Are save chances in this game correct?

[EriCordeiro]

It might be a display issue, but this game does not seem to be calculating enemy saving throw chances correctly.

Here's an example:
- Lv 5 Cleric (Shadowheart) has proficiency bonus of +2, a Wis mod of +4, therefore, her spell DC should be 10+2+4 = 16.
- Enemy barbarian has a Dex saving throw modifier of +1 (Dex is 12, no proficiency).
- Sacred Flame displays a 42% chance of success (enemy failing their Save), when the Barbarian should be needing a 15 or higher on the d20 (so 30% chance of success). The correct chance of success should be 70%.

Do enemies receive a hidden saving throw bonus with Honour mode rules? Or is the game simply wrong?

[Orion Invictus]

引用自 EriCordeiro：

Do enemies receive a hidden saving throw bonus with Honour mode rules?

Yes. And it's not hidden, you see it in the combat log.

[Piperbird]

引用自 EriCordeiro：

It might be a display issue, but this game does not seem to be calculating enemy saving throw chances correctly.

Here's an example:
- Lv 5 Cleric (Shadowheart) has proficiency bonus of +2, a Wis mod of +4, therefore, her spell DC should be 10+2+4 = 16.
- Enemy barbarian has a Dex saving throw modifier of +1 (Dex is 12, no proficiency).
- Sacred Flame displays a 42% chance of success (enemy failing their Save), when the Barbarian should be needing a 15 or higher on the d20 (so 30% chance of success). The correct chance of success should be 70%.

Do enemies receive a hidden saving throw bonus with Honour mode rules? Or is the game simply wrong?

In 5e, DC is 8+proficiency bonus+mod, not 10.

[iamcorn]

Uh.

I think spell save DC is 8+Prof+Stat

But yeah for whatever reason way too many things seem to make their dex saves.

[The HR Department]

The enemy NPCs in BG3 don't use dice. They get hits for max damage every time, maybe crit, and occasionally miss. I reckon it's to make every fight last beyond a couple of rounds, even if you have all of the advantage you could need.

[The Yeen Queen]

引用自 The HR Department：

The enemy NPCs in BG3 don't use dice. They get hits for max damage every time, maybe crit, and occasionally miss. I reckon it's to make every fight last beyond a couple of rounds, even if you have all of the advantage you could need.

Which is why they always take the same amount of damage when hit by the same attacks?

....oh, wait, they don't.

[The HR Department]

引用自 The Yeen Queen：

引用自 The HR Department：

The enemy NPCs in BG3 don't use dice. They get hits for max damage every time, maybe crit, and occasionally miss. I reckon it's to make every fight last beyond a couple of rounds, even if you have all of the advantage you could need.

Which is why they always take the same amount of damage when hit by the same attacks?

....oh, wait, they don't.

They do for me. Noticed it so many times, ricochet arrows hitting for max damage every time when fighting the Giths at the exit of act 2, and magic missiles hitting for all of their possible damage every time. Like i said hit, miss and sometimes crit.

[The Yeen Queen]

引用自 The HR Department：

引用自 The Yeen Queen：

Which is why they always take the same amount of damage when hit by the same attacks?

....oh, wait, they don't.

They do for me. Noticed it so many times, ricochet arrows hitting for max damage every time when fighting the Giths at the exit of act 2, and magic missiles hitting for all of their possible damage every time. Like i said hit, miss and sometimes crit.

Either you've got a mod going or a special magic copy no one else has. But that absolutely is not the case for me, nor have I heard of anyone else claiming to have seen this.

OR you're mis-remembering. Observational bias or some such.

[Piperbird]

引用自 The HR Department：

引用自 The Yeen Queen：

Which is why they always take the same amount of damage when hit by the same attacks?

....oh, wait, they don't.

They do for me. Noticed it so many times, ricochet arrows hitting for max damage every time when fighting the Giths at the exit of act 2, and magic missiles hitting for all of their possible damage every time. Like i said hit, miss and sometimes crit.

Yeah, something extra is going on there. And they do roll. You can open the log and see the log results for every roll in the game. What mods do you have?

[Zeel Ara]

引用自 The HR Department：

引用自 The Yeen Queen：

Which is why they always take the same amount of damage when hit by the same attacks?

....oh, wait, they don't.

They do for me. Noticed it so many times, ricochet arrows hitting for max damage every time when fighting the Giths at the exit of act 2, and magic missiles hitting for all of their possible damage every time. Like i said hit, miss and sometimes crit.

No they don't. You've developed a delusion and now you're unable to see anything that doesn't fit it.

Go into the game right now and test it. Repeat the same actions during one round of combat. Write down EVERY roll from the combat log on a piece of paper, reload the save, and repeat. Do that 5 times, then close the game, move away from the computer, and take a good hard look at what you wrote down. Finally, spend some time considering why it was easier for you to lie to both yourself and everyone else than it was to be honest. You will grow as a person.

[Orion Invictus]

引用自 Moffle：

引用自 The HR Department：

They do for me. Noticed it so many times, ricochet arrows hitting for max damage every time when fighting the Giths at the exit of act 2, and magic missiles hitting for all of their possible damage every time. Like i said hit, miss and sometimes crit.

No they don't. You've developed a delusion and now you're unable to see anything that doesn't fit it.

Go into the game right now and test it. Repeat the same actions during one round of combat. Write down EVERY roll from the combat log on a piece of paper, reload the save, and repeat. Do that 5 times, then close the game, move away from the computer, and take a good hard look at what you wrote down. Finally, spend some time considering why it was easier for you to lie to both yourself and everyone else than it was to be honest. You will grow as a person.

And you've done this, presumably? For a statistically significant number of times, of course, not just 5 times.

[Hobocop]

So, I'm noticing a % chance of success that is not divisible by 5. That's a dead giveaway for Advantage/Disadvantage playing some sort of factor.

If they're a Barbarian-coded NPC, there's a very good chance they have Danger Sense which provides advantage on their Dexterity Saving Throws.

[Raz]

引用自 Hobocop：

So, I'm noticing a % chance of success that is not divisible by 5. That's a dead giveaway for Advantage/Disadvantage playing some sort of factor.

If they're a Barbarian-coded NPC, there's a very good chance they have Danger Sense which provides advantage on their Dexterity Saving Throws.

Since they are Level 5 facing a Barbarian, I can only assume this is Dror Ragzalin who indeed has Danger Sense. Though, the Barbarian at the Jergal Temple has it as well.

[northernwater]

Here is a good article on Advantage and Disadvantage.

https://statmodeling.stat.columbia.edu/2014/07/12/dnd-5e-advantage-disadvantage-probability/

[Popsicles]

Need to get the formula right first. Then give me at least 300 rolls in a spreadsheet to prove any bias. RNG is random. You are not the first to attempt to claim there is an issue with the dice, nor will you be the last.

[EriCordeiro]

Ah, my mistake. I haven't played 5e in years, and mistakenly used the PF2e formula. I also forgot Danger Sense gave advantage on saving throws, as Hobocop mentioned, the not divisible by 5 % chance should have been a dead giveaway. Thanks for the clarification, everyone.

That being said, with how many modifiers one can get for attack rolls (and spell attack rolls), it feels like Save type actions are best used when the modifiers are stacked against you (or if the enemy has really high AC).

Also the fact that, unlike PF2e, there are no crit success or crit failures for saves makes these spells less appealing for me.