Honour mode/Unpopular opinions:

[Kellar]

First off I just wanna say that BG3 is already a great game (maybe one of the most impressive games out there, at least that I've experienced). I got very little negative things to say about it at all! However:

While I do realize that the honour mode player base is the far minority, I still think there's a few things that is possibly taking away some of the ''honour'' in the honour mode difficulty, which would not be that hard to fix.

Number one: Withers!
While I do love Withers, I only see positives about removing him completely from honour mode.

1: You can no longer keep a single character in your camp and just 3 man the entire run, effectively with unlimited tries. You afraid of failing? No problem. Just leave a 4th character in camp. Talk to Withers - ress your party at no risk! At least this way, you would have to bring your character there, res them with a scroll and risk getting in combat, to a point where you might as well bring all 4.

2: Hirelings. Hirelings are one of the most daunting ways to abuse your way to victory. Just buff your entire party with Longstrider, Aid, Warding Bond, Bardic Inspiration etc... You get the idea. This makes little sense in a Honour mode run, imo.

3: Respeccing. Your build now matters. No more respeccing to fire resistance for this fight, into a Bard for this dialogue, etc. You need to start putting thought into your build from the very start.

''But what about changing classes for your companions?''
On this, I totally agree. We should be able to set our companions to be the class you want. Just simply have them start as level 1 whenever you pick them up, and from there you have one time to select a starting class & subclass for the rest of the game (no more Shadowheart trickery, yay).

4: Partial rests. This needs to be gone. You now need to conserve your resources. Ill explain further down bellow. I also think Long rests should be at least set to 100 cost on Honour mode.

Edit: (Partial rest is not the same thing as short rest)

Number two: Stealing.
Stealing NEEDS to be nerfed. Currently, you can simply take any character with no bonus to Sleight of Hand, steal Aarons (or any NPC for that matter) gold, fail. repeat. Every time you fail, he adds gold (based on your lvl) to his inventory. So it doesn't matter how many times you fail. Eventually, he will stock up 40-50- 60k gold, and when you eventually succeed your 5% chance, you get all the gold. For free. And no, it doesn't matter how many times you fail. The NPC will dislike you, but he will only turn temporarily hostile on failed stealing. So each time you fail, you simply escape battle and try again.

This works with items as well. And every time you Partial rest, you can restock the NPC gold, items etc. for free.

How to partially fix:
Once the NPC reputation goes into the red, he should stay permanently hostile with that character (or all in that characters party, even), making you at least have to use disguise for this, which makes more sense. And with partial rest gone, you cant just steal everything from a NPC 40 times. For free.

What are your thoughts on this? Do you agree/Disagree? Why? Please do comment bellow.

[Baldurs_Gate_2]

You can challenge yourself with doing that.

[AokiYakumo]

Instruction unclear, I murdered Dammon on accident and now Mizora wants my arsehole.

[jonnin]

short rest is crucial for a number of classes like monk and warlock. You go from 8 spells (warlock and bard) down to 2 per long rest (and it breaks a major bard ability too). That is class-breaking, changing one of the best classes into arguably the worst period (or second worst behind pure rogue). Monks are not quite so bad off with KI but there are a number of other items and perks that are rest on short rests which are a big deal.
So I disagree about getting rid of the short rests: they are part of D&D rules and critical to many builds.
Stealing does need a nerf. If you get caught, it should be a big deal.

Hirelings etc... mixed feelings. Your party is what it is, and taking only 4 people to a fight against 20 guys when you HAVE 8 guys who COULD GO but decide to stay in the camp and tend the fire... NO, that is nonsense.

[anachoret]

Some of those requests are available in Custom mode.

[Steffan]

I mean... if you can beat the game with 3 characters... probably you do not need to leave the 4th character in camp at first place.

I definitely like respeccing in an Honour mode (without abusing it). Can't I experiment with my builds?

Originally posted by Baldurs_Gate_2:

You can challenge yourself with doing that.

+1

In general, I like Honour Mode how it is. You can always cheese the game but it is up to the player to restrain themselves.

[Kellar]

Originally posted by jonnin:

short rest is crucial for a number of classes like monk and warlock. You go from 8 spells (warlock and bard) down to 2 per long rest (and it breaks a major bard ability too). That is class-breaking, changing one of the best classes into arguably the worst period (or second worst behind pure rogue). Monks are not quite so bad off with KI but there are a number of other items and perks that are rest on short rests which are a big deal.
So I disagree about getting rid of the short rests: they are part of D&D rules and critical to many builds.
Stealing does need a nerf. If you get caught, it should be a big deal.

Hirelings etc... mixed feelings. Your party is what it is, and taking only 4 people to a fight against 20 guys when you HAVE 8 guys who COULD GO but decide to stay in the camp and tend the fire... NO, that is nonsense.

Short rest and partual rest are 2 different things.

Partial rest is the free long rest with 50% spellslot effect.

Originally posted by steffan8:

I mean... if you can beat the game with 3 characters... probably you do not need to leave the 4th character in camp at first place.

I definitely like respeccing in an Honour mode (without abusing it). Can't I experiment with my builds?

Originally posted by Baldurs_Gate_2:

You can challenge yourself with doing that.

