Why cant we make our own hirelings?

[grip]

Since the game has a bunch of hirelings, why cant we make our own from scratch?
Is this due to some ideological stance of Larian?

I cant understand why I am not allowed to play the game with 4 fully customized dwarfs. All the tools for this to be possible seems to be in the game already.

[Tomas Mac Mordain]

I suppose they have to be somewhat functional in cutscenes, and they've curated a set that is kinda passable in terms of voices and facial animations.

I think the fact that they are limited is a technical thing, and the fact that half of them look the way they do is an ideological statement. Can't have enough of those 😁

[grip]

I did the MP trick and managed to get a party of 3 custom PCs with the fourth slot reserved for origin charachters.
I would prefer to be able to customize hirelings but the MP start works well enough.

[Estevan Valladares]

Originally posted by JonasNat:

Since the game has a bunch of hirelings, we cant we make our own from scratch?
Is this due to some ideological stance of Larian?

I cant understand why I am not allowed to play the game with 4 fully customized dwarfs. All the tools for this to be possible seems to be in the game already.

They are hirelings, not createdlings.
You found them and hire them, you dont create them.

But you are wrong in saying "all the tools are there".

You sure are not familiar with how development works. While the visuals are "visible", you have a ton of things that might be tied to being the main character. Customization for example is something you might not have the "tools" to do to any other character besides the main one. It might be for N number of reasons, for example not allowing it for obvious reasons in Origin characters, or not wanting to open up a miriad of problems by untying the customization tools from the player character actor.

One of the most obvious reasons is resource optimization. Contrary to what most "player thinking" development criticisms, having options is not a "free design option". To have options, you have to have the means to store the chosen options, and all that entails. So for example, to have your character customizable, you have to have a buffer to store its customization data. To have 4 characters customizable, it has to have 4 buffers to store their customization, and the system to manage who's is what. To have "any" character customization, you have to have scalable buffers and scalable systems to handle all the customization.

I know that from practice because I made a mod for customizing characters in a game the originally did not had it, afterwards added it, but not as extensive as I had my mod made it, and further along the lines had its system changed according to a suggestion description I made on how to handle such "versatile customization system".

Customization entails much more than just having the UI and the assets to do it. Its most intensive work is not about the "sliders" or the "modeling", but the backend system that ensures your customization holds, saves, and keep consistent throughout the game. And that, you cant know exist unless you are the one coding it, or have access to the code.

[Mokona]

Originally posted by JonasNat:

I did the MP trick and managed to get a party of 3 custom PCs with the fourth slot reserved for origin charachters.
I would prefer to be able to customize hirelings but the MP start works well enough.

Only problem with that is you have to watch any guardian cut scene for each member. So for me I have to go through it 4 times

[grip]

Originally posted by Mokona:

Originally posted by JonasNat:

I did the MP trick and managed to get a party of 3 custom PCs with the fourth slot reserved for origin charachters.
I would prefer to be able to customize hirelings but the MP start works well enough.

Only problem with that is you have to watch any guardian cut scene for each member. So for me I have to go through it 4 times

Yes, its not a perfect solution.

[grip]

Originally posted by Estevan Valladares:

Originally posted by JonasNat:

Since the game has a bunch of hirelings, we cant we make our own from scratch?
Is this due to some ideological stance of Larian?

I cant understand why I am not allowed to play the game with 4 fully customized dwarfs. All the tools for this to be possible seems to be in the game already.

They are hirelings, not createdlings.
You found them and hire them, you dont create them.

Yes, but why impose limits to player creativity?

[talemore]

Idk. Since 4e it has been standard with set character even for your own main. Pathfinder kingmaker had hedwig as main character with more feats than a created.

[talemore]

Femshep and maleshep are origin soldier class with set facials. Doesn't mean they have to be but there's a set main already made

[Estevan Valladares]

Originally posted by JonasNat:

Originally posted by Estevan Valladares:

They are hirelings, not createdlings.
You found them and hire them, you dont create them.

Yes, but why impose limits to player creativity?

I dont see a considerable loss in the fact that you cant customize Ashley, Kaden, Liara or Garrus in Mass Effect. A game much more successful and superior to this one almost any way.
I dont see a considerable loss in the fact that you cant customize even Aloy in Horizon Zero, which is mostly a better game than this one.

I could go on, but you might or might not got the point, so ...

