how does surprise round works in combat?

[wei270]

can anyone explain to me how surprise rounds works in combat, if you have 3 party member entering combat with conversation, which happens all the time, and a fourth unit in stealth.

once in combat your stealth units would effectively lose his stealth round and pretty much act just as another unit would in combat just with stealth?

[Homer Morisson]

You basically get one free round where the enemy cannot act, that's it.

But that only triggers if you manage to surprise the enemy, i.e. initiate combat before they themselves have spotted you/before you draw aggro in other words.

If you have a party member out of combat, IIRC they can make stealthed range attacks into combat, and if you simply maneuver them within the combat zone to include them in combat, there should be a check of that character's Stealth vs. any observing enemy's perception... pass that and you should stay stealthed, but that wouldn't trigger a surprise round.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

It basically means that when their first turn would come up, it gets skipped instead.

[katzenkrimis]

Surprise!

Longbow Ranger gets first shot.

---

What you are supposed to do in some situations is separate your party icons on the left.

Then place everyone in the positions that you want them, then take your shot.

This will bait them to run towards you and you'll already have the advantage.

[Tempest]

Originally posted by wei270:

can anyone explain to me how surprise rounds works in combat, if you have 3 party member entering combat with conversation, which happens all the time, and a fourth unit in stealth.

once in combat your stealth units would effectively lose his stealth round and pretty much act just as another unit would in combat just with stealth?

Yes, if you start combat as a result of conversation, you do not get a surprise round because they are not surprised. Your fourth stealthed character enters combat when you direct, as described above. So no extra surprise round just for them.

The only way to get a full surprise round is to attack unaware enemies.

[Lucky Mud]

Surprise attacks are crazy strong in this game.

When the attack lands, the attacker will be put into combat (unless you 1-shot from stealth, then you have a chance to re-stealth). Anybody that the enemy can see will also be placed in combat. Everyone rolls initiative as normal, but surprised enemies will do nothing in their first turn.

Here's where it get's really scary though. Anybody who the enemy didn't see is not in combat. Combat keeps moving, but stops when one of your in-combat characters gets a turn. At this point, anyone not in combat is free to move ANYWHERE that isn't visible to combatants, and combat time will be frozen as long as you like.

If you want to, you can have someone circle 1000 yards to the far side of the battlefield and approach in a blind spot. At the very least, all your stealth guys can pick the place they want to fight from and enter the fight with a ranged stealth attack that will have advantage.

It's goofy, but I think of it as a kind of Heisenberg uncertainty thing. An unobserved party member could really be anywhere that nobody is looking.

A lot of challenging encounters can just be taken apart with surprise attacks, killing or neutralizing all threats before they draw steel.

[Something completely different]

Originally posted by Homer Morisson:

You basically get one free round where the enemy cannot act, that's it.

That's not all of it. You also cannot use reactions when surprised and that can be a big thing with certain spells like shield which you cannot use as a result.

[Xero]

surprise attacks don't even work for me. If my rogue attacks an enemy out of stealth, all he gets is 1 attack of my choosing. then he get's tossed into initiative order with the enemy he just attacked once. however at the start of his then following turn he doesn't even get an Action. it seems bugged as all hell

[Redsun]

Originally posted by Xero:

surprise attacks don't even work for me. If my rogue attacks an enemy out of stealth, all he gets is 1 attack of my choosing. then he get's tossed into initiative order with the enemy he just attacked once. however at the start of his then following turn he doesn't even get an Action. it seems bugged as all hell

same problem here. Whats the point of surprise attack if i lose my action point the next turn? Is this bugged or intended?

[Mrmetalhead123]

Originally posted by Redsun:

Originally posted by Xero:

surprise attacks don't even work for me. If my rogue attacks an enemy out of stealth, all he gets is 1 attack of my choosing. then he get's tossed into initiative order with the enemy he just attacked once. however at the start of his then following turn he doesn't even get an Action. it seems bugged as all hell

same problem here. Whats the point of surprise attack if i lose my action point the next turn? Is this bugged or intended?

also wondering about this. i see you can get a rogue passive with assassin that recharges your action and bonus action in the first round so im assuming losing an action even tho you surprised the enemy is intentional. kinda defeats the purpose though. i'm not seeing how we are getting an extra turn when we cant take any actions if we already used when prior to combat initiating

[SoloQ]

There's definitely no bug, you're just not understanding how sneak or surprise work.
Think of it from the perspective of an enemy that surprises you and how they do it. You walk forward until one of their party members sees you and then they all jump out of stealth at once and ambush you. You have to do the same thing in a nutshell. It's a lot easier if you surprise them with one party member with high sneak and initiative. And have the rest of your party remain out of sight until the dust settles and then move in.

The action you think you're losing you've already spent attacking from sneak. Now you get to move and bonus action.

[kwsapphire]

I don't seem to be able to set up surprise rounds reliably. Even when I spread my party out around the room, have them all Hidden, and attack from Hide. We get a surprise round in some fights, but not others. Like the Paladins of Tyr to the west of the Emerald Grove. Even if I enter the building from the top floor with everyone stealthed, and they don't even know we're there, I can't get a surprise round. I can hit from stealth and if I re-stealth, combat isn't triggered. But if I fail the stealth AFTER I hit Anders, initiative is triggered and there is no surprise round. Are there some mobs that are immune to surprise rounds or something? Or am I doing something wrong?

[Imrahil]

Originally posted by SoloQ:

There's definitely no bug, you're just not understanding how sneak or surprise work.

I've been a DM for 10 years and played all Baldur's Gate variants. Surprise is completely bugged to the point of being broken...
Example:
1. I have my entire party in stealth tucked away in beneficial positions.
2. I activate Turn-Based Mode.
3. I initiate combat with one of them.
4. Only the party member that initiated the fight gets in combat everyone else picks their nose.
5. Not all enemies enter into combat.
6. Some enemies enter into combat after detecting you and then THEY get the drop on you.

It's just an ungodly mess and doesn't work.

[Flavalicious]

Surprise in this game is usually narriative based more then anything. You cant just strike out with a range attack from someone hiding, otherwise every fight would trigger surprise and youd fall asleep at the computer. Surprise in this game is you sneaking into a cellar below a building and finding 3 npcs talking while sitting at a table. The setting of the situation is they think they are alone and safe with guard down. You shooting a patrol from a hiding spot is an ambush but their guard was up, thus no surprise.

The 100% certain way to get it is pass an ambush percrption chance and attack whatever is hiding. But thats your reward for ambushing an ambusher, if you dont detect them then they get a surprise round on you.