Never liked Rogue classes in RPGs, tell me why I should.

[Akboris]

Rogue classes have always felt kind of not satisfying to play, you are more stealth oriented and non-confrontational, and look to do extra damage to enemies that are distracted and stuff right?

Thing is that I like Astarion, I think he is based but I dont like Rogues or how they play, is there like a cool build for him or perhaps I could respec him as a fighter or something cool?

[The Yeen Queen]

There's no reason why you "should". If they're not your thing, they're not your thing. Different strokes for different folks, as they say.

[Thomas D.]

I think a dexterity based dual wield build could fit him. Like 3x Thiefs, 6x Sword Bard or something like this.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Rogies are terrible in 5e and BG3 too.

[alanc9]

Rogue dips are good, though.

[jonnin]

this version of the rogue is possibly the worst ever, so its hard to be convincing. Here, you get 1 sneak attack only per round, and all your other 'special' abilities have been watered down so much that literally anyone can do them as another class (like opening locks and picking pockets and sneaking). Racial sneak is better than being a rogue for those races! Sneak attack literally just replaces the missing attack you should have gotten from leveling up (even bards get another attack!) and even bards get a stance for dual wielding! Rogue literally gets next to nothing that helps in combat and its out of combat stuff is 100% replaced.

Now if you consider a rogue from older versions, pathfinder, or entirely other genres like WOW or something, convincing you would just be a matter of pointing out all those powerful things they can do that are missing here.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

There are mods that srsly improve the Rogue, like giving them a fighting style. Check them out.

[DeathStroke]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Cassandra:

Rogies are terrible in 5e and BG3 too.

everything is terrible in 5e , it was literally designed for people who cant think enough to play DnD properly

[DeathStroke]

Originally posted by Akboris:

Rogue classes have always felt kind of not satisfying to play, you are more stealth oriented and non-confrontational, and look to do extra damage to enemies that are distracted and stuff right?

Thing is that I like Astarion, I think he is based but I dont like Rogues or how they play, is there like a cool build for him or perhaps I could respec him as a fighter or something cool?

you still kind of need him for the utility for traps and locks unless you have that stuff covered yourself. give him a bow and all the speciality arrows and throwables and use him for picking people off or controling the battlefield with grease and other aoes. hes not really meant for fighting in close combat , thats what lazel and karlach are for

[DargonBlak]

Rogue / Bard, or Bard / Rogue, or maybe just Bard ?

i've always wanted to play the leader - the first one in the room - so, a thief-type, always searching, watching and listening, has always made sense for me, but it is rather meh in BG3

i've also played the big oaf, kicking down doors - i can enjoy both

in BG3, i ran a thief/(ranger) right up until the near-end decisioning in Act 3 - had them as a Sniper - loads of damage - secondary as a poison dual-wielder - became very repetitive (maxxed out in level very early in Act 3)

i just finished playing 100+ hours with a Bard - nice alternative, with lots of cool spell options

im not gonna finish that game - gonna go test a Paladin again

So for Astarion, a flamboyant Bard who throws around almost wild magic is a good fit, imo

[Mike Garrison]

There is no need to play with a rogue in your party.

Just use Withers to respec Astarion to something else, if you like his character. Unlike, say, Shadowheart, Gale, or Wyll, Astarion's quest and character plotline make no direct reference to him being a rogue. He could be anything.

As for locks, well, as Gale might say, "Surely there is a spell for this sort of thing." Anything up to DC15 can be picked by anyone with decent DEX. And that is most locks. Anything higher than that, you can just knock open if you want to. Or use a sledgehammer on.

[Namdoolb]

Originally posted by Akboris:

Thing is that I like Astarion, I think he is based but I dont like Rogues or how they play, is there like a cool build for him or perhaps I could respec him as a fighter or something cool?

Nothing wrong with a respec....
My personal fave for astarion is gloomstalker ranger:

5 levels into ranger, subclass into gloomstalker. 4 levels into rogue, subclass into thief, 3 levels into fighter, subclass into battlemaster.

Set yourself up for dual wielding, whatever finesse weapons you can get your hands on... shortswords, daggers, scimitars... Use dual hand crossbows for ranged.

Makes for a very nasty ranged attacker (can still fight well in melee), and can still do most of the important rogue stuff (picking locks, disarming traps etc).

The build is pretty well documented; you can find youtube videos on the exact details relatively easily, so I won't spoil it with specifics. It's more fun if you play around with it and figure things out IMO.

[Sentient_Toaster]

They're reliable skill monkeys between Expertise at low levels, a decent number of proficiencies, and Reliable Talent at high level.

Some of the reasons why they might be relevant in tabletop don't exist at all in BG3. For instance, your party wizard doesn't have to start the day with "Knock" prepared to be able to cast it; it just needs to be in his spellbook, because he can change his prepared spells anytime he's not in combat and then switch back to his rock-and-roll loadout. In addition, while in tabletop it's extremely not stealthy -- making a sound so loud that it's audible from 300' away, beyond the normal recognizable-as-spellcasting sounds required for a spell with verbal components -- that doesn't matter in BG3, either.

