Divine Smite's design logic ?

[Tepes Nightmare]

seems some enemies are just spamming their smite attacks whenever they can, and they are the only ones can do real damage to me, cuz I have all kinds of resistance, so that's how the game is designed? to be able to get rid of a very strong foe, all you need is divine smite and to loop that attack and hope for some crit, why DnD designed such boring skills like this? If I want to experience BG3 like a joke, I can go with full party of paladins and smite 80% of foes down at the beginning of a battle even in tactician mode, then clean up the rest, then go long rest because food is never a problem, so what is the point of choosing other classes? even Rogue's sneak attack requires advantage to use, what a dumb design...

But, with all their smite attacks I still wiped all 20 or 30 of them out with 1 single character, because I have 25 AC and get saved every time if hit by a magic... like, what? they couldn't even give me the slightest challenge if not for all their paladins, what a brilliant experience, good thing that I didn't treat this game cheap and go with 4 super strong paladins that can 1 turn kill everything in our way.

[Kernest]

Sooooooo....

What's the issue here? A Paladin hit you and use a Smite and now you're salty?

[Doomvora]

Gabriel... It's okay, paladins aren't real they can't hurt you.

[Fringehunter7719]

The tabletop design logic was for D&D 5e to be a game featuring a strong resource management component. Paladins get few spellslots and were expected to tackle about 8 encounters (including maybe 5 combats) per long rest.

The class wasn't designed for one combat per long rest or NPCs who would fight one battle and be killed (thus meaning they should smite on every attack).

As it turned out quite a lot of the design assumptions of 5e didn't work out brilliantly in the tabletop version with many, many parties tackling far fewer encounters per long rest than anticipated. Partly out of a desire to use their big abilities at every opportunity; partly out of there being less interest in resource management in the community than anticipated; and partly due to a desire to have lower level epic combats against very powerful foes that burned through far more resources.

This translates badly to BG3 where the game practically begs you to long rest at every opportunity so you can see story events.

25AC is also well outside the bounded accuracy design of 5e. Larian's rules changes and itemisation are responsible for that. You should be lucky to get beyond 18*, a full 35% easier to hit (though again, you will find some DMs who hand out +3 magical plate like candy and create tabletop issues, but not that many).

*While wielding a two-handed weapon.

[talemore]

If you knew you not going to win and the best thing you can do is casting one spell again you would do it.

Divine magic is immune to resistances. It has been this way a long time.

The alternative would be that they all have fireball for a challenge and throw barrels with explosives on you.

You not going to give up until they're dead or rage quit.

[Tepes Nightmare]

Originally posted by Kernest:

Sooooooo....

What's the issue here? A Paladin hit you and use a Smite and now you're salty?

no. I wiped all of them out with 1 character, why should I be salty? I'm bored to see the supposed best way to solve battle problems is just spamming divine smites, but no luck for them I have high AC, but still bored

[Kernest]

Originally posted by Tepes Nightmare:

no. I wiped all of them out with 1 character, why should I be salty? I'm bored to see the supposed best way to solve battle problems is just spamming divine smites, but no luck for them I have high AC, but still bored

I would suggest reading Fringehunter's post.

25 AC or spamming smites are far from the most ridiculous things you can do in this game because there are basically no consequences for long resting after every combat and overpowered items a plenty.

So...

Since there was no real reason for the OP...

Dare I say...

/Thread?

[Tepes Nightmare]

Originally posted by talemore:

If you knew you not going to win and the best thing you can do is casting one spell again you would do it.

Divine magic is immune to resistances. It has been this way a long time.

The alternative would be that they all have fireball for a challenge and throw barrels with explosives on you.

You not going to give up until they're dead or rage quit.

yeah, fireballs . but that is no where near the damage potential of DIVINE SMITE, I take 1/4 damage from fireballs for resistance and saved and no big deal because I have over 100 HP, but smite deals some obvious damage with their 2 smites multi attacks even with damage halved

[Tepes Nightmare]

Originally posted by Kernest:

Originally posted by Tepes Nightmare:

no. I wiped all of them out with 1 character, why should I be salty? I'm bored to see the supposed best way to solve battle problems is just spamming divine smites, but no luck for them I have high AC, but still bored

I would suggest reading Fringehunter's post.

25 AC or spamming smites are far from the most ridiculous things you can do in this game because there are basically no consequences for long resting after every combat and overpowered items a plenty.

So...

Since there was no real reason for the OP...

