Status Points system

[Bongoboy]

I am not that well versed in the D&D system, especially not in the edition used in BG3. Is there a point, in putting points into Intelligence, Wisdom and Charisma if you are a Fighter or Barbarian?
Same like if you are a Wizard is there any point in putting anything into Wisdom or Charisma?

[Furio]

Not really. It will only affect saving throws. You'll be better off boosting the stats they actually use actively.

[VoiD]

These are often referred to as "dump stats."

Some people prefer not to let them fall below 10 to avoid penalties on random tests like spell resistance and dialogue checks, but it's not extremely critical.

What truly counts is the statistic you'll utilize for dealing damage (typically Strength), the statistic that provides you with Armor Class (usually Dexterity), in addition to the AC bonus limit from your desired armor type (+0 for heavy, +2 for medium, typically, go all out on light). If you're a caster, your spellcasting attribute (Charisma, Intelligence, or Wisdom) is also crucial.

Edit: Oh, and con, HP is always welcome, and it helps with concentration checks

[Bongoboy]

Yeah saving throws. Don't those get harder to do with higher spells?

Also for Armor, the higher Heavy Armors have 19 to 20 AC, but there are several 14 AC Light Armors with a +5 Dex modifier you are at 19 AC as well. Is there nothing else separating them?

[Rabbit]

Originally posted by Bongoboy:

Yeah saving throws. Don't those get harder to do with higher spells?

Also for Armor, the higher Heavy Armors have 19 to 20 AC, but there are several 14 AC Light Armors with a +5 Dex modifier you are at 19 AC as well. Is there nothing else separating them?

The high end armors of any type usually have magical effects/abilities that lead to that kind of play. Like even if you end up with the same AC, if you're playing like a tank the heavy armors probably have what you want (though i'm sure there are some light tank options I forgot honestly)

[VoiD]

Originally posted by Boon: Safeword:

Originally posted by Bongoboy:

Yeah saving throws. Don't those get harder to do with higher spells?

Also for Armor, the higher Heavy Armors have 19 to 20 AC, but there are several 14 AC Light Armors with a +5 Dex modifier you are at 19 AC as well. Is there nothing else separating them?

The high end armors of any type usually have magical effects/abilities that lead to that kind of play. Like even if you end up with the same AC, if you're playing like a tank the heavy armors probably have what you want (though i'm sure there are some light tank options I forgot honestly)

This.

But Having a high Dexterity might grant advantages like improved armor class and better fighting ability with finesse weapons, which are more restrictive, it could also mean neglecting other crucial stats. On the other hand, focusing on Strength allows for versatility with all weapons.

For example, if you're playing a Paladin, investing heavily in Strength, Constitution, and Charisma for magic, concentration, and melee damage can be an effective approach, with Dexterity at a base of 10 for decent armor class while wearing heavy armor.

Alternatively, a Warlock/Paladin combo using Charisma for both melee attacks and spellcasting can opt to dump Strength entirely, emphasizing Charisma for both melee and magic, alongside Constitution for hit points and concentration. This build can still enjoy the benefits of heavy armor with high armor class.

As always in D&D, the right answer is: It depends.

[Gracey Face]

Originally posted by Bongoboy:

Yeah saving throws. Don't those get harder to do with higher spells?

Also for Armor, the higher Heavy Armors have 19 to 20 AC, but there are several 14 AC Light Armors with a +5 Dex modifier you are at 19 AC as well. Is there nothing else separating them?

The point of the heavier armors is so that you can attain good AC without having good DEX on classes that do not scale from DEX like STR fighter/ranger or WIS Cleric, the penalty being extra weight, cost and such.

There used to also be a lot of other differentiators, such as armor check penalties and flat footed but those got taken out when they simplified the ruleset for 5e.

[Kasa]

From my experience you will rarely ever pass a saving throw by just enough points because of your ability scores.

For example:
A wizard casts a level 1 spell at you with max int for a point buy game.
The wizard has an int of 16 so the DC to save is 8+3 (the ability mod) + 2 (prof mod) = 13.

If you are not proficient in that stat save AND dumped the stat (kept it at 8) your odds are at 30% to pass.

If your stat in the save is 10 and are not proficient in that stat you have a 35% chance of passing that DC.

If you are proficient on that stat and it's at 10 the save becomes a 45% chance of passing.

If you are not proficient in that save but maxed the stat (meaning it's also a 16) the odds of passing the DC are 50%

If you are proficient in that save and maxed the that stat that means you now have a 60% chance of passing that save.

So as you can see even if you dump the save stat you will pass 1/3 of the time and if you weaken yourself to pump your stats AND have prof on that save you will pass little over 1/2 the time.

So it's not worth it to pump your save stats unless you have spare points to spend as it's far more effective to use magic to cover for weaknesses.

