Party without a healer

[Ana]

I would like to have a very aggressive party with a Thief, an Oathbreaker, a Draconic sorcerer and a Hunter but none of these subclasses are healer. At best they can do a few healing stuff but not so much.

I was wondering if anyone tried a party without a healer and if it was viable and not so hard compared to a balanced party (striker / defender / support / healer).

[Capt.Luke]

absolutly, I did it many time with 4 warrior 4 rogue etc etc even 4 eldrich knight, there is enought "healing item " in the game to play it without a "cleric" and even with a "healer" the heal of the 5th edition are very bad and almost useless

[WeenerTuck813]

With how BG3 has instituted potions, throw, and bonus actions it’s certainly more than fine

[Yojo0o]

Healing is terrible in 5e. All healing, with only a few high-level exceptions, is for a lesser amount than the damage you're likely to take in a turn, and it's inefficient to do in combat. If you're getting hit by 3d8 Chromatic Orbs or a 2d6+3 greatsword 1-2 times a round, the cleric's 1d8+4 Cure Wounds is a waste of an action and a spell slot. "Healer" characters are still best suited by focusing on damage, control, and buffs in a fight.

Outside of combat, resting is too efficient for healing to be much good, either. Short and long rests overshadow using spells outside of combat, though an occasional touch-up may be an okay idea in some cases.

Healing becomes good when a character is at 0 HP, because it adds to the action economy by getting the character back into a fight (and prevents them from dying, of course). And anybody with any amount of healing can fulfill that role. In your case, both your paladin and your ranger are capable of fixing up a downed ally, and if Healing Kits are added to the game, a Thief with the Healer feat can be an effective combat medic by using them to heal their buddies with a bonus action mid-fight. You're fine with this composition.

[SnarkOne]

A party without a healer is stronger because you have greater damage output and can reduce the enemy potential damage output faster.
Shadowheart is not really a healer specialisation (just the class), but I see why people would play her as such.

Gale, Wyll & Bae'zel have great damage potential as long as they can land their hits; the fight is over in less than 3 rounds. Especially now that we have level 5... Go with that combo if you mainly want to focus on range attacks

Go Shadowheart & build her for damage, Astarion + Bae'zel if you want to focus on melee attacks. Poison and fire attacks can work wonders with the Bless buff.

Offence > Defence

[RealDealBreaker]

Originally posted by SnarkOne:

Offence > Defence

Not quite. Both 'offence' and 'defence' should be broken down a bit and this affects how important each part is. Offence can be thought of as 'direct damage' and 'buffs' and defence can be 'mitigation' and 'healing' with 'control' as something that goes both ways (area denial, CC, etc.). I'd say that the hierarchhy is more like:
control > mitigation> direct damage> buffs > healing

[Yojo0o]

Originally posted by RealDealBreaker:

Originally posted by SnarkOne:

Offence > Defence

Not quite. Both 'offence' and 'defence' should be broken down a bit and this affects how important each part is. Offence can be thought of as 'direct damage' and 'buffs' and defence can be 'mitigation' and 'healing' with 'control' as something that goes both ways (area denial, CC, etc.). I'd say that the hierarchhy is more like:
control > mitigation> direct damage> buffs > healing

Agreed there.

I might phrase it like this: Keeping as much control over the flow of combat is the most important thing you can do, and healing is perhaps the least effective way to accomplish that.

[Ana]

Thanks, very instructive and reassuring for my party!

Yeah I agree with the proposition of shadowheart light and thief becase they could also be a good mix for Exploration.

Then if control is the most damage-reducing, a lore bard or a trickery cleric must be a good pick.

[dolby]

healing is great... that's all i'm gonna say the only reason i s not the best is cos there is a broken feat in 5e called Great weapon master...

[Yojo0o]

Originally posted by dolby:

healing is great... that's all i'm gonna say the only reason i s not the best is cos there is a broken feat in 5e called Great weapon master...

My dude, what?

[RealDealBreaker]

Originally posted by Ana:

Thanks, very instructive and reassuring for my party!

Yeah I agree with the proposition of shadowheart light and thief becase they could also be a good mix for Exploration.

Then if control is the most damage-reducing, a lore bard or a trickery cleric must be a good pick.

Anything that can restrict what the enemy can do (stun, restrain, other conditions) or make it so they do not want to do something (making an area of ground deal damage to enemies that enter it) are probably the best spells. And the good news is every spell casting class has access to at least a couple of these sorts of spells. Cleric (after they get a couple levels and get access to 3rd level spells and up in particular), druid, bard, and wizard are probably best in this regard and also have the spell slots available to make consistent use of these spells AND also deal direct damage with their other slots.

[RealDealBreaker]

Originally posted by dolby:

healing is great... that's all i'm gonna say the only reason i s not the best is cos there is a broken feat in 5e called Great weapon master...

Healing has never been good in core d&d (there are optional rules in most editions that make it better namely wounds) because a character with 1hp is just as effective as one at 100% hp. So long as your party can consistently output more damage than they take, healing is only useful for bumping hp up enough to avoid dying in the next round or getting them back from 0. A slot used to mitigate or prevent damage is far more useful than a slot used to heal.

[dolby]

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

Originally posted by dolby:

healing is great... that's all i'm gonna say the only reason i s not the best is cos there is a broken feat in 5e called Great weapon master...

My dude, what?

i'm talking about EA and it will be good in full game as well.. i mean you can heal back to full health get resistance and bless temp hp at the same time and god knows what else in full game...not sure what more do you want but ok.. Not to mention you can death door tank with 1 hp healing...

[dolby]

Originally posted by RealDealBreaker:

Originally posted by dolby:

healing is great... that's all i'm gonna say the only reason i s not the best is cos there is a broken feat in 5e called Great weapon master...

Healing has never been good in core d&d (there are optional rules in most editions that make it better namely wounds) because a character with 1hp is just as effective as one at 100% hp. So long as your party can consistently output more damage than they take, healing is only useful for bumping hp up enough to avoid dying in the next round or getting them back from 0. A slot used to mitigate or prevent damage is far more useful than a slot used to heal.

i dont care about core 5e lol for the last time...i care about bg 3... and 1 hp is still healing so ...

[Yojo0o]

And why is healing good in BG3, and what does GWM have to do with this?

[dolby]

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

And why is healing good in BG3, and what does GWM have to do with this?

it helps melee characters nuke targets before they can do anything...

not the only problem like that in game as well but it's the one i dislike the most.