thank god for mods to get us to level 20

[DOOM THE PRIME EVIL]

as there is no way the trash fire level cap being 12 is anything else then being lazy and boring

[CloudKira]

Originally posted by Lord Adorable:

Originally posted by CloudKira:

While its true that those games use either 2e or 3e rules aside from BG1 and IWD1 no Forgotten Realms game offered an adventure where you peaked at level 12.

And Pathfinder is based on D&D 3.5 where level 20 is max too. All video games available by Owlcat allow reaching such level if we play a completionist run.

At level 12 at most we won't fight any archmages or liches or ancient dragons in BG3. We might still fight mere orcs till like level 7. Or longer.

So no optional super bosses.

Even Solasta lets us reach 16 level now in 5e.

Well, we do see a Dracolich in one of the trailers, so there will certiantly be epic encounters in this game of some kind.

I personally hope for encounters like that witch in Divinity 2 who will kill your shining lights nigh-instantly if you aproach her unprepared

Unless those tadpole powers seriously makes us a power to reckon with then any Dracolich will stomp out party even at lvl 12.

Maybe excluding wyrmling Dracoliches...

[Lord_WC]

Originally posted by Tawm:

You're effectively removing fail states

This is dnd, if you aren't absolutely dumb you will do it at level 12 also. God and cheese builds exist for a reason, this game won't be an exeption either no matter what the level cap is.

[Tawm]

Originally posted by Maronchan:

Originally posted by Tawm:

Yes, that's "horrible." You're effectively removing fail states from the game by turning into a god. Where's the fun in that? It's basically the same as returning to a level 1 area at level 50 in a more typical RPG and just steamrolling everything, except it'll be like that, presumably, for most of the game's content. Modders have a lot of work ahead of them if they want to make a cohesive experience past the intended level cap.

That's my problem, not yours. Stop policing how people play their games.

You're projecting. I'm not telling you not to do it.

[Tawm]

Originally posted by Maronchan:

Originally posted by Tawm:

You're projecting. I'm not telling you not to do it.

Trying to convince people how horrible it is to go to lvl 20, is trying to police how they play the game.

I'm not trying to convince you. I'm being objective. You're seeking a drawn out argument.

[soul like that be capable of]

I suggest do some research about D&D 5e before opening your mouth about what level is too low. it seems too many of you playing games where level cap is 100 and think level 12 is starting point

[soul like that be capable of]

Originally posted by Maronchan:

Originally posted by Tawm:

You're projecting. I'm not telling you not to do it.

Trying to convince people how horrible it is to go to lvl 20, is trying to police how they play the game.

D&D 5e dont have any adv fit to a level 20 hero. it wasnt even written people dont do it since you are a god at this stage of power . what adv would you craft for a god ?

[Unn4m3d (♥AUT♥)]

Originally posted by XAru:

Originally posted by Maronchan:

Trying to convince people how horrible it is to go to lvl 20, is trying to police how they play the game.

D&D 5e dont have any adv fit to a level 20 hero. it wasnt even written people dont do it since you are a god at this stage of power . what adv would you craft for a god ?

It's a video game. Let people have fun the way they want to. It does not affect you if people use Mods.

[Lord_WC]

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

Originally posted by Lord_WC:

That's not the total truth.
Game likely has more than enough xp to get higher than 12 based on 5E ruleset (if it didn't they wouldn't talk about level cap but about how you will reach level 12). So the whole pacing of the game is just off compared to tabletop. You are spending way more time and way more content than you would in tabletop which is just poor game desing and doesn't sound good.

You have no idea how much XP is in this game.

So, you are saying that there won't be enough xp in the game to reach higher than 12? Let's check it after release, but I can basically guarantee you that you will have significantly higher amounts of xp than the cap. There always will be an xp disparity between your main quest focused, the average and a completionist walkthrough and the game has to bring even the first one very close to max level otherwise they wouldn't be able to finish the game.

[Lord_WC]

Originally posted by Tawm:

Originally posted by Maronchan:

Trying to convince people how horrible it is to go to lvl 20, is trying to police how they play the game.

I'm not trying to convince you. I'm being objective. You're seeking a drawn out argument.

You aren't objective, you are white knighting. Objective truth is that the ruleset they use goes up to level 20. This game doesn't. That's all to it really.

