Gondians Running AWAY from ladder?

[Gibble]

Just spent several hours retrying to save everyone on tactitian. On the last turn they ran away from the ladder and all stood there side by side in neat little rows and awaited death. What the hell

[pezenwever]

Haha. Never had that issue myself.
Sounds annoying and what im about to say will be even more annoying. :

Reload from outside or in the submarine before it docks aka rinse and repeat.

[Enigma]

Yes, the AI of the Gondians is very annoying, if someone else blocks the way, they bug out.
They also run towards the exploding steel watcher.
You can only throw speed potion at them and occasionally throw the stubborn ones yourself

[pezenwever]

I'm assuming OP is talking about the Iron Throne and not the Steel Watch foundry

[Ashe]

I've had this too. I think it happens when there's too many on the sub? Can't confirm but that's my only hypothesis.

Not that getting everyone out matters. Pretty sure saving literally everyone is just vanity.

[Raelic]

Mine never did that. Do you have someone standing at the bottom of the ladder blocking it?

The Gondians for me will even use my Dimension Door. I thought the AI was pretty great. I don't typically use summons either, but I've rescued everyone on the prison including the Mindflayer without issue, other than difficulty of course.

[Enigma]

Originally posted by Raelic:

Mine never did that. Do you have someone standing at the bottom of the ladder blocking it?

The Gondians for me will even use my Dimension Door. I thought the AI was pretty great. I don't typically use summons either, but I've rescued everyone on the prison including the Mindflayer without issue, other than difficulty of course.

The problem is that there are a few bottlenecks and if you are unlucky with the turn sequence it can be that all paths are blocked for a turn .

[Raelic]

Originally posted by Enigma:

Originally posted by Raelic:

Mine never did that. Do you have someone standing at the bottom of the ladder blocking it?

The Gondians for me will even use my Dimension Door. I thought the AI was pretty great. I don't typically use summons either, but I've rescued everyone on the prison including the Mindflayer without issue, other than difficulty of course.

The problem is that there are a few bottlenecks and if you are unlucky with the turn sequence it can be that all paths are blocked for a turn .

Ah, yea, if the path is blocked, it's blocked. That's not an AI problem. That's a strategy problem. Don't let the paths get blocked.

They're probably going around to a path that isn't blocked.

[Enigma]

Originally posted by Raelic:

Originally posted by Enigma:

The problem is that there are a few bottlenecks and if you are unlucky with the turn sequence it can be that all paths are blocked for a turn .

Ah, yea, if the path is blocked, it's blocked. That's not an AI problem. That's a strategy problem. Don't let the paths get blocked.

They're probably going around to a path that isn't blocked.

For me it was usually the ladder, so there was no way to go and those affected skipped the turn .

[pezenwever]

Well if it wasn't due to a bug, then I would suggest casting arcane gates. If you cast them in the middle of the hallway you can place one at the ladder and one at the end of the hallway.
Also precast elementals when boarding the sub and place these elementals at the outer walls to lure the spawn. I had a fire myrmidon holding up *9* monsters.

[Enigma]

Originally posted by pezenwever:

Well if it wasn't due to a bug, then I would suggest casting arcane gates. If you cast them in the middle of the hallway you can place one at the ladder and one at the end of the hallway.
Also precast elementals when boarding the sub and place these elementals at the outer walls to lure the spawn. I had a fire myrmidon holding up *9* monsters.

arcane gates should work, it's less of a bug and more of a bad rule interaction.

[TamTroll]

Originally posted by Raelic:

Originally posted by Enigma:

The problem is that there are a few bottlenecks and if you are unlucky with the turn sequence it can be that all paths are blocked for a turn .

Ah, yea, if the path is blocked, it's blocked. That's not an AI problem. That's a strategy problem. Don't let the paths get blocked.

They're probably going around to a path that isn't blocked.

that said, Wall of Stone is GOAT for this encounter. i was able to completely wall off a section where the one Gondian inside had already escaped, and six new Sahagin had spawned in that area trying to enter the fight.

They just sat there trying to chip away at the stone and doing nothing the entire fight. it was great.

