Zhentarim Basement on honor mode shows how bad roleplaying in this game actually is

[Slip]

So I am playing on honor mode, and for now I really hate it, most checks are like a trap. You either succeed a check and its fine, or you fail a check and ♥♥♥♥ explodes, there is no roleplaying involved whatsoever.

And this place shows it best, the lady that questions you what you are doing here, I failed a detect though checks, and it went instantly to combat, even though I had other means to convince here, but ofc game doesnt give you any other options (and I am not counting inspiration).

So what happens after I fail detect thought? She yells aaaa MAGIC, like first of all, why would a rogue be able to detect magic? Second, she is across the chasm, I am 0 threat to hear, so why cant I continue conversation? Especially since I have the items she wants.
No, the best thing to do for a zenith agent, who are evil, and wouldnt give a ♥♥♥♥ even if you did some shady ♥♥♥♥, they blow up their own supplies to stop me from approaching....

Larian failed to give us different choices for many things, which is what a dm would do, most failed checks ending in fight, is just bad, boring and not in spirit of dnd at all.

I much preferred nwn2 way of doing it, dice was reserved for combat, and rest was you either have enough points or not, it might not be the best way, but it sure as hell beats this.

Game is also extremely easy for a dnd game, so playing honor mode for harder combat is also a fail.
I also had bugs with stuff not triggering in combat, like the part with cave and gnolls, not triggering convo for me to be able to mind control him, owl cub, etc.

[The Yeen Queen]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Slip:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Night Foxx:

So, to you, "bad roleplay" is "not being able TO ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ VIOLATE PEOPLE IN ONE OF THE WORST WAYS POSSIBLE without consequences". Cool. Yes, the devs could have programmed it differently. They could have also programmed the guards not to react when you murder a kid in front of them. But they wanted you to play smart, not act like you can get away with whatever the ♥♥♥♥ you want without consequences. Because that would be bad roleplay.

There are many instances, where one rule is applied, while in other instance the same rule is applied differently.
It is impossible to be consistent throughout the game, so yes, they could have done this part the way I would have liked, but they didnt.

Saying it again, more options is not a bad thing. Dunno why you would want less options in a crpg.

You had a ♥♥♥♥ ton of options in that encounter. YOU CHOSE THE WRONG ONE. And, yeah, not everyone reacts as badly when they sense a mind reading attempt. Not everyone is a high ranking member of a violent criminal organization that you violated in their own hideout full of their footsoldiers. Why is this so difficult for you to understand?

Edit: I will give you an example, when you first reach the swamp, you do an investigation check to notice an illusion, you fail it. So what now? I cant progress quest further? Nop they added few more checks down to road, to dispel the illusion. I would like the same thing for the quest with zents. So again, why is that a bad thing?

Okay. The illusion over the swamp isn't an intelligent entity that you've endangered by actively attacking its privacy. It doesn't have the capacity to respond to your attempts to see through it like a person does to your attempts to INVADE THEIR ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ MIND. Your comparison is apples to oranges.

[Slip]

You are way to emotional over this, and taking it way to seriously.

I know what is fun for me, I express what I think would be fun for me, maybe dev takes notice, maybe not.

But you, are taking it to the extremes, and interjecting your opinions as facts, when its just a opinion, same as mine.

Devs change stuff all the time with patches, they could tommorow change something about this encounter, and then I would be right, and you wrong. It all depends what devs choose to do, not your moral code, or opinion.

Take a step back, chill a bit, and realise that this is a game, something that is subject to a change, and there is nothing objective about it, but its current state, which can change at any moment with a patch.

And my opinion is my own, you can ♥♥♥♥ on it, but its still my opinion, you not respecting it tells me more about you as a person.


Edit: Also you keep talking about consequences, a bad roll of a dice is not a consequence, you talking like this is real life, is mental

[northernwater]

I like this fight. Lot's of places to hide and lot's of high/low ground. I always buy the Titanstring bow from Brem (he doesn't drop it as loot does he?) before aggression. Great place for a Rogue Assassin. If you don't blow stuff up you can still save Oskar.

[The Yeen Queen]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Slip:

You are way to emotional over this, and taking it way to seriously.

I am getting frustrated dealing with someone who is stubbornly refusing to think rationally because he's pissed off over not liking the consequences of an objectively evil decision he made.

[Sonic Titan]

This is a hilarious thread. "I'd like a second chance after getting caught violating the mind (which I did not have to do, but did anyway) of the leader of a criminal sect" is certainly a view.

I don't think you're being denied role-playing options because you made a silly choice (that you could have avoided altogether) and rolled poorly.

[Slip]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Night Foxx:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Slip:

You are way to emotional over this, and taking it way to seriously.

I am getting frustrated dealing with someone who is stubbornly refusing to think rationally because he's pissed off over not liking the consequences of an objectively evil decision he made.

There is nothing rational about a video games, it is a medium to have fun.

I can have my own opinions, and to the topic above, you already have few instances where you can fail detect thought, and it doesnt turn into a blood bath.