Dare I say...

/Thread?

I'm saying poor designs making game looks boring, if this question is that simple then why design such things which is obviously going to make the game's combat boring as hell, what's the logic/reason of making it in the first place? this is what I ask

[Tepes Nightmare]

Originally posted by Fringehunter7719:

The tabletop design logic was for D&D 5e to be a game featuring a strong resource management component. Paladins get few spellslots and were expected to tackle about 8 encounters (including maybe 5 combats) per long rest.

The class wasn't designed for one combat per long rest or NPCs who would fight one battle and be killed (thus meaning they should smite on every attack).

As it turned out quite a lot of the design assumptions of 5e didn't work out brilliantly in the tabletop version with many, many parties tackling far fewer encounters per long rest than anticipated. Partly out of a desire to use their big abilities at every opportunity; partly out of there being less interest in resource management in the community than anticipated; and partly due to a desire to have lower level epic combats against very powerful foes that burned through far more resources.

This translates badly to BG3 where the game practically begs you to long rest at every opportunity so you can see story events.

25AC is also well outside the bounded accuracy design of 5e. Larian's rules changes and itemisation are responsible for that. You should be lucky to get beyond 18*, a full 35% easier to hit (though again, you will find some DMs who hand out +3 magical plate like candy and create tabletop issues, but not that many).

*While wielding a two-handed weapon.

So, it comes down to bad video game implementation of DnD, which makes the original tabletop designs feel really weird on this version, I agree that's what happened here,a pity indeed.

[Haar]

You're acting as if all martial classes aren't some flavor of just swinging at things. Rouges have one per turn nukes, fighters have like 8 different ways to give themselves into a machine gun and give themselves advantage, and barbarians are really good at throwing people. Paladins just do it the best due to having limited resources to work with. But that being said, their damage output isn't even that crazy compared to what you can get later in the game. Upcasted magic missile bypass AC checks and can lead to 8d4 + 56 damage (iirc) without any items coming into play, and somewhere in the 200s with the items you do get, and that's just one of a million different things wizards can do, who can *still* get outclassed by other casters for raw damage.

If you want to play with 4 paladins, play with 4 paladins. If you don't want to use paladins and not get ♥♥♥♥♥♥ over at the slightest bit of ranged encounters, then don't use 4 paladins. If nothing makes you happy playing this game, then don't play it.

[talemore]

Originally posted by Tepes Nightmare:

Originally posted by Kernest:

I would suggest reading Fringehunter's post.

25 AC or spamming smites are far from the most ridiculous things you can do in this game because there are basically no consequences for long resting after every combat and overpowered items a plenty.

So...

Since there was no real reason for the OP...

Dare I say...

/Thread?

I'm saying poor designs making game looks boring, if this question is that simple then why design such things which is obviously going to make the game's combat boring as hell, what's the logic/reason of making it in the first place? this is what I ask

The reason is to make it simple for new players to play as a paladin.

Paladin was made lawful good and sort of a pay to win against demons and end up bite its own tail since they just threw overpowered abilities to players to make it fun to play as a paladin and easy enough that a 5 year old could join the game. With alignment gone you now are the villain the lawful good was created to protect. The paladins are the lesser evil.

[Kernest]

Originally posted by Tepes Nightmare:

I'm saying poor designs making game looks boring, if this question is that simple then why design such things which is obviously going to make the game's combat boring as hell, what's the logic/reason of making it in the first place? this is what I ask

I'm sorry, are you under the impression that Smites hit automatically? Because that is not the case.

You make a melee attack and you may use a spell slot to smite if you hit.

What (sort of) makes smites OP is the fact that you don't spend the spell slot on a miss. Also Radiant is one of the better damage types.

A CoS Bard for example, has to declare and use the Bardic Inspiration die before making any rolls, and if you miss the attack, then it's a Bardic Inspiration down the drain.

OTOH of course they restore on a short rest from level 5 (IIRC) onwards, unlike Paladin spell slots, but then we get back to the issue of virtually no consequences for long resting.

[meleander]

Originally posted by Doomvora:

Gabriel... It's okay, paladins aren't real they can't hurt you.

Where do you live me and my friends from the order will prove you wrong you poor little lost lamb.

[talemore]

It's just another case of that game is now too hard and I feel in need to justify the game being too easy when every battle melts away like butter in a frying pan.

[talemore]

Who said fighting paladins would be fair
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWljkVDgZtc