Emperor and Orpheus

[mattia_piscitelli]

Hello everyone,

I read that there is a chance to let Orpheus and Emperor together but also I would like to know if after freed Orpheus is possible to avoid to turn a Mind Flayer, because I really don’t want that.

Thank you!

[Boombastic]

You will always need 1 mind flayer in the party.
Depending on your choices during the playthrough, this can be a different char or yourself. you, emperor, Orpheus or Karlach

[Gwonbush]

Originally posted by Boombastic:

You will always need 1 mind flayer in the party.
Depending on your choices during the playthrough, this can be a different char or yourself. you, emperor, Orpheus or Karlach

There is a convoluted option that requires nobody to become a mind flayer. First, you need Gale in your party.

When you are at the become illithid choice, you need to back out and talk to Gale about the option of him blowing up instead. Suggest to the Emperor that you'll become illithid, but later. He gives you a tadpole than can trigger your illithid transformation at any time.

Best to also have Laezel in the party so you can easily betray him as he tries to kill Orpheus. Then you free Orpheus and can suggest that you don't need anybody to become a mind as Gale can deal with the Absolute himself. Orpheus doesn't fully trust what Gale claims, but with you having the tadpole as a backup method, he's fine with going along with the Gale Boom plan.


Of course, some of the dialogue is a bit glitchy in this path and it treats you like you did become illithid despite it not happening.

[Boombastic]

Ah Ok. I was not aware of this option.

[mattia_piscitelli]

Ah okay okay, but if I can manage to let Orpheus and the Emperor to work together then it should be fine?
There will be no need to let Gale blowing up himself?

[SecretDragonSludge (Drugs)]

Wait did they add in a recent patch the ability to convince them to work together. Because my biggest gripe with the game is the Emperor just acting completely out of character in the end of act 3 if you do free Orpheus.

[mattia_piscitelli]

Probably yes, I found the guideline on the Larian studios forum that I had to pass two hard persuasion to let them have a truce

[mattia_piscitelli]

https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=923746

[Delivor]

Originally posted by The Sludge is Life:

Wait did they add in a recent patch the ability to convince them to work together. Because my biggest gripe with the game is the Emperor just acting completely out of character in the end of act 3 if you do free Orpheus.

It's because he was pretending all the time and was messing with you. If you would push him and disagree you would see his dark side much earlier, including calling you his puppet and showing how he mindcontrolled his girlfriend in the past as a threat. I think that it's cool that they've made it look like he is a nice guy and that you may end up thinking this way even after completing the game. But if to dig deeper he is the worst manipulating villian. It's lame to side with him even in an evil path.

[seeker1]

Originally posted by mattia_piscitelli:

Probably yes, I found the guideline on the Larian studios forum that I had to pass two hard persuasion to let them have a truce

Spoilers? Thread is not spoiler marked despite the rather spoilery topic of discussion.

That link doesn't work, BUT I found the thread I think you were pointing to.

Those are not guidelines. That's somebody's suggestion of how it SHOULD work.

There is no truce between Emperor and Orpheus. Not that, at this point, I would want to achieve one. Ending Emperor's existence is a worthy goal, even if he's not lying about who he was originally. And as for the promise of ending Vlaakith's existence, well, I look forward to that future resolution.

My Bae'Zel deserves nothing less.

[mattia_piscitelli]

Okay I understood now. I do apologize to to do not mark as spoiler.

So basically morality who is better to be with in the end?

[seeker1]

Spoiler:

Choose the manipulative lying mindflayer who basically views you as his thrall and puppet, admits he psionically dominated and disabled Duke Stellmane; and who will a) gladly side with the Netherbrain against you or b) gladly dominate you and your party if he dominates the Netherbrain and c) just, might be an Ultralithid who tadpoled you and wants to become an Elder Brain himself. Oh, and appears to have tried to seduce you in order to manipulate you and/or embarrass you in front of your romanced partner.

Or

The admittedly petulant Githyanki prince Orpheus who is willing to sacrifice himself to become a mindflayer to save the universe from the Grand Design; or if the player makes another choice, is willing to liberate his people from their bondage to a Lich Queen, Vlaakith, who basically seems to be feasting on their souls.

Put this way, don't you think the choice is clear?

[mattia_piscitelli]

I have been reading all around the internet and your answer is the best I could find.
It’s pretty clear now!

Thank you!

[Lostmikeys]

Tbh, I couldn't bring myself to ever side with the emperor after finding out what he did to his supposed best friend.

[Mike Garrison]

Assuming Tales of the Sword Coast is canon, the guy who turned into the Emperor was not a nice guy even before he became a mind flayer. He was more of a pirate and slaver. His fame came from the loot that he brought home with him, not because of his personal qualities.

And the established lore is that while a mind flayer has some memories of the person it was before, it is *not* the person it was before. It is a mind flayer.

Orpheus retains enough of his memories that he asks to be killed, because he knows that as a mind flayer he will ultimately be an enemy to his former people.

The Emperor is not an atypical mind flayer. (Omeluum may be. But mind flayers are capable of playing a very long game of deception, so it's hard to say for sure.)

[mattia_piscitelli]

I do agree with you, Orpheus is much better person than the Emperor.
But was very shocking when I found who was the Emperor before to turn a Mind Flayer!