Male Lolth Drow Clerics!?!

[ChentallyMallenged1]

Are impossible. Read Homeland by R. A. Salvatore to understand this. Please fix this.

[KOHb]

Publicado originalmente por Salty86:

Drizzt is mentioned by name in the Player's Handbook in at least a couple places. Bruenor is quoted in the Player's Handbook- the quote is from the novel, The Crystal Shard by R.A. Salvatore, the very same book the male drow cleric of Lolth appears in. Kind of muddies the waters on WotC's part, wouldn't you agree?

Also, I'm not trying to prove male clerics of Lolth are official canon. My point was that WotC crosses the wires of canon and non-canon so frequently the distinction is meaningless- In TT you can do whatever you want and apparently the same holds true within reason for video games and novels. If the primary ways you can engage with the universe aren't held to canonical restrictions then what's the real world relevance of what's official canon and what's not?

Salvatore's books are full of 'unique snowflakes' created to enhance dramatism and internal charater's conflicts.

[Lunduke is the Trump of tech]

Publicado originalmente por Criminal Horse:

Publicado originalmente por Salty86:

Drizzt is mentioned by name in the Player's Handbook in at least a couple places. Bruenor is quoted in the Player's Handbook- the quote is from the novel, The Crystal Shard by R.A. Salvatore, the very same book the male drow cleric of Lolth appears in. Kind of muddies the waters on WotC's part, wouldn't you agree?

Also, I'm not trying to prove male clerics of Lolth are official canon. My point was that WotC crosses the wires of canon and non-canon so frequently the distinction is meaningless- In TT you can do whatever you want and apparently the same holds true within reason for video games and novels. If the primary ways you can engage with the universe aren't held to canonical restrictions then what's the real world relevance of what's official canon and what's not?

Salvatore's books are full of 'unique snowflakes' created to enhance dramatism and internal charater's conflicts.

thats why war of the spider queen is a better series to read.

I love how quite early on in the first book it begins showing the long time friendship between Pharaun and Ryld then later on Pharaun betrays Ryld to increase his own chances to save his own life. Ryld survives though and later they end up on another mission together without any issues between each other because Ryld knows that Pharaun made the best logical decision, nothing wrong with that. This introduction shows that this is the best book series to read if you want real drow protagonists, not snowflake drizzt

[RhodosGuard]

Nothing more ironic than a bunch of snowflakes, incapable of accepting the choice the devs made for the game calling a character a snowflake.

If you got any more sweaty and angry about this topic, you risk melting my dudes.

[Raï 𓆣]

Publicado originalmente por RhodosGuard:

Nothing more ironic than a bunch of snowflakes, incapable of accepting the choice the devs made for the game calling a character a snowflake.

If you got any more sweaty and angry about this topic, you risk melting my dudes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Deg7VrpHbM&ab_channel=VioletDirge

[Yojo0o]

Publicado originalmente por Criminal Horse:

Publicado originalmente por Salty86:

Drizzt is mentioned by name in the Player's Handbook in at least a couple places. Bruenor is quoted in the Player's Handbook- the quote is from the novel, The Crystal Shard by R.A. Salvatore, the very same book the male drow cleric of Lolth appears in. Kind of muddies the waters on WotC's part, wouldn't you agree?

Also, I'm not trying to prove male clerics of Lolth are official canon. My point was that WotC crosses the wires of canon and non-canon so frequently the distinction is meaningless- In TT you can do whatever you want and apparently the same holds true within reason for video games and novels. If the primary ways you can engage with the universe aren't held to canonical restrictions then what's the real world relevance of what's official canon and what's not?

Salvatore's books are full of 'unique snowflakes' created to enhance dramatism and internal charater's conflicts.

I mean yeah, I grew out of those books a while back. They're definitely more oriented towards a younger audience.

Why are we continually dunking on the writing quality, though? Should we evaluate whether or not something is canon based on how well the novel was written? Because for the record, most Forgotten Realms books fall into this category, Drizzt just caught on more. The BG1-2 novelizations are godawful, the Elminster books are at least as tropey as the Drizzt books and play by incredibly loose and silly rules, and the Avatar trilogy is so dry as to be unreadable. Do you think Kelemvor, Cyric, and Midnight are any better characters than Drizzt?

