How much more would you enjoy BG3 without woke elements?

[Sandy]

Imagine if this game had zero wokeness. By how much would your enjoyment rise from this game?

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by harken23:

Originally posted by Pan Darius Cassandra:

I don't know about the first question, but in the US a business has the right to refuse service to anyone, except a protected class. Sexual orientation is a protected class, just as religion, ethnicity and gender are.

One can be refused service for a variety of reasons - being too tall, too short, having red hair, a bad attitude, or simply because they don't like you.

The stupid part about that particular case is that the owners of the bakery could have claimed any of those reasons as why they refused service, but instead decided to martyr themselves by breaking the law. It's really not that hard to hide one's true motives when refusing service and it can be almost impossible to prove in court.

To my mind, no bakery should ever be forced to make a cake.

I also agree that they tried to be Super MAGA and paint themselves as martyrs, to push a political point. Wait, does that make them "woke"?

The law is the law. A business can refuse seevice to anyone for any reason except for being part of a protected class.

That particular bakery refused service to someone of a protected class and then publicized it. They broke the law.

[harken23]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Cassandra:

Originally posted by harken23:

What? What rules on Nexus are "stupid" that got those mods banned?

So Nexus SHOULD be forced host mods and modders that violate their TOS? Nexus is not a "mall" it's a private business with rules.

It's exactly the same as saying a bakery should be forced to bake a wedding cake.

Exactly the same.

It's actually not the same at all.

Yes, it is. You want to force businesses to do something in their bailiwick they don't want to do.

If your response is going to again be something of the "NU UHHH!!!1!1!!" variety, don't bother.

[Marmottty]

Originally posted by Sandy:

Nexusmods is a clown show. They allow mods that transform male characters into female characters, creating new gay relationships that weren't there in the game. Not to mention destroying the original character by turning them into something they never were.

But then they ban mods that simply create straight relationships.

The people who defend them look stupid.

It's the usual double standards that come with these people.

Maybe if they hadn’t filled their mod description with racist and homophobic content, they wouldn’t have been banned?
You can even try the experiment yourself. Create a mod that transforms male characters into female ones, and then, like the banned mods, fill the description with racist rants. Let’s see how long it takes before it gets banned.

[harken23]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Cassandra:

Originally posted by harken23:

To my mind, no bakery should ever be forced to make a cake.

I also agree that they tried to be Super MAGA and paint themselves as martyrs, to push a political point. Wait, does that make them "woke"?

The law is the law. A business can refuse seevice to anyone for any reason except for being part of a protected class.

That particular bakery refused service to someone of a protected class and then publicized it. They broke the law.

My point being, the Venn diagram of people who want Nexus to host specific mods that violate their TOS, and the people who think refusing to bake a cake is somehow "heroic" or whatever is two circles that don't overlap at all, when they're exactly the same thing.

I'm not talking about legality at all.

[harken23]

Originally posted by Marmottty:

Maybe if they hadn’t filled their mod description with racist and homophobic content, they wouldn’t have been banned?
You can even try the experiment yourself. Create a mod that transforms male characters into female ones, and then, like the banned mods, fill the description with racist rants. Let’s see how long it takes before it gets banned.

Exactly. Then make a mod that transmogrifies male characters into female ones and DON'T put homophobic and racist slurs in the description and see if it gets banned. It won't.

Weird how violating the TOS gets you banned, where not violating them doesn't. I wouldn't have thought that was hard to understand, but here we are.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by harken23:

Originally posted by Pan Darius Cassandra:

It's actually not the same at all.

Yes, it is. You want to force businesses to do something in their bailiwick they don't want to do.

If your response is going to again be something of the "NU UHHH!!!1!1!!" variety, don't bother.

Hosting content online and baking cakes aren't the same.

[orcaa]

Originally posted by Sandy:

Imagine if this game had zero wokeness. By how much would your enjoyment rise from this game?

award farmer lol

[CountCthulhu]

Originally posted by YurFiredWiseguy:

Originally posted by sburke1959:

It's all just people exercising their freedom of expression and power as consumers in a free market, right?

