Quicken spell is supposed to cost 2 sorcery points not 3

[Sephiroth]

Looked at the 5E rulebook just now. Says quicken is supposed to cost 2 yet it cost 3 in this game. Fix ASAP.

Sorcerors are under powered as are casters in general.

Simple melee fighters are way better than spell casters in this game. You need to address the fact that casters are really under powered.

When a melee fighter can do 7 attacks a turn inflict bleed, open wounds etc without cost them concentration like spell casters need for various spells and effects.
They have more health armor./..
They can JUMP really far.... without needing to cast fly... etc.

anyway I will be looking over this more thoroughly

Because casters are without a question under powered.

[Army of Optimists]

Originally posted by ChaosKhan:

Originally posted by Army of Optimists:

As Szorrin said, it's actually buffed because Quicken in the tabletop doesn't bypass the wonky casting rules, where if you cast a leveled spell as your main action you can't cast anything else that turn. You can only cast a cantrip on your main action and quicken a leveled spell on your bonus action.

Yeah, but they didn't improve the spell slots at the same time. Basically, the homebrew forces you to use more slots, but you don't have them, making long rests after every second fight mandatory if you run a caster heavy group. It's annoying and disruptive, to say the least.

Yeah, I edited that comment to mention that I still believe the majority of Larian's homebrew benefits martials. Specifically, letting everyone cast from scrolls is a monumental change that seriously harms casters. Any spells you actually *need* can be obtained with some gold and stashed away for those crucial moments.

[NorthernDavid]

In the D&D rules you can also only cast a specific combination of spells if you are casting more than one per turn. Specifically if you cast a spell with a bonus action you can only cast a cantrip that costs 1 action as an additional spell. In BG3 when you cast a spell with a bonus action you can cast any spell that has a cost of one action as an additional action. So in BG3 you could for example cast 2 fireballs in one turn, in the 5e rules you could not. The extra point could be a balancing factor for this increased casting flexability.

[Xiwang]

its due limitations on how the game was made then.

[Enigmatory]

Originally posted by NorthernDavid:

In the D&D rules you can also only cast a specific combination of spells if you are casting more than one per turn. Specifically if you cast a spell with a bonus action you can only cast a cantrip that costs 1 action as an additional spell. In BG3 when you cast a spell with a bonus action you can cast any spell that has a cost of one action as an additional action. So in BG3 you could for example cast 2 fireballs in one turn, in the 5e rules you could not. The extra point could be a balancing factor for this increased casting flexability.

Sorcerer under haste still can cast 3 full spells in one round. Because Larian GD didn't consider how broken it is. Haste that giving extra action(which is actually spell about 7-9 level value) to anyone literally breaking 5e cournerstone and making fighter unique feature action surge - garbage.

[Sephiroth]

Originally posted by Recjawjind:

Originally posted by Szorrin:

Could be an oversight, could also be intentional. Because, unlike tabletop 5e, you can cast 2 leveled spells in the same turn with Quickened Spell.

Its 100000000000000000000000000000000% intentional, not even a question.

Casters are under powered no questions asked.

We just need to fix the problems.

Concentration is a big one.

Bad spells still require it things like blur might actually have some use if it was not for concentration.

Improved invisibility might actually work if it was not for concentration. (at least in its current form)

Improved invisibility basically is regular invisibility. It comes off anytime you do anything. Useless.

We already know about the checks and skills. Which are all designed like trash.
Improved invisibility is checking your constitution for concentration checks... and again stealth checks themselves are not something a caster would invest in.

This is something spells usually fix on their own by giving nice bonuses from the spell itself. Like in pathfinder using improved invisibility actually gives you like a +20 to stealth for example.

[Sephiroth]

Originally posted by NorthernDavid:

In the D&D rules you can also only cast a specific combination of spells if you are casting more than one per turn. Specifically if you cast a spell with a bonus action you can only cast a cantrip that costs 1 action as an additional spell. In BG3 when you cast a spell with a bonus action you can cast any spell that has a cost of one action as an additional action. So in BG3 you could for example cast 2 fireballs in one turn, in the 5e rules you could not. The extra point could be a balancing factor for this increased casting flexability.

Looking over the entire game the final verdict is that casters are under powered.

Its not a question of if its a question of how to fix the problem.

Rules are in a book made a long time ago. That is there this is here. I understand we do not need to follow the rules exactly because they clearly have not done that with this game.

What we need to do is make casters good.

I can easily make a party of 4 fighters and steam roll the entire game with no worry about learning because the classes are soo strong.

I want casters to not be under powered.

example 2 fireballs in 1 turn cost a lot of resources. 3 of your sorc. points meaning you can do that like 1 time a day at level 5 and may be 2 times a day at level 6..... that is for the entire day.. which could both easily be used in 1 battle....

That is not an amazing feat when you compare it to a figher who can attack 7 times a turn while inflicting bleed, open wounds, forcing weapons to drop, proning, dazing... etc...

All these things while they are still dealing their tremendous damage out put and since they have so many attacks they are picking and choosing who and what to kill at will... with.. no worry about running out of spells to do so...

do to the horrible design they can even use scrolls... that should be removed ASAP. but that would not solve the problem that casters suck nope and it would not stop fighters from being so powerful compared to a caster. I am not looking or caring to nerfing fighters though.

I want casters to good and they suck in this game.

[LordAnubis]

This is one of the changes Larian made to BG3. It's intended. Also in tabletop, you can only ever cast 1 leveled spell in a round, so you couldn't Fireball, Haste Fireball and Quicken Fireball. In BG3 you can. That's the tradeoff.

[Mizu]

Of course if you focus on nothing but ability to melt the health bar of a single target as your criteria for usefulness the melee maniacs should win. Damaging enemies with single target strikes is literally all they are good for so they damned well better be the best at it. Though i like how you pretend they can do 7 strikes a turn unassisted without burning through limited resources like action surge and haste potions while repeatedly emphasizing that magic users spend spell slots to cast spells. But your spell casters can do a lot more for your team then just inflicting damage, especially wizards, clerics, and druids with their total access to a broad number of spells to choose from that allow them to adapt to different situations.

[Blackfrost]

Originally posted by Sephiroth:

Originally posted by NorthernDavid:

In the D&D rules you can also only cast a specific combination of spells if you are casting more than one per turn. Specifically if you cast a spell with a bonus action you can only cast a cantrip that costs 1 action as an additional spell. In BG3 when you cast a spell with a bonus action you can cast any spell that has a cost of one action as an additional action. So in BG3 you could for example cast 2 fireballs in one turn, in the 5e rules you could not. The extra point could be a balancing factor for this increased casting flexability.

Looking over the entire game the final verdict is that casters are under powered.

Its not a question of if its a question of how to fix the problem.

Rules are in a book made a long time ago. That is there this is here. I understand we do not need to follow the rules exactly because they clearly have not done that with this game.

What we need to do is make casters good.

I can easily make a party of 4 fighters and steam roll the entire game with no worry about learning because the classes are soo strong.

I want casters to not be under powered.

example 2 fireballs in 1 turn cost a lot of resources. 3 of your sorc. points meaning you can do that like 1 time a day at level 5 and may be 2 times a day at level 6..... that is for the entire day.. which could both easily be used in 1 battle....

That is not an amazing feat when you compare it to a figher who can attack 7 times a turn while inflicting bleed, open wounds, forcing weapons to drop, proning, dazing... etc...

All these things while they are still dealing their tremendous damage out put and since they have so many attacks they are picking and choosing who and what to kill at will... with.. no worry about running out of spells to do so...

do to the horrible design they can even use scrolls... that should be removed ASAP. but that would not solve the problem that casters suck nope and it would not stop fighters from being so powerful compared to a caster. I am not looking or caring to nerfing fighters though.

I want casters to good and they suck in this game.

No, the actual problem is that weapon-users are overpowered because of how this game treats extra Actions with Multiattack.

A level 11 fighter makes 3 attacks.
With Haste, they're supposed to make 4 attacks total ( as per D&D 5e rules ).
Yet in BG3, a Hasted Fighter of 11th level makes 6 attacks.
Which means that with Action Surge, you can make 9.
And with Great Weapon Master, you make 10.

They tried to balance it by removing the "1 spell slot per round" limitation of casters, which is not as strong due damage stacking favoring weapon-users.

Casters are all right, but weapon-users are busted beyond belief.
Which honestly is quite fun. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Enigmatory]

Originally posted by Blackfrost:

Originally posted by Sephiroth:

Looking over the entire game the final verdict is that casters are under powered.

Its not a question of if its a question of how to fix the problem.

Rules are in a book made a long time ago. That is there this is here. I understand we do not need to follow the rules exactly because they clearly have not done that with this game.

What we need to do is make casters good.

I can easily make a party of 4 fighters and steam roll the entire game with no worry about learning because the classes are soo strong.

I want casters to not be under powered.

example 2 fireballs in 1 turn cost a lot of resources. 3 of your sorc. points meaning you can do that like 1 time a day at level 5 and may be 2 times a day at level 6..... that is for the entire day.. which could both easily be used in 1 battle....

That is not an amazing feat when you compare it to a figher who can attack 7 times a turn while inflicting bleed, open wounds, forcing weapons to drop, proning, dazing... etc...

All these things while they are still dealing their tremendous damage out put and since they have so many attacks they are picking and choosing who and what to kill at will... with.. no worry about running out of spells to do so...

do to the horrible design they can even use scrolls... that should be removed ASAP. but that would not solve the problem that casters suck nope and it would not stop fighters from being so powerful compared to a caster. I am not looking or caring to nerfing fighters though.

I want casters to good and they suck in this game.

No, the actual problem is that weapon-users are overpowered because of how this game treats extra Actions with Multiattack.

A level 11 fighter makes 3 attacks.
With Haste, they're supposed to make 4 attacks total ( as per D&D 5e rules ).
Yet in BG3, a Hasted Fighter of 11th level makes 6 attacks.
Which means that with Action Surge, you can make 9.
And with Great Weapon Master, you make 10.

