Did they nerfed Haste?

[victorvnv]

I can’t find any patch notes about it but at least in Honor Mode, when I cast Haste or use Haste potion, the extra action doesn’t seem to work with multi attack.

For example before , if you have a lvl 5 fighter and cast haste on him he could use action one for 2 hits with multi attack , then action 2 for 2 more hits with multi attack for total of 4 hits.

Now it seems that if I use haste I can do my normal 2 hits, but then action 2 only lets me hit once . So using haste I only hit 3 times instead of 4 .

Anyone else experiencing this? Is it an intended nerf or something that’s honor mode exclusive?

[malkavius77]

Also why are martials called out for having "too many actions" when a sorcerer can obliterate anything and everything in 1 or 2 turns max? And doesn't have to worry about movement or action economy 90% of the time?

[Nobby]

I'm not saying the perilous stake nerf isn't good, but is there any point in using it now? It was completely OP the way it was sure, but isn't it completely irrelevant now?

[HEY]

Publicado originalmente por malkavius77:

Also why are martials called out for having "too many actions" when a sorcerer can obliterate anything and everything in 1 or 2 turns max? And doesn't have to worry about movement or action economy 90% of the time?

Magic should always be stronger than a guy with a big pointy piece of metal. Games do a lot of balancing to keep both inline if not melee stronger. Casters in general are also squishier than melee characters.

[malkavius77]

Publicado originalmente por HEY:

Publicado originalmente por malkavius77:

Also why are martials called out for having "too many actions" when a sorcerer can obliterate anything and everything in 1 or 2 turns max? And doesn't have to worry about movement or action economy 90% of the time?

Magic should always be stronger than a guy with a big pointy piece of metal. Games do a lot of balancing to keep both inline if not melee stronger. Casters in general are also squishier than melee characters.

I can stab thing with a pointy stick so the other guy can stop time and kill everyone in a 3 mile radius. Seems balanced! Also no caster is getting hit more than once unless they really have no clue what they are doing.

[victorvnv]

Honestly the nerfs didn’t do that much damage just old combos won’t be as effective but now instead of warlock 5/ paladin 5/ figher 2, i just go paladin 5/ sorc 5/ figher 2.

I get more spell slots and dual haste and still killed Myrkil in 1 turn using 2 of those lol.

Or as alternative paladin 2/ warlock 8/ figher 2 for big smites …

Still trivializing the game with no issues even on honor

[Babbles]

Publicado originalmente por HEY:

Publicado originalmente por victorvnv:

Any other balance changes like this that anyone is aware of?

• (Honour mode) Lots of weapons that had DRS sources like the Firestoker now just get
  bonus damage.
  
  These include: Assassin's Touch, Deep Delver, Dragon's Grasp, Exterminator's Axe,
  Firestoker, Shortsword of First Blood, Blooded Greataxe, Render of Mind and Body,
  Sword of Life Stealing, Crimson Mischief, Duellist's Prerogative
  
  As far as I can tell, a single weapon has survived the purge: The humble Rat Bat
  (Charlie will be relieved). Nobody tell Larian!
  
  
• (Honour mode) Phalar Aluve: Shriek no longer works as a DRS.
  
  
• (Honour mode) Tavern Brawler no longer adds a separate damage instance on throw
  
  
• (Honour mode) Other (previously) DRS sources like Sneak Attack or Colossus Slayer still
  are separate damage instances, but they can no longer be buffed by damage riders.
  
  
• (Honour mode) Pact of the Blade no longer stacks with Extra Attack
  
  
• (Honour mode) (I am not 100% sure about the following. Needs more in-game testing)
  Action economy rebalanced.
  
  Extra actions granted through Haste and Elixir of Bloodlust do not benefit from Extra
  Attack. So if you have Haste and Extra Attack, you will do a total of 3 attacks (2
  attacks for the first action, 1 attack for the Haste action).
  
  Action Surge does give you a full action that works with extra attack.
  
  This (as far as I can tell) means Haste is nerfed for martial characters, but not
  spellcasters.
  
  
• (Honour mode) Perilous Stakes can now only target allies.

Are you going to credit the Redit poster for that copy and paste?

[Babbles]

Publicado originalmente por Nobby:

I'm not saying the perilous stake nerf isn't good, but is there any point in using it now? It was completely OP the way it was sure, but isn't it completely irrelevant now?

Utterly useless as far as I can tell, unless for some reason you are self damaging as a ranged weapon user that is only hurting itself. Some sort of psychotic emo ranger maybe :)

[HEY]

Publicado originalmente por Babbles:

Are you going to credit the Redit poster for that copy and paste?

Missed it from the original post I copied it from, Fixed.