The free market isn't asking for LGBTQ+, to use one example. Most gamers are heterosexual males and they didn't ask for LGBTQ+ in BG3. LGBTQ+ was added to BG3 in spite of the free market.

I don't think you understand what the free market is.

LOL! The game has already sold over 21 Million copies. I think the free market has spoken, and it says LGBTQ+ content is just fine.

[rubberducky102760]

Originally posted by loppantorkel:

Originally posted by DDkiki:

Don't care. Wish game was just better balanced and presented more challenge.

It's "woke" stuff is mild and barely noticable compare to trash Hasbro wizards are pushing on tabletop so whatever.

Originally posted by Shadowfrog:

The game is a masterpiece and it doesn't go that far like veilguards top surgery scars. So honestly it doesn't bother me.

Originally posted by Wei:

Regarding the question, I don't mind it that much. The game doesn’t go that far. Sure, there were moments that kinda broke my immersion, but the game is still pretty enjoyable and far better than the current industry standard.

Thought I'd gather up the actual answers, in this 8 page thread, to the question OP asked.
The rest... you get a special imaginary medal for your effort.

So sorry. But I think there's a percentage of people who will follow these topics just to see how long it takes for the hair pulling to start, and don't give a flip one way or the other about "wokeness"; it's just a signal to start the popcorn and decant the wine, and don't care so much about answering questions (and possibly starting a fight).

And part of that is nobody seems to realize why the term came into use in the context of games and gaming. *hint: it's not about gaming at all, it's about dragging gender politics into every nook & cranny you can find. The term actually entered the common vernacular in the context of the civil rights movement. Being "woke" was essentially about recognizing and acknowledging that the HUMAN race encompasses a lot more than just the white race.

Certainly, it can be used in the context of gender parity (and I'm not muddying the waters with the complicated issue of gender assignment - I'll save that one for people who enjoy squabbling about it). But just FYI, here's a link to a fairly decent article about Misogyny in the D&D world from early tabletop games to the digital products we play today: https://analoggamestudies.org/2014/10/constructing-the-female-body-in-role-playing-games/

And I'll just say that 'wokeness" is different things to different people. Some good, and some bad, depending on the context you use it in. It doesn't belong to any one demographic, which is why I think it shouldn't be used here to complain or argue about game content. That's just one tiny scrap of a much larger picture, and dare I say? Trivializes it. I could use it in discussing the rampant misogyny I've witnessed in the fantasy gaming genre over the last 50 years or so. But it's been used and abused to the point that it's almost meaningless. Best avoided (IMO) because there is virtually no way to use it without either offending someone, or inviting the cockroaches, with their own personal and often regressed agendas, out of the woodwork.

[Meowsworth]

Lol, just go play Fortnight and eat your Hotpockets already.😂

[NeeLot]

It's impressive how the "game woke" threads made by people who haven't even bought BG3 keep popping up over a year after release.

[DDkiki]

But tbf only time in the game when so called "woke" stuff made me scratch my head in confusion was with gnomes. After you rescue them from duergars it turns out that both pair of gnomes were actual gay pair(M+M and F+F), which honestly id not see much in a deep gnome society. Its just bizarre moment.

i mean i loved conflict of Bracus and Wulbren relationships but even most named side NPCs being like this kinda ruins immersion and feel weird to me.

Just deep gnomes were imo the worst candidate for it, id imagine more stuff like this in actual city, not from isolated society that need to...procreate.

[alanc9]

Most? Please.

[alanc9]

Originally posted by NeeLot:

It's impressive how the "game woke" threads made by people who haven't even bought BG3 keep popping up over a year after release.

In fairness, if you owned the game on GoG, you'd still come here to whine about it.

[Grass toucher]

I agree, this game would've been 10x better if it left out the woke elements.