+1

In general, I like Honour Mode how it is. You can always cheese the game but it is up to the player to restrain themselves.

You can experiment all you want in balanced or tactician. For the cheese part, you are saying it shouldnt be fixed cus you can "restrain yourself"?

[Garuda One]

Honour mode is fine as it is. Many players play with their own self-established ruleset and play the way they think is best. Make up your own rules and follow them without attempting to have the entire mode that, frankly, I see very little criticism about in general be adjusted to how -you- think it should be played. Let individual players play it their own way.

Point is, I just don't see the purpose of making changes like this when you can basically self-enforce most of them yourself. No reason for the rest of the playerbase to have to follow your premise for the mode.

[Steffan]

Originally posted by Kellar:

You can experiment all you want in balanced or tactician. For the cheese part, you are saying it shouldnt be fixed cus you can "restrain yourself"?

There is nothing to fix here. ;)

Not allowing to experiment in Honour mode is silly (and boring). Why? Just because people can abuse it? There are myriad of ways to cheese that game. Why should my experience suffer because somebody else can not restrain themselves?

[RhiTheWitch]

Seems like an unnecessary change for things that are fully optional to engage in. There's no benefit to them removing it when most players highly utilize those features and the people who don't want to use them can just do that - not use them.

Why would they take away something the majority uses to please a very very small percent of players

[Kellar]

I think you guys are missing the point here.

The idea is to have a proper honour mode that makes the game more realistic/strategic, which doesn't allow/motivate and reward the use of weird game mechanics that makes no sense and is clearly not intended. It prevents use of glitches without having to put in a high amount of effort to hold yourself back and not make the game impossible to lose (which is why they added honor mode in the first place)

Ofcourse it can never be perfect. But I feel like some of theese are a big oversight:)

It sounds to me like you guys would enjoy tactician just as much (which is fine, and I totally respect and love that)

[RhiTheWitch]

Originally posted by Kellar:

I think you guys are missing the point here.

The idea is to have a proper honour mode that makes the game more realistic/strategic, which doesn't allow/motivate and reward the use of weird game mechanics that makes no sense and is clearly not intended. It prevents use of glitches without having to put in a high amount of effort to hold yourself back and not make the game impossible to lose (which is why they added honor mode in the first place)

It sounds to me like you giys would enjoy tactician just as much (which is fine, and i totally respect)

Your original comment before you deleted it was "I respect all opinions" then you didn't get a reply from people who already explained why they didnt agree and now its

"You guys are missing the point!!! You guys belong on Tactician!!!"

Like, if it wasn't obvious this was a poorly laid ego trap for you to pat yourself on the back for being "the best most hardest most honorable honor gamer" it is now.

Everyone understood your point just fine. They just disagreed. Realistically, it is a business decision which you are too stuck in your own head thinking everyone else is just taking it too easy to see. It's a bad idea, and one that would negatively impact their player numbers.

[Steffan]

Originally posted by Kellar:

It sounds to me like you guys would enjoy tactician just as much (which is fine, and I totally respect and love that)

The main value of the Honour mode for me is the unique Legendary actions of the bosses. That is my sole reason to go Honour. I don't reload anyway.

That being said, I am against investing resources to 'police' the Honour Mode. I would prefer these efforts to go to adding cut content and solving bugs

[RhiTheWitch]

Also for the record, I play Honor mode and DONT use withers or hirelings, dont partial rest, steal from any traders, or respec my characters on that mode. Still think your point is moot OP

Edit: and never knew or heard about leaving someone in camp but I wouldnt do that on any mode. Sounds like you just want an excuse to judge how other people play

[Kellar]

Originally posted by RhiTheWitch:

Originally posted by Kellar:

I think you guys are missing the point here.

The idea is to have a proper honour mode that makes the game more realistic/strategic, which doesn't allow/motivate and reward the use of weird game mechanics that makes no sense and is clearly not intended. It prevents use of glitches without having to put in a high amount of effort to hold yourself back and not make the game impossible to lose (which is why they added honor mode in the first place)

It sounds to me like you giys would enjoy tactician just as much (which is fine, and i totally respect)

Your original comment before you deleted it was "I respect all opinions" then you didn't get a reply from people who already explained why they didnt agree and now its

"You guys are missing the point!!! You guys belong on Tactician!!!"

Like, if it wasn't obvious this was a poorly laid ego trap for you to pat yourself on the back for being "the best most hardest most honorable honor gamer" it is now.

Not at all. My suggestions are simply leaning towards keeping the integrity of honor mode to make it better. If you are only here toadd personal insult instead of adding constrictive feedback please go somewhere else, if not I'd love to hear your opinion on the topics themself that I listed.

[Garuda One]

Again, why are we so concerned about the 'integrity' of honor mode? If you beat it the way you want to, with your own self-imposed rules, is that not good enough for you?

The only explanation I can see for it not being good enough is the desire for 'bragging rights' of sorts which to me is a completely non-starter reason for a game dev to put time and resources into when the tools and freedom to make it more self-exclusive already exists.

So to your OP- it's a waste of time in general. This issue would be at the absolute bottom of the barrel of priorities I'd want Larian putting time into.