Recruiting minthara. Too costly?

[Norbac]

Minor spoilers ahead.

Siding with minthara automatically removes wyll and karlach from your party.
Gale leaves as well unless persuaded.

Halsin is a druid and you can't recruit him after destroying their camp.

Edit: unless you cheese the game, you will lose wyll, karlach and halsin. Gale has to be persuaded to stay.

[Norbac]

Publicado originalmente por L3wt:

Publicado originalmente por AncientToaster:

Losing Gale is tough but Karlach and Wyll it isn’t a big deal. If you’re going to play Evil these two would have never agreed and stayed anyway.

Minthara, Shadow and Lae’Zel are more than decent companions for Evil run

Plus the goblins in your camp playing with the horns of baby tieflings afterwards IS SO CUUUTE! I make sure to talk to each and every one so I don't miss out on any juicy details. My wife Minthara may not care for them much, but I am very much a goblin daddy!

I always feel like kicking Gale back through the portal where I first find him anyway so dragging him along for the killings is DIAMONDS.

Gale is cursed anyway, he's welcome to leave. Everyone else who left is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ dead if I see them again.

[L3wt]

Publicado originalmente por Norbac:

Gale is cursed anyway, he's welcome to leave. Everyone else who left is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ dead if I see them again.

Heh heh, touché.

[Victoria]

Playing as Lawful Evil is basically impossible without ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ yourself over. The evil route is clearly designed around you murdering everything, if you want to be pragmatic? Nah, not going to work.

[BuildtheWall]

No problem keeping Gale, with Minthara.. jaheira joined up later on so no issues with that? I do think minthara's character should be able to join parties of varying alignments. I don't really think she's any more evil than Lae'zel starts out as, and they make you take her pretty much.

[RamzaBehoulve]

Publicado originalmente por Niki Lauda:

thats why we do multiple play throughs one where we team up with the good peeps and then the dark urge where we kill everyone except minthara

I didn't get the urge to kill her. I just knocked her down with non-lethal damage and then she disapeared.

[TheLuckyAce]

Publicado originalmente por Locklave:

I feel like a lot of people just think evil playstyle should be punished compared to good playstyle. So naturally if the game overly punishes evil they will justify it.

Being good should cost nothing according to them. Doing the right thing is also the most rewarding thing. This is not balanced game design.

Publicado originalmente por TheLuckyAce:

You must not jump through hops and alternate paths to get Minthara without losing more than Halsin. You just must not walk the prelined easy path... I've seen LP's who went first into the swamp and through this found a way into the Underdark... if they would followed this instead of "saving the grove going to the Gobos" first... they would have skipped this part and got Minthara without losing.

You mean the path that leads away from the actual story and events happening around you? That's a big problem, that this isn't a natural game path at all. Nor would this game path lead you to believe the outcome you get would be the result.

The Druid Grove and Tiefling stuff is NOT the mainquest... ;) The MAINQUEST is to get rid of the Tadpole. Which is at the Moonthingy Tower. Not in the Grove, not in the Gobo Camp... nonono :) Lea'Zel even TELLLS you to ignore the stuip Druid and Tiefling stuff and go on.

So you are chasing a sidequest which TELLS you at several situations that it leads AWAY from your main quest. If you follow this SIDEQUEST (okay its a big one, but stilll a sidequest) it has an outcome and this does not fit your idea of how it should be... happens.

I totaly agree with the idea Larian had for this way of getting Minthara into your party. You have the fast and bloody way, cost you maybe most of your Party or the slower way with ditching some content.

Additional idea... maybe just do NOT recruite most of the people until you raided the grove? What happens if you find Karlach for example afterwards?

[KingOfFriedChicken]

Publicado originalmente por Zaris:

- Astarion and most likely Minthara both pure evil.

Astarion is a vampire spawn but not evil, he is Okay with blood and guts and the evil path but as long as you keep taking him towards his goal he also doesn't care.

I think it would be an interesting run to get minthara then full 180 to good path to see if she is fully evil but honestly if you are that far you're probably gonna commit rofl

[Lucifer69]

Minthara being a Drow Paladin, and one with evil morals, fits perfectly with my half elf sorcerer with a dark past.

Asterion loves watching the blood bath, and Lea'zel is usually right behind me causing chaos. Shadowheart is 50/ 50 in most cases. Not caring or approves.