[HEY]

Publicado originalmente por Babbles:

Publicado originalmente por Nobby:

I'm not saying the perilous stake nerf isn't good, but is there any point in using it now? It was completely OP the way it was sure, but isn't it completely irrelevant now?

Utterly useless as far as I can tell, unless for some reason you are self damaging as a ranged weapon user that is only hurting itself. Some sort of psychotic emo ranger maybe :)

Does warding bond cancel it out? if yes that could be used for healing. If not then yeah its useless.

[Jonny Boy]

Anyone tested if you can still cast twice with haste?

[victorvnv]

Publicado originalmente por Jonny Boy:

Anyone tested if you can still cast twice with haste?

I did and can confirm you can.

[id795078477]

Publicado originalmente por malkavius77:

Also why are martials called out for having "too many actions" when a sorcerer can obliterate anything and everything in 1 or 2 turns max? And doesn't have to worry about movement or action economy 90% of the time?

Because the "obliteration" you mentioned - even in 2 turns is just a fairy tale you invented to dramatize and justify your complaint. Martials could routinely pump 200+ damage. 250+ if with the Giant slayer. 300 if at least one attack crits. All in one round. And that's median numbers, not max damage rolls.

To match that you'd need a sorcerer with a twin spell and rolling max damage on an AoE that hits at least 3 targets. While it's not impossible, it will happen .. maybe 1-2 times during the entire game. The "movement economy" is therefore a moot point - in most cases if you can hit enemies with an AoE it means you can hit them with minimal movement between one another since they're clustered.

Finally, casters have to care about another "economy" - glad you've mentioned. That's called spell slot economy. You can't spam them spells as you spam attacks for free. So now that the martials don't dish out insane damage, maybe, just maybe - it will make sense to have party line-ups where casters aren't relegated to CC and supporting the martials.

But I still doubt it will be worth changing the strategy because while martials lost the huge advantage in sheer damage, they still have an advantage of that damage being consistent. You still will see that "cast fireball into 3 targets for a total of 29 damage" and often. Martials got GWM and feats to reroll damage and so on. They will statistically do better damage simply because of how that damage is calculated.

[victorvnv]

Publicado originalmente por id795078477:

Publicado originalmente por malkavius77:

Also why are martials called out for having "too many actions" when a sorcerer can obliterate anything and everything in 1 or 2 turns max? And doesn't have to worry about movement or action economy 90% of the time?

Because the "obliteration" you mentioned - even in 2 turns is just a fairy tale you invented to dramatize and justify your complaint. Martials could routinely pump 200+ damage. 250+ if with the Giant slayer. 300 if at least one attack crits. All in one round. And that's median numbers, not max damage rolls.

To match that you'd need a sorcerer with a twin spell and rolling max damage on an AoE that hits at least 3 targets. While it's not impossible, it will happen .. maybe 1-2 times during the entire game. The "movement economy" is therefore a moot point - in most cases if you can hit enemies with an AoE it means you can hit them with minimal movement between one another since they're clustered.

Finally, casters have to care about another "economy" - glad you've mentioned. That's called spell slot economy. You can't spam them spells as you spam attacks for free. So now that the martials don't dish out insane damage, maybe, just maybe - it will make sense to have party line-ups where casters aren't relegated to CC and supporting the martials.

I pump 600-700 on my bard fighter with ease and those changes maybe lowered that to 500-600 lol

[id795078477]

Publicado originalmente por victorvnv:

Publicado originalmente por id795078477:

Because the "obliteration" you mentioned - even in 2 turns is just a fairy tale you invented to dramatize and justify your complaint. Martials could routinely pump 200+ damage. 250+ if with the Giant slayer. 300 if at least one attack crits. All in one round. And that's median numbers, not max damage rolls.

To match that you'd need a sorcerer with a twin spell and rolling max damage on an AoE that hits at least 3 targets. While it's not impossible, it will happen .. maybe 1-2 times during the entire game. The "movement economy" is therefore a moot point - in most cases if you can hit enemies with an AoE it means you can hit them with minimal movement between one another since they're clustered.

Finally, casters have to care about another "economy" - glad you've mentioned. That's called spell slot economy. You can't spam them spells as you spam attacks for free. So now that the martials don't dish out insane damage, maybe, just maybe - it will make sense to have party line-ups where casters aren't relegated to CC and supporting the martials.

I pump 600-700 on my bard fighter with ease and those changes maybe lowered that to 500-600 lol

Well, I meant "basic" stuff with no fancy. Sure it can go higher. But that only goes to prove my point. Whining about how weak are martials compared to casters is a joke.

[🆉🅸🅾🆂🅷🅸]

well , looks like larian also nerf Perilous Stakes. now only target on all. that kinda ass