How does evocation work?

[Emjay]

Hi folks,

How exactly does evocation work for wizards? I'm firing melfs acid arrow, circle of blades (or whatever), chromatic orb, flaming sphere and they all deal damage to my allies. Isn't it supposed to negate that?

I get if the floor is all of a sudden fire, then it will burn. But I didn't expect to take impact damage on all of these.

If it's such a good spec to take, what should I be casting? Because I can't see anything that makes sense right now...

[Jimmy]

those aren't evocation spells

[Lucifronz]

It doesn't affect all spells for some reason. Bug, oversight or just another ability that doesn't describe its utility right.

From someone on Fextralife's page, here is a list:

1st level:
Burning Hands
Thunderwave
Faerie Fire**

2nd level:
Shatter
Moonbeam**
Gust of Wind

3rd level:
Fireball
Lightning Bolt

4th level:
Ice Storm (Might not work)
Wall of Fire

5th level:
Cone of Cold
Flame Strike**

6th level:
Sunbeam
Otiluke's Freezing Sphere

Spells marked with ** are not wizard spells. I have not tested them. Sculpt spells does still work with them but none of them are better than anything offered by wizard of that level.
Technically Blade Barrier is evocation but you would have to be 11th level cleric to prepare it so it cannot be obtained along sculpt spells.

[Lucifronz]

Originally posted by Jimmy:

those aren't evocation spells

Yes they are. All of them are except for Flaming Sphere. I am not sure about the blades spell, though, I don't remember what that's actually called and I can't find it on Fextralife. I've seen it used, but I've never prepared it myself.

[Fringehunter7719]

Originally posted by Jimmy:

those aren't evocation spells

Melf's Acid Arrow and Chromatic Orb are.

[Fringehunter7719]

Originally posted by Lucifronz:

I am not sure about the blades spell, though, I don't remember what that's actually called and I can't find it on Fextralife.

Presumably Cloud of Daggers. Which is a conjuration.

[Snaef]

Both melf's acid arrow and chromatic orb are single target spells however.
Pretty sure the ability's description accurately specify evocation spells.
Thunder wave, shatter and fireball are obvious choices to use as a specialist evoker.

[Doomvora]

Originally posted by Emjay:

Hi folks,

How exactly does evocation work for wizards? I'm firing melfs acid arrow, circle of blades (or whatever), chromatic orb, flaming sphere and they all deal damage to my allies. Isn't it supposed to negate that?

I get if the floor is all of a sudden fire, then it will burn. But I didn't expect to take impact damage on all of these.

If it's such a good spec to take, what should I be casting? Because I can't see anything that makes sense right now...

Circle of daggers isn't evocation thus unaffected, chromatic orb doesn't do aoe as a source of its damage and thus isn't affected, flaming sphere is also not evocation and thus unaffected, melf's also doesn't do aoe damage and thus unaffected.

Sculpt spells specifically makes your party members succeed on saving throws and take no damage from the spell itself. Melf's creates a pool of acid which is not part of the spells damage, Chromatic orb follows the same principle.

Sculpt spells is for aoe spells.

TLDR

They're not strictly aoe (think of it like fireball style targeting) spells and thus are not affected by the sculpt spells evocation subclass feature which is for aoe evocation spells.

[Lucifronz]

Originally posted by Fringehunter7719:

Originally posted by Lucifronz:

I am not sure about the blades spell, though, I don't remember what that's actually called and I can't find it on Fextralife.

Presumably Cloud of Daggers. Which is a conjuration.

CLOUD of Daggers, that's what it was. Thank you. And yes, that makes sense now that I think of it. You're literally conjuring forth daggers.

[Moffin Bovin]

Originally posted by Lucifronz:

It doesn't affect all spells for some reason.

the reason is that it affects "Evocation" spells.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by Doomvora:

Originally posted by Emjay:

Hi folks,

How exactly does evocation work for wizards? I'm firing melfs acid arrow, circle of blades (or whatever), chromatic orb, flaming sphere and they all deal damage to my allies. Isn't it supposed to negate that?

