XP rates needs to be adjusted

[Gearwar]

Atleast on tactician difficulty. Its just weird to enter act 3 and basically be lvl 12 with all characters. I get the lvl 12 DnD thing, but atleast give us the option to adjust XP rates.

Lvling up your characters and being excited to see what new abilities they get is part of the charm for an RPG. You kinda lose momentum if you run around without zero room for improvement for hours on end.

[Gearwar]

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

Originally posted by haasi:

"most people" bro trust me moment, most people want the game to change

Dude, you're the first to p[ost about this, statitiscly most people don't care or are fine with the XP rates.

Also if Larian (or any studio for that matter) listen and imp[lemented every single thing teh community demands not only we'd have feature creep and the game will be liek Star Citizen, a neverending mess, but it also would not be instantly better, it might even get way worse.

Bottom line IS: Mods and cheats are doing exactly whjat you're asking for. Use that instead of demanding more work from devs.

Mate you can't even tell who made the post and who you are talking to. Lol

And I know there is mods, but I usually do not like to use it in games like this, cause they tend to break unrelated stuff, down the line. Its not the creation engine, where you can just go ham and nobody cares.

[LordOfTheBread]

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

Dude, you're the first to p[ost about this, statitiscly most people don't care or are fine with the XP rates.

Also if Larian (or any studio for that matter) listen and imp[lemented every single thing teh community demands not only we'd have feature creep and the game will be liek Star Citizen, a neverending mess, but it also would not be instantly better, it might even get way worse.

Bottom line IS: Mods and cheats are doing exactly whjat you're asking for. Use that instead of demanding more work from devs.

Mate you can't even tell who made the post and who you are talking to. Lol

And I know there is mods, but I usually do not like to use it in games like this, cause they tend to break unrelated stuff, down the line. Its not the creation engine, where you can just go ham and nobody cares.

I'm not your mate and I don't care who made the post, you responded to me didn't you?

[Яeplicant]

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Mate you can't even tell who made the post and who you are talking to. Lol

And I know there is mods, but I usually do not like to use it in games like this, cause they tend to break unrelated stuff, down the line. Its not the creation engine, where you can just go ham and nobody cares.

I'm not your mate and I don't care who made the post, you responded to me didn't you?

People nowadays will find any excuse to point out any mistakes and feel smug about it, I guess. Oh, the humanity.

Anyway. If we're going to see any kind of adjustment to XP gain, I'm guessing - at the very least - with the definitive edition update as they tend to rework some stuff here and there historically and based on feedback.

I do however agree that xp gain should be lessened through out the game itself. Not a Tabletop player myself or having looked too much into 5E or how it's handled there in detail but it would make sense, in my opinion, to have questing be the main way to level up rather than clearing maps. I feel like encounters and exploration provide a bit too much XP in the long run.

E: In that regard, I do have to give Owlcat some credit.

[Zaris]

First:
- act 3 starts after Ketheric Thorms endfight and in my playthroughs i was lvl9 or just reached 10 after doing everything i know of and try to kill everything for xp besides the druides/Thieflings.
- you can get about 100k xp after reaching lvl12 = the complete range of lvl1-12 again

I think the reasons for this distribution is something like:
- act 3 is endgame content = high lvl required
- not every player does everything and explore every corner and try to kill every thing, many quests can be done peacefully without getting any xp (for example i always kill all goblins in the fortress and around but you need at best kill a third of them)

In general for D&D5:
- lvl10-12 is considered max lvl for many campaigns because balancing after that is more difficult (look at the Solasta Ice Palace addon with lvl16? where enemies do either no damage or nearly oneshot your guys (giants)).
- D&D developer shifted most power perks in the 1-10 range and after that most classes get only tiny bonusses (i guess only the warrior misses out his 4. attack per AP bonus on lvl17) and most dmg spells do the same dmg like an upgraded fireball anyway

--------------------------

That were most normal comments about that topic. Imho Larian was just lazy to give us lvl20 which ALL previous D&D games on pc managed to give us (BG2, Icewind Dale 1+2, Neverwinter Nights 1+2, even BG1 got an addon now up to rank 9 spells = lvl17). Only exception left ist Planescape Torment but this game was unique either way (i.e. only a handfull spells customized for each hero and special items for each hero).

[Gearwar]

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Mate you can't even tell who made the post and who you are talking to. Lol

And I know there is mods, but I usually do not like to use it in games like this, cause they tend to break unrelated stuff, down the line. Its not the creation engine, where you can just go ham and nobody cares.

I'm not your mate and I don't care who made the post, you responded to me didn't you?

