Minthara at Moonrise towers question

[Omnius10]

I beat Minthara unconscious in the goblin camp , after all i read she should then be in Moonrise towers prison where you can rescue and recruit her. But in the sequence with Ketheric , there were only the 3 goblins and no Minthara elsewhere. Did i missed something ?

[EricHVela]

There are other requirements: Specifically, she has to be "temporarily hostile" (and she will be noted as such if she is). This condition can be created by stealing in front of her and starting a fight or attacking (not killing) something in front of her and starting a fight. If the occupants of the ruined temple are already hostile, she will be fully hostile and knocking her out will make the game consider her dead, instead. Don't talk to her and start a fight that way, either.

A dialog might start if you steal or hit something. That should be okay as well. It's her normal story-specific dialog that can't be used to start a fight.

Then, she can be knocked out and the game will consider her alive but also as one of the defeated bosses of the ruined temple.

[KRON]

It's important how exactly did you beat Minthara unconscious. She should've had "temporarily hostile" status for this to work. If you started combat through dialogue then it's over for her.

[seeker1]

Oh my, it is almost a guarantee this question is gonna keep appearing.

Let me cut to the chase: if you didn't KO her while she was tagged "temporarily hostile" it is not going to work. (Also, other things in a guide. But that's the key one.)

EDIT: LOL, posted this just as two others made the same point.

[ahsanford]

Larian, you can make threads like this with upset gamers stop happening any time you like.

I have seen at a least 10 threads where folks tried to 'recruit' Minth this way, only to blow another 10-20h (remember, no Creche yet and most of the UD likely not yet seen for gamers at this point) before they know if it worked.

Just make any way/circumstance of fighting Minthara end with a cutscene of her seemingly falling to her death in the crevice nearby and then make her alive at Moonrise for ALL to see.

Cheesing a recruitable Minth into a 'save the grove' playthrough should not be considered a reward for this inane 'temp hostile' method. Let everyone opt in / opt out of springing her from Moonrise.

- A

[ahsanford]

All of these threads end with 'hahaha silly gamer, you wasted a ton of gametime not pulling off the cheese correctly because you didn't read the fine print and couldn't possibly verify that you did it right without investing that ton of time.'

What gamer on earth enjoys that experience?

Larian: end this. Please.

- A

[Fractured]

Originally posted by ahsanford:

Larian, you can make threads like this with upset gamers stop happening any time you like.

I have seen at a least 10 threads where folks tried to 'recruit' Minth this way, only to blow another 10-20h (remember, no Creche yet and most of the UD likely not yet seen for gamers at this point) before they know if it worked.

Just make any way/circumstance of fighting Minthara end with a cutscene of her seemingly falling to her death in the crevice nearby and then make her alive at Moonrise for ALL to see.

Cheesing a recruitable Minth into a 'save the grove' playthrough should not be considered a reward for this inane 'temp hostile' method. Let everyone opt in / opt out of springing her from Moonrise.

- A

Alternatively, just beating her unconscious should suffice, it makes sense enough. Not this whole, she has to be "temporarily hostile" bit. I talked to her, and something I said made her hostile, and because of that the game considers her dead. Which is stupid.

[EricHVela]

I'm trying to be helpful. I had the same issue, but I found posts that explained what I did wrong, and I was able to do it. They're not always easy to find, and some do a poor job of explaining it.

Yes. I find it cheesy given the visual, peripheral glitch it causes at camp that doesn't affect the gameplay otherwise at all, but I can't judge having done it myself.

Summary: Make sure she's temporarily hostile. There are guides on how to do that. There are many that refer to aggroing vendors by stealing from them and how to fix their aggro post-theft (as intended by the game since there's a hint directly related to it on loading screens... if they last long enough to read them). This works for knocking her out, too.

There's another situation where a temporarily hostile knockout is beneficial to alter a situation that the game actually recognizes and fully accepts. So, I can't claim it's 100% certainly cheese when the game has no issue with it in another situation. It's just that weird camp thing with Minthara that makes me think it's not intended like that.

