Question about paladin + sorceror

[Xan84]

So I was having issues picking between paladin and sorc and then I realized I could combine the 2 so I read around and found something with 2 in paladin and rest in sorc, focusing on strength and charisma, secondary on stamina.
My question is, is this an easy class to play? I need it easy :)
I was thinking of doing some tanking and throwing spells around. seems good to me.

[Foolswalkin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Yojo0o:

The 2/10 split really wants you to have access to Booming/Green Flame Blade to Quicken them as a pseudo-Extra Attack. Since BG3 doesn't have these, I'm skeptical of that level split. At that point, I might rather just have Fighter levels for Action Surge, one level of Cleric for armor/heals/cantrips, or just go full Sorcerer.

Since? Is this now known?

[jk2l]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Foolswalkin:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Yojo0o:

The 2/10 split really wants you to have access to Booming/Green Flame Blade to Quicken them as a pseudo-Extra Attack. Since BG3 doesn't have these, I'm skeptical of that level split. At that point, I might rather just have Fighter levels for Action Surge, one level of Cleric for armor/heals/cantrips, or just go full Sorcerer.

Since? Is this now known?

don't think anyone know full spell list yet. we will know in 2 weeks

[Foolswalkin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από jk2l:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Foolswalkin:

Since? Is this now known?

don't think anyone know full spell list yet. we will know in 2 weeks

Ah. Swen is doing a lot of interviews where he drops info (e.g. ability to make origin characters not be their canon class), didn’t know if the cantrips or lack thereof were in one of those.

Also re: your earlier point w Auras - Ancients Paladin is definitely worth 7 levels to get. The others I would agree are not worth it.

Bards just can’t get the love on this forum. Hard time shaking their 2/3s caster rep from previous editions, maybe.

[Miqi]

We've no idea of what the full spell list looks like yet.
We got teased 50 spells in community Update 20 and there's about 200 spells and actions in EA.

They advertise the game to have 600+ spells and actions.


As for your build.
Try it out as you please, since you can respec mid-game, there's absolutely nothing that can ruin your run.

[.Master Jiren, The Strongest]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Xan84:

So I was having issues picking between paladin and sorc and then I realized I could combine the 2 so I read around and found something with 2 in paladin and rest in sorc, focusing on strength and charisma, secondary on stamina.
My question is, is this an easy class to play? I need it easy :)
I was thinking of doing some tanking and throwing spells around. seems good to me.

yes this is the most popular build in the game so far. its the one i see people talking about the most, and in all time dnd 5e its consistently in the top 3 builds. of course this is only as far as damage goes, its actually worthless for literally everything else, but thats ok, people mainly only care about combat.

So the reason its good is because paladins are half casters so they dont get many spell slots, but sorcerers are full casters and get lots of spell slots, plus they get sorcery points which turn into more spell slots or give you options for bonus actions.

what you do is take at least 2 levels in paladin to start off, as long as your constitution is, lets say, 14 or so, this will start you out with very respectable hp and high armor class so you will be pretty much as tanky as humanly possible this early in the game. The next 10 levels you put into sorcerer to unlock as many spell slots as possible to use with divine smite.

for me though, this means you lose out on the most powerful spells in the game, 6th level spells. of course, we dont know which 6th level spells are actually in the game, since we dont know, its tough to say how much of a problem it is to lose out on those spells.

on the other hand, 10 levels in sorcerer gets you a 2nd 5th level spell slot, and thats the strongest spell slot you can use. While you only need 4th level spell slots for divine smite, 5th level spell slots would be your ultimate spell without 6th level options.

So, get hp, get armor, get a weapon, grab a cantrip like booming blade, go into melee and divine smite everything.

[Foolswalkin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από .Master Jiren, The Strongest:

on the other hand, 10 levels in sorcerer gets you a 2nd 5th level spell slot, and thats the strongest spell slot you can use. While you only need 4th level spell slots for divine smite, 5th level spell slots would be your ultimate spell without 6th level options.

That's incorrect. Paladin 2/Sorc 10 gets a 6th level spell slot. They don't have 6th level spells, but are likely perfectly happy upcasting Fireball or Cone of Cold or whatever.

[Yojo0o]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Foolswalkin:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Yojo0o:

The 2/10 split really wants you to have access to Booming/Green Flame Blade to Quicken them as a pseudo-Extra Attack. Since BG3 doesn't have these, I'm skeptical of that level split. At that point, I might rather just have Fighter levels for Action Surge, one level of Cleric for armor/heals/cantrips, or just go full Sorcerer.

Since? Is this now known?

Not definitively, but they were a later addition to 5e, so I wouldn't count on them. They're certainly not PHB.

[Midnight]

The max level in this game is 12 and a full campaign playthrough is said to take upwards of 80+ hours.

So delaying any crucial features, especially on a first blind playthrough sounds like a really bad idea to me.

In this example you won't be getting an extra attack from Paladin which is a MASSIVE power boost to martial classes.

And you won't be getting some of the better spells for a long time.

Late game it will probably be powerful but for most of the playthrough I'd expect a pure melee buffed up Valor/Sword Bard will outdo Paladin/Sorc on damage and utility.

[Foolswalkin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Yojo0o:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Foolswalkin:

Since? Is this now known?

Not definitively, but they were a later addition to 5e, so I wouldn't count on them. They're certainly not PHB.

I agree with all those statements. But they're also a central pillar to a bunch of builds, so I think they're more likely than those statements make them seem. Coinflip, maybe.