They tried to balance it by removing the "1 spell slot per round" limitation of casters, which is not as strong due damage stacking favoring weapon-users.

Casters are all right, but weapon-users are busted beyond belief.
Which honestly is quite fun. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I've seen how to do 600 damage with sorcerer in one round somewhere on this forum.

[Blackfrost]

Originally posted by Enigmatory:

Originally posted by Blackfrost:

No, the actual problem is that weapon-users are overpowered because of how this game treats extra Actions with Multiattack.

A level 11 fighter makes 3 attacks.
With Haste, they're supposed to make 4 attacks total ( as per D&D 5e rules ).
Yet in BG3, a Hasted Fighter of 11th level makes 6 attacks.
Which means that with Action Surge, you can make 9.
And with Great Weapon Master, you make 10.

They tried to balance it by removing the "1 spell slot per round" limitation of casters, which is not as strong due damage stacking favoring weapon-users.

Casters are all right, but weapon-users are busted beyond belief.
Which honestly is quite fun. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I've seen how to do 600 damage with sorcerer in one round somewhere on this forum.

You mean this? ( slight act 2 spoiler )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QssuPArBJK8

That's a 6th level Paladin with just 2 Sorc levels, and as you can see the stacking damage comes from weapon-based attacks ( Great Weapon Master + Prepare + Relentless Revenge + Oil of Sharpness + Haste + Divine Smite )

I would be highly surprised to see an 8th level caster do even a third of the damage in a single turn, since at most you'll cast 3 spells ( unless they're specifically using a mob with natural vulnerability to an element, for example ).

[Sentient_Toaster]

Originally posted by LordAnubis:

This is one of the changes Larian made to BG3. It's intended. Also in tabletop, you can only ever cast 1 leveled spell in a round, so you couldn't Fireball, Haste Fireball and Quicken Fireball. In BG3 you can. That's the tradeoff.

Not precisely.

The limit is basically just that casting a spell with a bonus action - whether cantrip or leveled - means that the only other spell you can cast on your turn can be a cantrip with a casting time of exactly one leveled action.

It is entirely legal to cast three leveled spells in one turn and this can be done deterministically (e.g. fighter-2/wizard-5 can cast Fireball with his action; use his reaction to cast Counterspell in response to an enemy caster trying to Counterspell his Fireball; invoke Action Surge; and use the new action to Hold Person or Blindness/Deafness that caster. However, he couldn't then Misty Step away, since that'd use a bonus action and he's already cast non-1-action-cantrips on his turn.

There's even actually at least one legal way to cast four leveled spells in one turn at level three when you hav just two spell slots, but it requires your table be full of chaos worshippers (Fighter 2/Wild Magic Sorcerer 1; cast spell with one of your spell slots while invoking Tides of Chaos, DM causes an immediate surge which ends up having you cast another spell automatically and reset Tides; action surge and do it again so long as you didn't die because you fireballed yourself).

'course, the other bit is also that Haste has a limited menu of things you're allowed to do with the action, and neither Cast a Spell nor making more than one weapon attack is an option.

[Kafik]

OP: *tries hammering in a nail - fails*
PO: "This screwdriver SUCKS it doesn't work!"

There's different classes in D&D for a reason. It's perfectly fine to not understand how to fully utilize a class because you prefer one style of gaming. Casters are always weaker in the lower levels because that's the trade off to the higher levels. Been that way since basic D&D. That's why party balance is important. If you roll a sorcerer the first two NPCs you meet are a fighter and a cleric. You don't even need a fourth character in your party if you don't want except on tactician difficulty. First few levels the sorc is support for your cleric and fighter but as you grow in power the sorc can become the main damage dealer and your fighter and cleric are there for support.

[Sephiroth]

Originally posted by LordAnubis:

This is one of the changes Larian made to BG3. It's intended. Also in tabletop, you can only ever cast 1 leveled spell in a round, so you couldn't Fireball, Haste Fireball and Quicken Fireball. In BG3 you can. That's the tradeoff.

Someone is missing the basic understanding of the state of the game. Casters are without question under powered.

Try reading as well before you post because you have not said anything that has not already been spoken or about. We know bro.

[Sephiroth]

Originally posted by Mizu:

Of course if you focus on nothing but ability to melt the health bar of a single target as your criteria for usefulness the melee maniacs should win. Damaging enemies with single target strikes is literally all they are good for so they damned well better be the best at it. Though i like how you pretend they can do 7 strikes a turn unassisted without burning through limited resources like action surge and haste potions while repeatedly emphasizing that magic users spend spell slots to cast spells. But your spell casters can do a lot more for your team then just inflicting damage, especially wizards, clerics, and druids with their total access to a broad number of spells to choose from that allow them to adapt to different situations.

I like you protend that haste potions are not abundant

I like how you gloss over more imbalance like the fact fighters should not be able to use scrolls normally and since they can that means they can have more access to haste via scrolls.

Nice failed post.