There was a visual glitch where it looked like only two pillars of stone had spawned in, leaving the entire middle of the hall empty, but apparently it still counted, as they couldn't move past it.

[Enigma]

Originally posted by TamTroll:

that said, Wall of Stone is GOAT for this encounter. i was able to completely wall off a section where the one Gondian inside had already escaped, and six new Sahagin had spawned in that area trying to enter the fight.

They just sat there trying to chip away at the stone and doing nothing the entire fight. it was great.

There was a visual glitch where it looked like only two pillars of stone had spawned in, leaving the entire middle of the hall empty, but apparently it still counted, as they couldn't move past it.

You can also trigger the locks if you destroy the respective sensor in them

[Raelic]

What I did to rescue everyone, even on tactician, was...


Turn 1
Astarion goes down ladder, dashes as bonus action (Rogue), goes west? (Whichever way has the enemy in the middle chamber, open the one prison door over there and backstab the sahagin. If it kills or doesn't kill the Sahagin, keep going down that tunnel to the west. Even if it triggers an attack of opportunity.

Then I had Gale go down the ladder, Misty Step South, Arcane Door as far north toward the ladder as he could, near but not blocking the ladder, and as far south as he could. Then I had him move south with him being closer to going west at that turn.

Then I had my main character (Fighter) go down, finish the one sahagin with a ranged attack, and go east. Whoever you send East either needs multiple attacks or an AOE that isn't fire. My fighter also had multiple tadpoles used so had the ability to auto kill if their HP was below the amount of tadpoles used. This isn't important in lower difficulties, but it is on Tactician.

Then I had Karlach, who had a bunch of movement and jump bonuses from equipment go down and head south as well using the arcane gates.


Turn 2
Astarion continued west and encountered two more sahagin. I attacked, them but continued moving toward the prisons. Even if it procs attacks of opportunity.

Gale Misty Stepped and Dimension door'd west, ignoring sahagin. He opened the Mind Flayer's prison and walked in.

Karlach opens the doors, the Gondians proceed out with dash and the arcane gates.

My MC opened the two Gondian doors and the Duke's. Ranged attacked the Sahagin. The Gondians Dash to leave.

Turn 3
Gale helped the Mindflayer and the Mindflayer uses teleport to return them both to the sub. I move the mindflayer out of the sub and into the chamber below. It has very little movement, but it can also fly. I'm moving him east.

MC tosses a potion at the duke and the Duke steps out of prison with dash. This proc's exploding spiders. Either AOE them down with a non fire spell or use a multi-attacking character to kill as many as you can. On Tactician that had nearly 30 hp.

Karlach returns to the sub.

Astarion pops the prisoners out and they dash to leave, Astarion does the same. Attacking where he can but moving as far as possible.

Turn 4
Mindflayer and Duke meet up and Mindflayer teleports out with him.

MC dies often here for me, but I have managed to get him out.

Astarion and the Gondians on the left just depend on good attack rolls as well so I can kill the sahagin that are kind of acting like tar pits.

---

The Sahagin don't really do much damage even on Tactician.

[Mander]

I hear you. Gondians hostage are not very... keen on their own survival.
But there are ways, even if sadly they are not foolproof: misty step, dimension gate, haste spores...
You can even use Omeluum teleport on straggles, if you manage to free him fast enough. And you can create a wall in the south portion of the map (with conjured monsters or a literal wall) to lock the fish men until you’ve escaped.

[Gibble]

Originally posted by TamTroll:

Originally posted by Raelic:

Ah, yea, if the path is blocked, it's blocked. That's not an AI problem. That's a strategy problem. Don't let the paths get blocked.

They're probably going around to a path that isn't blocked.

that said, Wall of Stone is GOAT for this encounter. i was able to completely wall off a section where the one Gondian inside had already escaped, and six new Sahagin had spawned in that area trying to enter the fight.

They just sat there trying to chip away at the stone and doing nothing the entire fight. it was great.

There was a visual glitch where it looked like only two pillars of stone had spawned in, leaving the entire middle of the hall empty, but apparently it still counted, as they couldn't move past it.

ooh thats smart I didnt think of that. Just used aoes to try and keep them back.
Too late now though, I got Ravengard, Omeluum and about half of them out.