That weird camp thing only happens if another NPC is recruited as well, though.

[ahsanford]

Originally posted by EricHVela:

I'm trying to be helpful.

Of course. We get that.

I’m just saying the people asking for that help generally are coming here after their method didn’t work *and going back to fix it requires replaying about a quarter of the game*.

It’s the second part that is brutal. Larian needs to end that ASAP, and they absolutely can.

- A

[seeker1]

Originally posted by ahsanford:

All of these threads end with 'hahaha silly gamer, you wasted a ton of gametime not pulling off the cheese correctly because you didn't read the fine print and couldn't possibly verify that you did it right without investing that ton of time.'

The thing is, "that fine print" is not in the Patch Notes for Patch 5, NOR is there any cues or clues for it in-game. I guess it requires understanding a game mechanic which is non obvious. (Yes, you can test this in other situations, KO'ing another enemy while it is permanently hostile also makes it "dead" from the game's POV. It will not respawn after a LR, whereas unconscious enemies DO.)

You could turn to your Quest Journal but DON'T, because it tells you even if you did it RIGHT, that Minthara is "dead" rather than UNCONSCIOUS. I imagine this might freak people out given they didn't WANT to kill her.

There is a guide that lays everything out, the Guardian Angel constantly reposts it, and I'm someone who frequently uses guides, BUT ... you shouldn't HAVE to for this.

[ahsanford]

Seeker1 — there’s also zero RP sensibility to sizing up Minth from zero prior conversations and say “I think this person I have never met is secretly a future ally. Contrary to how every companion in the same is recruited — via dialogue — I will sneak up on this one and punch her in the back of the head before she gets a chance to decide that we are enemies.’

It makes no sense. END IT.

- A

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by Omnius10:

Minthara at Moonrise towers question
I beat Minthara unconscious in the goblin camp , after all i read she should then be in Moonrise towers prison where you can rescue and recruit her. But in the sequence with Ketheric , there were only the 3 goblins and no Minthara elsewhere. Did i missed something ?

Probably.
Check here if you met all conditions.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3110543554

[The Tempted Man]

use mods to solve this issue, preferably the ringed version as chosen path is bugged afaik, she will appear at MT but you cant talk to her.

[KRON]

Originally posted by ahsanford:

Seeker1 — there’s also zero RP sensibility to sizing up Minth from zero prior conversations and say “I think this person I have never met is secretly a future ally. Contrary to how every companion in the same is recruited — via dialogue — I will sneak up on this one and punch her in the back of the head before she gets a chance to decide that we are enemies.’

It makes no sense. END IT.

- A

Yeah, the problem is that Mithara was meant to be a companion only if you side with the goblins. Then people discovered the sheep exploit and the devs decided to add an easier exploit that didn't require much work to implement.

I wouldn't be surprised if they add a real obvious option to recruit Minthara while saving the grove in future patches.

[Omnius10]

Hehe I didn't even know that a temporarily hostile status exists in this game , still learning new things. I made her hostile trough dialog , so ok without her then.
Thanks for the help.
(Ps the game is to good to be wasted time, maybe i will join her in an evil playtrough)

[seeker1]

Originally posted by The Tempted Man:

use mods to solve this issue, preferably the ringed version as chosen path is bugged afaik, she will appear at MT but you cant talk to her.

Daughter of Lolth mod is supposed to make her flee at 30% HP, then she turns up later at MT. So I've read. Can't use it. Have heard some folks say it's bugged. And yeah, I've seen the other mod by the author that just spawns her from a ring. More foolproof. Both require Script Extender (I can't use it on Mac). BTW, can personally report "sheepthara" exploit still works.

I finally found a mod that can spawn her on Macs, called Debug Book. It's really bizarre, undocumented abandonware, but at least it also appears like Norbyte's SE to get you into the debug console scripts/functions for the game.