Thief 3 is a pretty legit dip in BG3 for builds that would like another bonus action, though, like monks that want another Flurry of Blows. That particular feature is stronger in BG3 than in D&D 5E.

[Gorem]

They are bad, unless you use greater invisible,

Then they can get their sneak attack bonus on every single turn.

[[TG] zac]

The only thing rogue is really good for is if you multi class it with ranger or bard as a skill monkey with sharpshooter and duel hand cross bows for damage.
The split usually ends up with either 3 or 5 thief rogue and 5 ranger or 6 swords bard for the extra attack and utility effects they get.

The thing that really limits rogue is that it never gets a second attack and sneak attack can only be done once per turn (Pathfinder2 handles it better where you get the extra D6s at a slower pace per level but can can do second or 3rd attacks and can trigger sneak attack every time you hit)

[DeMasked]

Originally posted by Akboris:

Rogue classes have always felt kind of not satisfying to play, you are more stealth oriented and non-confrontational, and look to do extra damage to enemies that are distracted and stuff right?

Thing is that I like Astarion, I think he is based but I dont like Rogues or how they play, is there like a cool build for him or perhaps I could respec him as a fighter or something cool?

In fights the Rogue isn't as good as other classes damage wise though I'd say they have some versatility in said fights and more utility outside of fights. I feel like they need mods to improve their damage in fights because Sneak Attack doesn't scale too well in the late game - early game it's fine but it quickly becomes out shined by other classes either due to the classes themselves, subclasses, items or potions.

Rogue as a Whole:
-Sneak Attack is a high damage increase added to your weapon once every round. This can apply to Main Action Attacks or Bonus Action Attacks and Savage Attacker Feat can now impact the melee Sneak Attack (damage die are rolled twice with the bigger number being chosen - I think this is like a 20% damage increase generally?). Level 11 you roll 6d6 for Sneak Attack damage so 6-36 damage on top of weapon damage and whatever else damage you have - Critical Hits double this damage, Vulnerability also can double or triple if including a Critical Hit.

-Cunning Actions are Main Actions that can be used with Bonus Actions adding more versatility in combat when it comes to Disengaging, Sneaking, Dashing,

-Uncanny Dodge and Evasion are defensive passives that you get at higher levels for damage mitigation or outright damage avoidance. These can occur once per round using your Reaction to half the damage of an incoming weapon attack or certain spells / occurrences that require Dexterity as a saving throw.

-Skill Checks you get Expertise at level 1 and 6 each one giving you two Skills to Double their Proficiency so at level 6 Rogue that would be 4 skills that are doubled on top of that at level 11 you get Reliable Talent where the minimum you can roll for Skill Checks you are Proficient in to be a 10. So this is where Rogue has that utility outside of combat.

-4 Feats, like Fighter the Rogue can get 4 Feats at level 12.

Subclasses:

Thief: Generally picked for level 3 getting an extra Bonus Action for Multiclassing with other classes. Isn't generally uses to get high levels for Rogue except maybe 4 for a Feat but eh, probably not. Later passives aren't that useful imo. Having that second Bonus Action can be really good.

Assassin: Again generally picked for level 3 maybe 4 for Feat as the later passive is just Disguise Self which is stupid imo. The level 3 passives are really good but only pertain to the starting of fights so after 1 round they are no longer useful. Can be really good for doing high burst damage at the start of a fight if surprising enemies - you can technically try to duck in and out of combat to get some of the bonuses repeatedly.

Arcane Trickster: Pretty much a very watered down Wizard with a Sneak Attack. I feel like this subclass you'd want to invest more into and like Multiclass with like 1-3 level of Wizard so you get access to more spells and level 3 spells. Or you could start with like 1 Fighter and then go the rest into Arcane Trickster for a more tanky build with using Heavy Armour, getting Proficiency in Constitution for Spell Concentration and you can run into combat with higher Armour Class due to Heavy Armour using your Bonus Action Attack for Sneak Attack and Main Action for mostly Utility Spells, Cantrips (that scale automatically) and Spell Scrolls (which can be high level spells). I'm actually trying this Mage Tank Rogue character out for fun.

Arcane Trickster can also hit enemies with spells that make them disadvantaged with saving rolls if they are sneaking at level 9. Can be quite good. Other classes can also do this.

If going heavy into Rogue I'd go with Arcane Trickster otherwise Thief and Assassin are more multiclass options imo. In general there are just better classes then Rogue and it's subclasses which is why I mention the mods like getting a Fighting Style, making using Poison as a free action, making Arcane Trickster's Mage Hand better, etc... I've seen another mod that allows for multiple Sneak Attacks / round at diminishing damage (which is where Thief with Main Action Attack +2 Bonus Action Attack could be good with 3 Sneak Attacks - also Assassin would benefit from that mod).