You are wild dude...how is life, thinking you are always right when you are clearly wrong and just avoid dealing with that? Must be nice.

[haasi]

Originally posted by Яeplicant:

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

I'm not your mate and I don't care who made the post, you responded to me didn't you?

People nowadays will find any excuse to point out any mistakes and feel smug about it, I guess. Oh, the humanity.

Originally posted by Яeplicant:

Oh look, another hyberbole thread.

Originally posted by Яeplicant:

That's one way of creating hyperbole.

some people go as far as to make up excuses to point out and feel smug about, or just using a new word they discovered? oh, well.

just from the first page btw

[LordOfTheBread]

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

I'm not your mate and I don't care who made the post, you responded to me didn't you?

You are wild dude...how is life, thinking you are always right when you are clearly wrong and just avoid dealing with that? Must be nice.

My life is great, livbing in a beautiful country with a beautiful wife, thanks for asking.

I am answering the one that responded me first, how's wrong? Me pointing it out makes me livid? Ok, whatever you say.

Maybe I'm not the onbe livid am I?

[Jarvo]

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Atleast on tactician difficulty. Its just weird to enter act 3 and basically be lvl 12 with all characters. I get the lvl 12 DnD thing, but atleast give us the option to adjust XP rates.

Lvling up your characters and being excited to see what new abilities they get is part of the charm for an RPG. You kinda lose momentum if you run around without zero room for improvement for hours on end.

you are ment to spend the last chunk actually experiencing max level. Games that make you get max level right at the end then nothing are ♥♥♥♥ just dangling "max level" infront of you

[Gearwar]

Originally posted by Zaris:

First:
- act 3 starts after Ketheric Thorms endfight and in my playthroughs i was lvl9 or just reached 10 after doing everything i know of and try to kill everything for xp besides the druides/Thieflings.
- you can get about 100k xp after reaching lvl12 = the complete range of lvl1-12 again

I think the reasons for this distribution is something like:
- act 3 is endgame content = high lvl required
- not every player does everything and explore every corner and try to kill every thing, many quests can be done peacefully without getting any xp (for example i always kill all goblins in the fortress and around but you need at best kill a third of them)

In general for D&D5:
- lvl10-12 is considered max lvl for many campaigns because balancing after that is more difficult (look at the Solasta Ice Palace addon with lvl16? where enemies do either no damage or nearly oneshot your guys (giants)).
- D&D developer shifted most power perks in the 1-10 range and after that most classes get only tiny bonusses (i guess only the warrior misses out his 4. attack per AP bonus on lvl17) and most dmg spells do the same dmg like an upgraded fireball anyway

--------------------------

That were most normal comments about that topic. Imho Larian was just lazy to give us lvl20 which ALL previous D&D games on pc managed to give us (BG2, Icewind Dale 1+2, Neverwinter Nights 1+2, even BG1 got an addon now up to rank 9 spells = lvl17). Only exception left ist Planescape Torment but this game was unique either way (i.e. only a handfull spells customized for each hero and special items for each hero).

I also figured it was designed around players just not doing a lot of the side content or quests, so you really want em to be high lvl enough for each act. Considering that you can't really grind anything if you are completely underlvled.

That said, Ketheric should be a lvl check anyway, so if you are actually not high lvl enough in act 2, you will most likely lose to him, specially on the harder difficulty.

I don't think they will ever raise the lvl cap in the game, cause it would add too much stuff into it, but I still think a tool to adjust the xp rate gain would counteract that. People who do not care for that, can still play the OG game, and people like me, who think you lvl up way too fast, considering the length of the game, can adjust it accordingly. It actually forces you to do the side content then, just to keep up.

I guess its hard to balance it all, but i also think that the current system is not that sweetspot that the game deserves.

[haasi]

Originally posted by Jarvo:

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Atleast on tactician difficulty. Its just weird to enter act 3 and basically be lvl 12 with all characters. I get the lvl 12 DnD thing, but atleast give us the option to adjust XP rates.

Lvling up your characters and being excited to see what new abilities they get is part of the charm for an RPG. You kinda lose momentum if you run around without zero room for improvement for hours on end.

you are ment to spend the last chunk actually experiencing max level. Games that make you get max level right at the end then nothing are ♥♥♥♥ just dangling "max level" infront of you

i mean if you play to level up instead of leveling up by playing getting it sooner rather than later is a good thing. act 3 is just filler quests with poor endings and no character progression so some will find it tedious

[Gearwar]

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

Originally posted by Gearwar:

You are wild dude...how is life, thinking you are always right when you are clearly wrong and just avoid dealing with that? Must be nice.