I'm happy to give Ed Greenwood plenty of credit for establishing good lore in the canon, but I can't stand his prose.

[stun]

faerun has always been a black hole of truly awful writing, and it's fairly consistently been reflected ingame with truly awful mechanical design. It's pretty much the source of everything wrong with the 2.0-3.5 block. Who possibly would want to play in that setting with faithful obedience to a system that none of the books followed?

Publicado originalmente por ChentallyMallenged1:

Are impossible.

Yeah man, demons are well known for not doing whatever they want in that exact moment and slavishly following social trends that arose in the world or mortals and which they are in no way subject to. I'm sure lolth agrees with you that she can't grant spells to whoever the ♥♥♥♥ she wants.

[Vixziค็็็็็n]

Publicado originalmente por 666ms:

Yeah man, demons are well known for not doing whatever they want in that exact moment and slavishly following social trends that arose in the world or mortals and which they are in no way subject to. I'm sure lolth agrees with you that she can't grant spells to whoever the ♥♥♥♥ she wants.

Because she's going to grant them to the thing she absolutely hates right? The drow were formed on the premise of the spider. Spider species are often cannibalistic and particularly on the menu are the males. The drow are setup in this fashion as a matriarchal society that eats their own metaphorically speaking and using the males for as long as they are useful as minor tools for specific purposes and then they are on the top of the menu.... in fact it would be interesting to know the mortality rate of males in drow society.

So what she can do and what she would do are two different things entirely. She is also a god which means she is more likely to lean in to her own nature to the extreme.

[stun]

The overwhelming majority of drow behavior is just random stuff they're doing loosely apeing what they think lolth wants. The matriarchal society, in particular, was explicitly something the drow just came up with. Lolth doesn't care. She doesn't hate males, she looks down on everyone because she's a demon god and a ♥♥♥♥♥. Drow decided to form a loosely lawful society and pick up random trends from shoddy spider informed anthropology and she doesn't do anything to correct them, except sometimes around a times of trouble.

[dulany67]

Publicado originalmente por 666ms:

The overwhelming majority of drow behavior is just random stuff they're doing loosely apeing what they think lolth wants. The matriarchal society, in particular, was explicitly something the drow just came up with. Lolth doesn't care. She doesn't hate males, she looks down on everyone because she's a demon god and a ♥♥♥♥♥. Drow decided to form a loosely lawful society and pick up random trends from shoddy spider informed anthropology and she doesn't do anything to correct them, except sometimes around a times of trouble.

Head canon?

[stun]

Publicado originalmente por dulany67:

Head canon?

Flavor from 3.5 splats

[Vixziค็็็็็n]

Publicado originalmente por dulany67:

Publicado originalmente por 666ms:

The overwhelming majority of drow behavior is just random stuff they're doing loosely apeing what they think lolth wants. The matriarchal society, in particular, was explicitly something the drow just came up with. Lolth doesn't care. She doesn't hate males, she looks down on everyone because she's a demon god and a ♥♥♥♥♥. Drow decided to form a loosely lawful society and pick up random trends from shoddy spider informed anthropology and she doesn't do anything to correct them, except sometimes around a times of trouble.

Head canon?

Yep

[Dragon Master]

Publicado originalmente por Vixzian:

Publicado originalmente por dulany67:

Head canon?

Yep

Absolutely.

[Harukage]

The center of all Lolth worship on Torilm, and the source of traditional drow society is Menzoberranzan. That was founed by a high priestess of Lolth. And is fully based on a Lolth's guidance on a perfect society that Lolth wanted to see. Literally.
Saying that it is just drow invention is super wrong.

[stun]

Hate to break it to you but that wasn't the lore in any of the drow/underdark books in the last decade.

[SpiceMorine]

Publicado originalmente por 🜭:

Wow, this thread is old, but it was an interesting read.

Can be summed up as "Bored people argue meaningless ♥♥♥♥"