[Bongoboy]

Originally posted by Gracey Face:

There used to also be a lot of other differentiators, such as armor check penalties and flat footed but those got taken out when they simplified the ruleset for 5e.

That is interesting info.

A friend of mine, said Monk is the ultimate class, he plans to push 20 Dex, leave Str at 8 and down a Potion of Hill Giant Strength every day to push Str to 21. He plans to take the Tavern Brawler feat and not wear any armor. He said he can kill one enemy in one turn, and it is really OP.
When I said that he is basically a glass cannon and tried to mention that I heard later in the game enemies are always more in numbers then you with your 4 characters he was just laughing at me.

But yeah I was originally worried, if I make a Barbarian with 8 in Int/Wis/Cha it will suck when I need to do saves VS spells later on.

[Bongoboy]

Originally posted by Kasa:

From my experience you will rarely ever pass a saving throw but just enough points because of your ability scores.
~snip~
So it's not worth it to pump your save stats unless you have spare points to spend as it's far more effective to use magic to cover for weaknesses.

Yeah I kinda felt like that. With the D20 that is used the game is skewed towards the target not passing a AC most of the time.

But is it worth to raise a base stat for skills like Perception?

[Kasa]

Originally posted by Bongoboy:

Originally posted by Kasa:

From my experience you will rarely ever pass a saving throw but just enough points because of your ability scores.
~snip~
So it's not worth it to pump your save stats unless you have spare points to spend as it's far more effective to use magic to cover for weaknesses.

Yeah I kinda felt like that. With the D20 that is used the game is skewed towards the target not passing a AC most of the time.

But is it worth to raise a base stat for skills like Perception?

If you have extra points then it's usually worth while to raise wisdom to at least 12.

Since with that not only are you getting a +1 to perception checks (literally the most used check in all of D&D history) Wis, Con, and Dex are the most common saving throws in the game with Wisdom being the more common one that can end an entire encounter.

Failed con saves usually only result in a singular debuff (or death at extreme levels) and dex is usually just damage.

[Gracey Face]

Originally posted by Bongoboy:

Yeah I kinda felt like that. With the D20 that is used the game is skewed towards the target not passing a AC most of the time.

But is it worth to raise a base stat for skills like Perception?

No. For a skill monkey you want a rogue, and a rogue gets more value out of proficiency and then expertise. For anyone else raising a stat just to try to get very marginally better success rates on skill checks is a low return on investment.

[Bongoboy]

Originally posted by Gracey Face:

No. For a skill monkey you want a rogue, and a rogue gets more value out of proficiency and then expertise. For anyone else raising a stat just to try to get very marginally better success rates on skill checks is a low return on investment.

Thanks, didn't know how Expertise works.

So far I learned through Proficiency and Advantage. And boy is Rogue a skill monkey, sheesh.

[Dragon Master]

Originally posted by Bongoboy:

Originally posted by Gracey Face:

No. For a skill monkey you want a rogue, and a rogue gets more value out of proficiency and then expertise. For anyone else raising a stat just to try to get very marginally better success rates on skill checks is a low return on investment.

Thanks, didn't know how Expertise works.

So far I learned through Proficiency and Advantage. And boy is Rogue a skill monkey, sheesh.

Rogues are the best skill monkey in the game, followed closely by bards.

[Dragon Master]

Originally posted by Bongoboy:

Originally posted by Gracey Face:

There used to also be a lot of other differentiators, such as armor check penalties and flat footed but those got taken out when they simplified the ruleset for 5e.

That is interesting info.

A friend of mine, said Monk is the ultimate class, he plans to push 20 Dex, leave Str at 8 and down a Potion of Hill Giant Strength every day to push Str to 21. He plans to take the Tavern Brawler feat and not wear any armor. He said he can kill one enemy in one turn, and it is really OP.
When I said that he is basically a glass cannon and tried to mention that I heard later in the game enemies are always more in numbers then you with your 4 characters he was just laughing at me.

But yeah I was originally worried, if I make a Barbarian with 8 in Int/Wis/Cha it will suck when I need to do saves VS spells later on.

Yeah, monks are not glass cannons in any way. With 20 dex and 16 wisdom, without any magical equipment, they can have an AC of 18 because they add wisdom to their AC and are the only class that can do so, but it only works if they are not wearing armor.

Add in the various magical equipment and monk-unique items in the game and a monk can have just as much, if not more, AC than an armored fighter.

[Bongoboy]

Originally posted by Dragon Master:

Yeah, monks are not glass cannons in any way. With 20 dex and 16 wisdom, without any magical equipment, they can have an AC of 18 because they add wisdom to their AC and are the only class that can do so, but it only works if they are not wearing armor.

Add in the various magical equipment and monk-unique items in the game and a monk can have just as much, if not more, AC than an armored fighter.

So you meant to say, Monks are the ultimate killing machine?