I can agree, that some fails should be met with instant aggro. But not this one.
Think from a dm perspective, you crafted this whole story line, and it turns into a fight, ignoring a lot of content you thought of, dm would try to save it in any way possible, unless ofc he is dming a bloodthirty band of barbarians with 3 int or something.

Its all about perspective, and different opinions, and what dm or in this case devs had in mind. You are welcome to ♥♥♥♥ on my opinion, but saying it is invalid is just bad.

I dont tell you, your opinion is bad, from your game time I can see you really enjoy the game.
But if you check my profile, you will see well over 30+ crpg titles, and I do have a strong opinion, and very many games behind me to know what I enjoy in it, and what not.
And if there is a chance, for dev to consider changing somehting, why would I not voice my opinion? Forums are here for a reason, title is a bit of a click bait, but if it wasnt, I am pretty sure, none would even check it, cuz that is todays forums.

[Amazing, But Truth!]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Slip:

So I am playing on honor mode, and for now I really hate it, most checks are like a trap. You either succeed a check and its fine, or you fail a check and ♥♥♥♥ explodes, there is no roleplaying involved whatsoever.

And this place shows it best, the lady that questions you what you are doing here, I failed a detect though checks, and it went instantly to combat, even though I had other means to convince here, but ofc game doesnt give you any other options (and I am not counting inspiration).

So what happens after I fail detect thought? She yells aaaa MAGIC, like first of all, why would a rogue be able to detect magic? Second, she is across the chasm, I am 0 threat to hear, so why cant I continue conversation? Especially since I have the items she wants.
No, the best thing to do for a zenith agent, who are evil, and wouldnt give a ♥♥♥♥ even if you did some shady ♥♥♥♥, they blow up their own supplies to stop me from approaching....

Larian failed to give us different choices for many things, which is what a dm would do, most failed checks ending in fight, is just bad, boring and not in spirit of dnd at all.

I much preferred nwn2 way of doing it, dice was reserved for combat, and rest was you either have enough points or not, it might not be the best way, but it sure as hell beats this.

Game is also extremely easy for a dnd game, so playing honor mode for harder combat is also a fail.
I also had bugs with stuff not triggering in combat, like the part with cave and gnolls, not triggering convo for me to be able to mind control him, owl cub, etc.

Grow up and play it again

[The Yeen Queen]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Slip:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Night Foxx:

I am getting frustrated dealing with someone who is stubbornly refusing to think rationally because he's pissed off over not liking the consequences of an objectively evil decision he made.

There is nothing rational about a video games, it is a medium to have fun.

That's nice. I was talking about YOU and not the game, you ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ moron.

yes, mods, ban me again. I'm done with this idiot. He's blocked.

[Arathorn85]

You attempted to violate someone on a deeply personnel level and your upset that they took personal issue with that and then implicitly they made a follow made a follow assumption you were a snake in the hen house? Given your an outsider who conventionally came along and saved their comrades who did not have a way to ask for help.

I mean I feel they were pretty rational here.

[Slip]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Night Foxx:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Slip:

There is nothing rational about a video games, it is a medium to have fun.

That's nice. I was talking about YOU and not the game, you ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ moron.

yes, mods, ban me again. I'm done with this idiot. He's blocked.

Thats your first mistake, topic is about game, not me.

Considering you get banned alot, it explains things.

[Slip]

Ursprungligen skrivet av AokiYakumo:

Ursprungligen skrivet av Slip:

For someone who blocked me, you sure reply a lot.

But Astarion memes check out, with accordance to the way you write.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGfe2aYlIr0

Sorry, I dont get it. Pretty offtopic to, but nothing else to expect here.

Having a normal conversation is rough on the internet.

[Slip]

Ursprungligen skrivet av Amazing, But Truth!:

Grow up and play it again

I did, long ago, you seem to have problem with it though.

[Irrigatio]

Ursprungligen skrivet av northernwater:

I like this fight. Lot's of places to hide and lot's of high/low ground. I always buy the Titanstring bow from Brem (he doesn't drop it as loot does he?) before aggression. Great place for a Rogue Assassin. If you don't blow stuff up you can still save Oskar.

from what i understand there is a hidden background dice roll on what stuff vendors drop from their inventory on death - only know this due to having seen mods that apparently make all these hidden dice rolls be perfect so all possible loot is there - same roll happens in each campaign for every single lootable container from what i read. just not sure when this is rolled but as this topic was about honor mode does not matter i guess

[Psych015]

I don't understand what the issue is.
You failed a detect thoughts on someone who was already on edge, in a criminal org, and looking for an item you stole. Why would she give you a second chance to "bargain" when they can take the item from your corpse?
The environment and previous encounters with her agents should have been a red flag, to walk on egg shells.
You ♥♥♥♥♥♥ around with the wrong people, and found out.

EDIT: The spell description also lets you know that people will notice it on a successful save, like many other spells.

[gurugeorge]

The OP is right, the Zhentarim hideout is a complete mess, it's way undercooked. The fact that they would blow up their own ♥♥♥♥ to get you (if you go that route) is completely retarded, for a start. The interactions with the girlboss are also retarded, depending on how you interacted with the guys in the cave.

Sometimes the game surprises and impresses with the intricacy of its reactivity and C&C, that place isn't one of those occasions.