It's a shame we don't have a neutral or evil aligned warlock. I would love some more ranged dps, but my sorcerer does just fine twin spell/ quickin spell and handing out orbs like they are on sale.

Anyways, you can recruit Minthara by not encountering her at all, or by knocking her out with a non lethal. She is a paladin, even if orc or tiefling are slightly superior purely for paper stats. My pick for second best class in the game (tank, dps, healing, and buffs). Bard number one because rolls for days and sorcerer close third for killing everything in one turn.

[GrugIsRock]

Publicado originalmente por Norbac:

Minor spoilers ahead.

Siding with minthara automatically removes wyll and karlach from your party.
Gale leaves as well unless persuaded.

Halsin is a druid and you can't recruit him after destroying their camp.
Then i'm 95% sure you can't recruit jaheira because she's literally your enemy.

You lose FIVE companions and you are left with lae'zel, shadowheart and astarion.

I understand the choices you make should have consequences, but they overdid it.
Been playing the last 10h with a party that I don't like because I have no choice, all for the sake of a character that hasn't even joined my party yet. What the ♥♥♥♥.

so you are left with all the good companions. Nobody like Halsin, wyll, and karlach.

[Mathias Giovanni]

Publicado originalmente por ObsidianButterfly:

They did a really bad job with Minthara, honestly, and her possible recruitment should have been changed. It was very obvious she was never intended to be a companion, but they changed that at some point and never went back and fixed her recruitment.

What they should have done is, after you reduce her health to zero, a cut scene plays where she is weak enough that the Guardian is able to break the Absolute's hold on her. She realizes what has been happening and swears revenge on the Absolute and all those connected to it, then asks to join you in pursuit of this. At THAT point you should be given the option of taking her or killing her.

The way it is now is just terrible, honestly.

Sounds good to me. I like that one. A sort of enemy of my enemy situation.

Could even reverse this for evil where you have an event where you choose the absolute side or evil side and do that. Sounds really complicated to pull off though as the content would basically be two games past that point.

[yuzhonglu]

Publicado originalmente por GrugIsRock:

Publicado originalmente por Norbac:

Minor spoilers ahead.

Siding with minthara automatically removes wyll and karlach from your party.
Gale leaves as well unless persuaded.

Halsin is a druid and you can't recruit him after destroying their camp.
Then i'm 95% sure you can't recruit jaheira because she's literally your enemy.

You lose FIVE companions and you are left with lae'zel, shadowheart and astarion.

I understand the choices you make should have consequences, but they overdid it.
Been playing the last 10h with a party that I don't like because I have no choice, all for the sake of a character that hasn't even joined my party yet. What the ♥♥♥♥.

so you are left with all the good companions. Nobody like Halsin, wyll, and karlach.

Karlach is awesome.

[Jack Greedy]

Wow i never think about it, i mean about recruiting Minthara, what a cool concept.

[Grandpa's Scary Stories]

Publicado originalmente por Norbac:

Publicado originalmente por RhodosGuard:

What? WEIRD how the lawful good characters just leave your party if you lead a goblin army to slaughter a camp of innocent refugees and a circle of druids.

Maybe if you like the lawful good characters, dont play an evil character.

Here comes the 1st dude missing the point.

One playstyle is heavily gimped in a game where you are supposed to choose your own path.
I'm not saying your companions should kneel to your genocide episodes, i'm saying there should be more variety.

But you are choosing a path. The consequences of the path are losing 5 companions. I don't get the issue? The path involving minthara is either one where you are genuinely evil, or being a double agent etc. You'd have to assume you'd lose a good amount of trust in your party doing half the stuff you need to in order to win the evil cult's trust.

[Demiurge]

Publicado originalmente por deRuyter:

A better discussion would maybe be the lack of evil aligned party members compared to the neutral/good ones and how evil playtroughs will typically lock you out of 90% of a games content, meaning if you want to enjoy most of the content you really can't follow that path.

That's why you leave the evil path fir the second playthrough...

[Tr0w]

You couldn't have every sidekick in your party in BG 1 or 2 either, the characters all have their own morality alignments. In BG 1 or 2 you could even end up with party members trying to kill each other or you.

@Jack Greedy You could recruit a female Drow in either BG 1 or 2 as well.