic to boost their spells. Warlocks as mentioned have 1-2 spell slots they regain every short rest.

The rest about how many spells they learn etc is correct. But their spell list is a bit different. Wizard have the most spells, but warlock have some unique spells for them.

Subclass on each also makes a big difference. It often decides if you are more weapon oriented or not. Wizard can also be thsy, but the subclass is not in Bg3, so here it's mostly spell focused.

[Heu, Iterum Id Feci]

Originally posted by Ragnar:

They have divided spell casters into main casters (wizard, sorcerer, druid, cleric, bard), 1/2 casters (ranger, paladin) and 1/3 casters (fighter and rogue subclass). And then the special warlock. The spell slot progression is the same for all in main caster category. It's half for ranger paladin etc. Wizard have arcane recovery to get some used spell slots back and sorcerer have sorcery points that can do the same, but is mostly used for metamagic to boost their spells. Warlocks as mentioned have 1-2 spell slots they regain every short rest.

The rest about how many spells they learn etc is correct. But their spell list is a bit different. Wizard have the most spells, but warlock have some unique spells for them.

Subclass on each also makes a big difference. It often decides if you are more weapon oriented or not. Wizard can also be thsy, but the subclass is not in Bg3, so here it's mostly spell focused.

Also traditional d&d wisdom is wizards have more utility but sorcs have more boom.

[Loquacious Lasagna]

Tabletop coffeelock shenanigans aside, a sorlock seems . . . very good if you want to be a pure blaster caster

[Recjawjind]

Originally posted by Loquacious Lasagna:

Tabletop coffeelock shenanigans aside, a sorlock seems . . . very good if you want to be a pure blaster caster

Honestly, the 2 short rests per long rest restriction and level cap kinda hurts sorlock a lot. Unless they give you 6th level slots despite a 2/3 level dip into warlock, a pure sorc is gonna be better imo.

[Foolswalkin]

Originally posted by Recjawjind:

Originally posted by Loquacious Lasagna:

Tabletop coffeelock shenanigans aside, a sorlock seems . . . very good if you want to be a pure blaster caster

Honestly, the 2 short rests per long rest restriction and level cap kinda hurts sorlock a lot. Unless they give you 6th level slots despite a 2/3 level dip into warlock, a pure sorc is gonna be better imo.

Warlocks and bards are besties, as I believe bards give you +1 short rest per long. Paladins and Clerics also appreciate the extra channels.

Even if they don’t stack with multiple bards, with one bard Warlocks at level 12 should be able to cast more spell levels per day than a sorcerer (15*4 + 6 > 47 + 5 + 3 in converted sorc points).

[WeenerTuck813]

Originally posted by Recjawjind:

Originally posted by Loquacious Lasagna:

Tabletop coffeelock shenanigans aside, a sorlock seems . . . very good if you want to be a pure blaster caster

Honestly, the 2 short rests per long rest restriction and level cap kinda hurts sorlock a lot. Unless they give you 6th level slots despite a 2/3 level dip into warlock, a pure sorc is gonna be better imo.

Eh
Sorta.

You have to keep in mind, meta magic is REALLY strong. And Sorcs can turn spell slots into sorcery points and then into metamagic.

So, keep in mind your Warlock spellslots regenerate on short or long rests, so you get a steady stream of metamagic points.

While you may be behind in level of spell slots, you’re getting a lot more metamagic use considering a level 3 warlock gets 6 level 2 spell slots just from short resting.