I get if the floor is all of a sudden fire, then it will burn. But I didn't expect to take impact damage on all of these.

If it's such a good spec to take, what should I be casting? Because I can't see anything that makes sense right now...

Circle of daggers isn't evocation thus unaffected, chromatic orb doesn't do aoe as a source of its damage and thus isn't affected, flaming sphere is also not evocation and thus unaffected, melf's also doesn't do aoe damage and thus unaffected.

Sculpt spells specifically makes your party members succeed on saving throws and take no damage from the spell itself. Melf's creates a pool of acid which is not part of the spells damage, Chromatic orb follows the same principle.

Sculpt spells is for aoe spells.

TLDR

They're not strictly aoe (think of it like fireball style targeting) spells and thus are not affected by the sculpt spells evocation subclass feature which is for aoe evocation spells.

Well...

Except that Larian's homebrew makes every type of Orb AoE except Thunder.

For consistency's sake, Chromatic Orb (all damage types except Thunder) should fall under the influence of Sculpt Spell.

I would agree about Melf's Acid Arrow, however, since the spell doesn't deal any AoE or even multitarget damage. Pools of acid only reduce AC.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by Snaef:

Both melf's acid arrow and chromatic orb are single target spells however.
Pretty sure the ability's description accurately specify evocation spells.
Thunder wave, shatter and fireball are obvious choices to use as a specialist evoker.

Every damage type of Chromatic Orb except Thunder is AoE.

This is Larian homebrew.

[Doomvora]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Loveless:

Well...

Except that Larian's homebrew makes every type of Orb AoE except Thunder.

For consistency's sake, Chromatic Orb (all damage types except Thunder) should fall under the influence of Sculpt Spell.

I would agree about Melf's Acid Arrow, however, since the spell doesn't deal any AoE or even multitarget damage. Pools of acid only reduce AC.

Chromatic orb isn't aoe, the after effects are aoe like the acid surface, burning surface etc, the damage from chromatic orb is not aoe and thus not affected by sculpt spells. Same thing with melf's.

That aoe field it shows when you cast chromatic orb and melf's is strictly for the after effect, not the actual damaging part of the spell.

[Moffin Bovin]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Loveless:

Originally posted by Snaef:

Both melf's acid arrow and chromatic orb are single target spells however.
Pretty sure the ability's description accurately specify evocation spells.
Thunder wave, shatter and fireball are obvious choices to use as a specialist evoker.

Every damage type of Chromatic Orb except Thunder is AoE.

This is Larian homebrew.

It makes a surface and there is no thunder surface.

Sculpt spell doesn't protect you from the surfaces that evocation spells create. Ice storm wont hurt you but you can still slip on the ice.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by Doomvora:

Originally posted by Pan Darius Loveless:

Well...

Except that Larian's homebrew makes every type of Orb AoE except Thunder.

For consistency's sake, Chromatic Orb (all damage types except Thunder) should fall under the influence of Sculpt Spell.

I would agree about Melf's Acid Arrow, however, since the spell doesn't deal any AoE or even multitarget damage. Pools of acid only reduce AC.

Chromatic orb isn't aoe, the after effects are aoe like the acid surface, burning surface etc, the damage from chromatic orb is not aoe and thus not affected by sculpt spells. Same thing with melf's.

That aoe field it shows when you cast chromatic orb and melf's is strictly for the after effect, not the actual damaging part of the spell.

If that's true, then Larian's presentation of the spell is even more facepalm worthy.

They shouldn't make a single target spell appear as an AoE.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by Moffin Bovin:

Originally posted by Pan Darius Loveless:

Every damage type of Chromatic Orb except Thunder is AoE.

This is Larian homebrew.

It makes a surface and there is no thunder surface.

Sculpt spell doesn't protect you from the surfaces that evocation spells create. Ice storm wont hurt you but you can still slip on the ice.

Do you mean Sleet Storm?