[FunkyMonkey]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Midnight:

Late game it will probably be powerful but for most of the playthrough I'd expect a pure melee buffed up Valor/Sword Bard will outdo Paladin/Sorc on damage, defense and utility.

I'm interested, why do you think valor/swords bard would have better damage or defense than paladin/sorcerer? Heavy armor and high saves is hard for a bard to beat and on damage I can't think of anything on a bard that does more damage than even basic smites.

[Foolswalkin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Midnight:

The max level in this game is 12 and a full campaign playthrough is said to take upwards of 80+ hours.

So delaying any crucial features, especially on a first blind playthrough sounds like a really bad idea to me.

In this example you won't be getting an extra attack from Paladin which is a MASSIVE power boost to melee classes.

And you won't be getting some of the better spells for a long time.

Late game it will probably be powerful but for most of the playthrough I'd expect a pure melee buffed up Valor/Sword Bard will outdo Paladin/Sorc on damage and utility.

On Paladin jobs of Smite damage, tanking, and support, I'd say Sword Bard hybrid Vengeance Paladin (Swordadin) is the way to go over both Paladin and pure Bard - Swordadin in particular makes an excellent critfisher being able to stack Flourishes and Smites onto crits, while as tanking is just CC by another name things like Hypnotic Pattern are going to outdo Compelled Duel (not to mention the utility of Mobile Flourish in getting enemies away from your squishies). Swordadins also get the ability to use Inspiration without consuming either a bonus action (Valor Bard) or reaction (Lore Bard), so they can use two weapon fighting bonus attacks (for more critfishing) and AoOs (for more melee stickiness).

Sorcadin, tho, is more of a "Fireball, Quickened Fireball, encounter over" kinda deal, with Smites + Weapon Cantrips (if in, they scale with level) as backup. So that's a kind of damage that Swordadin just can't compete with.

[Midnight]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από FunkyMonkey:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Midnight:

Late game it will probably be powerful but for most of the playthrough I'd expect a pure melee buffed up Valor/Sword Bard will outdo Paladin/Sorc on damage, defense and utility.

I'm interested, why do you think valor/swords bard would have better damage or defense than paladin/sorcerer? Heavy armor and high saves is hard for a bard to beat and on damage I can't think of anything on a bard that does more damage than even basic smites.

Bard has a full spell progression of buffs. So that helps defence a lot.
And Sword/Valor have their bardic inspiration die to damage and can use it more than twice a full rest unlike Paladin(2).
Sword gets a push attack with that which is huge in this game.

DEX two-weapon fighting Sword Bard will definitely have higher AC early on than what heavy armor will get you (can't even gets full palte in act 1 as far as I know). In fact even the Paladin might want to buff up and go medium tops or even light.

Also, Bards will get an extra attack. Paladin(2)/Sorc will never do.
But yeah first 2 levels of Paladin you will likely be better in melee. But once you start going sorc you lose a lot of that potential.

It would be better to pure paladin or go pure sorc is really my point. And if you want to play a hybrid then the dedicated "hybrid" class (Bard) will carry you better though the start-mid of the game.

Also, Bard is a skill monkey which helps.

[Foolswalkin]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Midnight:

It would be better to pure paladin or go pure sorc is really my point. And if you want to play a hybrid then the dedicated "hybrid" class (Bard) will carry you better though the start-mid of the game.

But the hybrid hybrid of Swordadin is even better. Fight me. ;)

[wtiger27]

The game is not hard once you are able to have a full party with any class. Play the class you think you will enjoy the most.

[Midnight]

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Foolswalkin:

Αναρτήθηκε αρχικά από Midnight:

The max level in this game is 12 and a full campaign playthrough is said to take upwards of 80+ hours.

So delaying any crucial features, especially on a first blind playthrough sounds like a really bad idea to me.

In this example you won't be getting an extra attack from Paladin which is a MASSIVE power boost to melee classes.

And you won't be getting some of the better spells for a long time.

Late game it will probably be powerful but for most of the playthrough I'd expect a pure melee buffed up Valor/Sword Bard will outdo Paladin/Sorc on damage and utility.

On Paladin jobs of Smite damage, tanking, and support, I'd say Sword Bard hybrid Vengeance Paladin (Swordadin) is the way to go over both Paladin and pure Bard - Swordadin in particular makes an excellent critfisher being able to stack Flourishes and Smites onto crits, while as tanking is just CC by another name things like Hypnotic Pattern are going to outdo Compelled Duel (not to mention the utility of Mobile Flourish in getting enemies away from your squishies). Swordadins also get the ability to use Inspiration without consuming either a bonus action (Valor Bard) or reaction (Lore Bard), so they can use two weapon fighting bonus attacks (for more critfishing) and AoOs (for more melee stickiness).

Sorcadin, tho, is more of a "Fireball, Quickened Fireball, encounter over" kinda deal, with Smites + Weapon Cantrips (if in, they scale with level) as backup. So that's a kind of damage that Swordadin just can't compete with.

I don't doubt this but my question is when?

When does it come online because if there's like 5 hours between levels and you really need that stuff NOW then some kind of OP endpoing doesn't help.

Even in Early Access the difference between lvl 4 and lvl 5 fighter is the difference between solid frontliner and a complete blender. Since 2 full attacks on a boss vs 4 is a massive difference.

And if you delay that for hours for some theoretical payoff later you are gonna feel that.

If it's a later game build then you should probably respect into it. And the OP wanted to start this way.