My life is great, livbing in a beautiful country with a beautiful wife, thanks for asking.

I am answering the one that responded me first, how's wrong? Me pointing it out makes me livid? Ok, whatever you say.

Maybe I'm not the onbe livid am I?

yea clearly you are not livid. I can feel it through the text.

[Mike Garrison]

Originally posted by Zaris:

First:
- act 3 starts after Ketheric Thorms endfight and in my playthroughs i was lvl9 or just reached 10 after doing everything i know of and try to kill everything for xp besides the druides/Thieflings.
- you can get about 100k xp after reaching lvl12 = the complete range of lvl1-12 again

I think the reasons for this distribution is something like:
- act 3 is endgame content = high lvl required
- not every player does everything and explore every corner and try to kill every thing, many quests can be done peacefully without getting any xp (for example i always kill all goblins in the fortress and around but you need at best kill a third of them)

In general for D&D5:
- lvl10-12 is considered max lvl for many campaigns because balancing after that is more difficult (look at the Solasta Ice Palace addon with lvl16? where enemies do either no damage or nearly oneshot your guys (giants)).
- D&D developer shifted most power perks in the 1-10 range and after that most classes get only tiny bonusses (i guess only the warrior misses out his 4. attack per AP bonus on lvl17) and most dmg spells do the same dmg like an upgraded fireball anyway

--------------------------

That were most normal comments about that topic. Imho Larian was just lazy to give us lvl20 which ALL previous D&D games on pc managed to give us (BG2, Icewind Dale 1+2, Neverwinter Nights 1+2, even BG1 got an addon now up to rank 9 spells = lvl17). Only exception left ist Planescape Torment but this game was unique either way (i.e. only a handfull spells customized for each hero and special items for each hero).

Leveling was different in AD&D 2.5 -- I think the ultimate top level was around 50, rather than 20.

Late game BG2/TOB is not really well-balanced in many ways. Mages are *everything*, and the whole name of the game is to put up layers of magical protections around your party while bringing down the magical protections of the enemies. If you can ever get them debuffed enough, then your melee fighters can just chop them up in a round or two at most.

[LordOfTheBread]

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Originally posted by LordOfTheBread:

My life is great, livbing in a beautiful country with a beautiful wife, thanks for asking.

I am answering the one that responded me first, how's wrong? Me pointing it out makes me livid? Ok, whatever you say.

Maybe I'm not the onbe livid am I?

yea clearly you are not livid. I can feel it through the text.

If you say it must be true, trust mne bro right? Lol

[Gearwar]

Originally posted by Jarvo:

Originally posted by Gearwar:

Atleast on tactician difficulty. Its just weird to enter act 3 and basically be lvl 12 with all characters. I get the lvl 12 DnD thing, but atleast give us the option to adjust XP rates.

Lvling up your characters and being excited to see what new abilities they get is part of the charm for an RPG. You kinda lose momentum if you run around without zero room for improvement for hours on end.

you are ment to spend the last chunk actually experiencing max level. Games that make you get max level right at the end then nothing are ♥♥♥♥ just dangling "max level" infront of you

Maybe so, but this game isn't like lets say "pathfinder" where the max lvl actually makes you feel like you are suddenly a force to be reckoned with.

I play a warlock in Bg3 and 99% of the time in any fight I use the Eldritch blast cantrip. I have been using it since the early game in act 1 and most of the spells are pretty ♥♥♥♥ compared to it.

Astarion is still doing his sneak attack at lvl 12, same as he did at lvl 1? maybe 2?

Karlach still uses rage .. or now called frenzy, and then attacks.

Like.. there is nothing really evolving here. Most of the lvl ups are kinda eh anyway, but atleast it gave the game some sort of spicyness.

I dunno, I just want that slider honestly, cause the game is too easy, even on tactician.

[Smugass Braixen-Chan]

Or they could just do away with XP, like most IRL DMs do, and use a Milestone System where you gain a level every time you complete a major milestone in the story.

Quite frankly, I hate XP systems in RPGs.

They don't add anything of substance. They destroy the balance of the game. (The developer will never know if you will be underleveled or overleveled for any given encounter) They lead to inevitable grind sessions where I spend my time grinding mobs instead of actually enjoying the game. (Or picking fights/doing side-quests which I wouldn't otherwise do for RP reasons, purely for the XP) And there is nothing remotely realistic about my character going from a total novice to a mortal god in the time-span that the game takes place.

All for the sake of stimulating Monkey-Gamer's neurons when they see "Number go up"