Customization is not paramount to "everyone", it is just something some people want, but on the priority list is far down the line, unless your game has not much else to offer.

You even have a value added feature in not being able to customize a character. You can see it in the quality the "standard sheppard" has over the "customized" sheppard. The model of a fixed character can be better made, better animated, and overall better handled.

Offering customization needs a lot to handle and ALL, without exeception, freely customizable characters are of a lower quality.

[larhtas]

The current hirelings doesn't have any dialog lines except one to tell you that they are mind controlled by wither.
Customize them is not a big deal, instead of creating 12 characters with empty mind and personality they could have just open a creation panel and let us create whatever we want.
The wither dialog lines would be the same.

They could have at least let the new mirror able to change their appareance.

[grip]

Originally posted by larhtas:

The current hirelings doesn't have any dialog lines except one to tell you that they are mind controlled by wither.
Customize them is not a big deal, instead of creating 12 characters with empty mind and personality they could have just open a creation panel and let us create whatever we want.
The wither dialog lines would be the same.

They could have at least let the new mirror able to change their appareance.

Exactly.

[Waltzing]

Originally posted by Estevan Valladares:

Originally posted by JonasNat:

Since the game has a bunch of hirelings, we cant we make our own from scratch?
Is this due to some ideological stance of Larian?

I cant understand why I am not allowed to play the game with 4 fully customized dwarfs. All the tools for this to be possible seems to be in the game already.

They are hirelings, not createdlings.
You found them and hire them, you dont create them.

But you are wrong in saying "all the tools are there".

You sure are not familiar with how development works. While the visuals are "visible", you have a ton of things that might be tied to being the main character. Customization for example is something you might not have the "tools" to do to any other character besides the main one. It might be for N number of reasons, for example not allowing it for obvious reasons in Origin characters, or not wanting to open up a miriad of problems by untying the customization tools from the player character actor.

One of the most obvious reasons is resource optimization. Contrary to what most "player thinking" development criticisms, having options is not a "free design option". To have options, you have to have the means to store the chosen options, and all that entails. So for example, to have your character customizable, you have to have a buffer to store its customization data. To have 4 characters customizable, it has to have 4 buffers to store their customization, and the system to manage who's is what. To have "any" character customization, you have to have scalable buffers and scalable systems to handle all the customization.

I know that from practice because I made a mod for customizing characters in a game the originally did not had it, afterwards added it, but not as extensive as I had my mod made it, and further along the lines had its system changed according to a suggestion description I made on how to handle such "versatile customization system".

Customization entails much more than just having the UI and the assets to do it. Its most intensive work is not about the "sliders" or the "modeling", but the backend system that ensures your customization holds, saves, and keep consistent throughout the game. And that, you cant know exist unless you are the one coding it, or have access to the code.

Tiefling druid is all I need to say to completely destroy your argument. It's over now you've lost.

[Knightspace]

Originally posted by Estevan Valladares:

Originally posted by JonasNat:

Yes, but why impose limits to player creativity?

I dont see a considerable loss in the fact that you cant customize Ashley, Kaden, Liara or Garrus in Mass Effect. A game much more successful and superior to this one almost any way.
I dont see a considerable loss in the fact that you cant customize even Aloy in Horizon Zero, which is mostly a better game than this one.

I could go on, but you might or might not got the point, so ...

Customization is not paramount to "everyone", it is just something some people want, but on the priority list is far down the line, unless your game has not much else to offer.

You even have a value added feature in not being able to customize a character. You can see it in the quality the "standard sheppard" has over the "customized" sheppard. The model of a fixed character can be better made, better animated, and overall better handled.

Offering customization needs a lot to handle and ALL, without exeception, freely customizable characters are of a lower quality.

It's not Mass Effect, you can cheat the game by using custom multiplayer characters and hirelings barely even interact with the world.

You can't hold up your arguments in the case of this game. Sure, it would make sense if Hirelings WEREN'T a part of the game, but as it stands, you are not correct.

[Popsicles]

You can in Solasta.

[Something completely different]

Originally posted by JonasNat:

Originally posted by larhtas:

The current hirelings doesn't have any dialog lines except one to tell you that they are mind controlled by wither.
Customize them is not a big deal, instead of creating 12 characters with empty mind and personality they could have just open a creation panel and let us create whatever we want.
The wither dialog lines would be the same.

They could have at least let the new mirror able to change their appareance.

Exactly.

+1. I hope someone manages to mod it in soon.