[Lord Adorable]

Originally posted by CloudKira:

Originally posted by Lord Adorable:

Well, we do see a Dracolich in one of the trailers, so there will certiantly be epic encounters in this game of some kind.

I personally hope for encounters like that witch in Divinity 2 who will kill your shining lights nigh-instantly if you aproach her unprepared

Unless those tadpole powers seriously makes us a power to reckon with then any Dracolich will stomp out party even at lvl 12.

Maybe excluding wyrmling Dracoliches...

I personally hope that Dracolich is one hell of a challenge even WITH our tadpole powers if that's the case. But that may be personal bias as they're one of my favorite Undead along with the likes of Skull Lords and Nightwalkers.

[Yojo0o]

Originally posted by XAru:

Originally posted by Maronchan:

Trying to convince people how horrible it is to go to lvl 20, is trying to police how they play the game.

D&D 5e dont have any adv fit to a level 20 hero. it wasnt even written people dont do it since you are a god at this stage of power . what adv would you craft for a god ?

Serious answer to a hypothetical question: I'd craft a heavily improvised campaign as a human DM. Tier 4 play involves leaping across planes, challenging gods, and shifting or breaking the paradigm of reality. There's not much point in raiding an enemy fortress if you can destroy it from 500ft away with an Earthquake and then nuke the survivors from orbit, or call up heavy rains for days to drown them, or turn into an adult dragon and slaughter them. A human DM (or a theoretical AI on the same level) can counter this capability with bespoke challenges and stakes, but a scripted video game cannot.

High-level play in TOB or IWD2 was just a flashier version of low-level play. All the truly world-breaking stuff wasn't possible to add to the game, so it just wasn't in the game. Characters stop evolving in scope they can handle, and just start getting bigger numbers. That's not interesting or engaging, that's just stretching out content to hit arbitrary thresholds.

[Tawm]

Originally posted by Lord_WC:

Originally posted by Tawm:

I'm not trying to convince you. I'm being objective. You're seeking a drawn out argument.

You aren't objective, you are white knighting. Objective truth is that the ruleset they use goes up to level 20. This game doesn't. That's all to it really.

I see you're projecting, too. You two appear to be having arguments with yourselves. Read my initial post. It'll take a lot of work to convert the game's progression to support a different level cap, which is doable. I'm saying simply letting you level far past the intended cap will effectively remove the game's fail state, which is objectively true. I then ask where then fun in that is. I have no agenda. You do.

[Yojo0o]

Originally posted by Lord_WC:

Originally posted by Yojo0o:

You have no idea how much XP is in this game.

So, you are saying that there won't be enough xp in the game to reach higher than 12? Let's check it after release, but I can basically guarantee you that you will have significantly higher amounts of xp than the cap. There always will be an xp disparity between your main quest focused, the average and a completionist walkthrough and the game has to bring even the first one very close to max level otherwise they wouldn't be able to finish the game.

We have no idea how Larian has balanced the XP scaling in this game. You're speculating, and giving the weight of fact to your own speculation.

Who's to say the critical path won't get you to level 11, with optional content pushing you to level 12? XP progression isn't linear.

[Dinvan]

Originally posted by Deviant:

Originally posted by Dinvan:

Like the encounters have any meaning any way.

yeah they do? if its challenging but with 20 lvl mod cap nothing will be challenging might aswell give yourself infinite hp and one hit kill cheat

NOTHING is challenging about BG3 apart from character creation. You would have to have 0 knowledge of D&D to find BG3 a challenge. 5e combat is about as easy as you can get.

I'm sorry, but this is not Pathfinder Wrath of the Righteous, go play that then tell me BG3 is a challenge.

[Lord Adorable]

Originally posted by Dinvan:

Originally posted by Deviant:

yeah they do? if its challenging but with 20 lvl mod cap nothing will be challenging might aswell give yourself infinite hp and one hit kill cheat

NOTHING is challenging about BG3 apart from character creation. You would have to have 0 knowledge of D&D to find BG3 a challenge. 5e combat is about as easy as you can get.

I'm sorry, but this is not Pathfinder Wrath of the Righteous, go play that then tell me BG3 is a challenge.

WoTR is a snoozefest. Just pick Greater Enduring Spell, buff up and wade in, unable to die.