Drow Lore not matching previous BG games

[Pelican-1]

I was playing BG2 to pass the time waiting for BG3 to release and I came across some dialogue with Viconia, the Drow. She states "The drow wish to rule, as do duergar, kuo-toa... even illithids, but our feet are clay. We distrust each other almost more than other races...."
Then it was proven right in front of me, when a Drow priestess murdered another Drow over a slave- she claimed he was easier to replace than a trained slave as the male drow was begging not to be killed. the priestess states that she has "other sons" and murders him outright.

Then I recall that my character in BG3 was of the Drow(female), and NOT of the lolth-kind.

While I was freeing the male Drow from the rubble in BG3 (where the duergar/forge is located) the drow was actually furious with the duergar for not being fast enough in freeing him from the rubble, and when he spoke to me I had drow options for dialogue. When chosen, he had 0 issues with me and wanted to help my situation.

This might be a small issue for most of you guys but from my understanding of BG lore, both male and female drow despise and often kill each other for little to no reason, specially the female drow having no remorse for the males, like a spider after mating, would kill the male drow with no hesitation.

According to BG1 and 2 lore, the part in BG3 when I freed the male drow from the rubble (Nere), me being a drow and a female at that, this "Nere" would have been 100% paranoid OR simply hostile towards my kind or possibly kill on sight. Instead the game has me pick his side or the side of the duergar. "After a conflictive conversation between Nere and Brithvar, you will have to choose a side between them.". There wouldn't be a side to choose according to BG2 and what happens in the underdark with Viconia in your party.

This was one of my main concerns with BG3, how much did they actually know of BG1 and 2 lore to keep the story concrete? Hopefully it can be addressed. Lore is everything.. without lore, your game/any game is aimless.

[IRMcG]

And somehow the OP misses that Nere and Minthara both worship the Absolute, not Lolth or any of the other Drow gods.

[Pelican-1]

Originally posted by IRMcG:

And somehow the OP misses that Nere and Minthara both worship the Absolute, not Lolth or any of the other Drow gods.

Except he abandon his faith with Lolth but had that upbringing regardless, and you can convince him to even abandon the absolute? lol

Like I said, it's not how a drow would interact with anther drow of my character being from Seldarine, it's also not how a true soul would act with a Seldarine drow, and in general the female drow is the top of the pecking order in most if not all the subraces and faiths of drow.. But when he's freed he proves how drow he really is lol, but we can't use him being a drow as evidence... tf is going on here..

How does a drow of the true soul absolute cult act with a Seldarine Drow? no difference? well what if I stated that when Nere enters your memories/mind, no doubt he would have saw that I helped the druids.. also their sworn enemies..

[ihatevnecks]

Originally posted by IRMcG:

And somehow the OP misses that Nere and Minthara both worship the Absolute, not Lolth or any of the other Drow gods.

Yeah the guy's genuinely hopeless. He's wrong, he's been wrong, he couldn't even get the sequence of events in the cutscene right, let alone anything he was told in dialog. Like someone else said, he's going to come up with every single excuse possible to avoid just admitting he's wrong.

But obviously he still knows more than everyone else. And then you see him type ♥♥♥♥ like this:

Originally posted by booger_911:

it's also not how a true soul would act with a Seldarine drow, and in general the female drow is the top of the pecking order in most if not all the subraces and faiths of drow..

That bolded part is so blatantly, horribly incorrect I don't even know where to start.

[Pelican-1]

Originally posted by ihatevnecks:

Originally posted by IRMcG:

And somehow the OP misses that Nere and Minthara both worship the Absolute, not Lolth or any of the other Drow gods.

Yeah the guy's genuinely hopeless. He's wrong, he's been wrong, he couldn't even get the sequence of events in the cutscene right, let alone anything he was told in dialog. Like someone else said, he's going to come up with every single excuse possible to avoid just admitting he's wrong.

But obviously he still knows more than everyone else. And then you see him type ♥♥♥♥ like this:

Originally posted by booger_911:

it's also not how a true soul would act with a Seldarine drow, and in general the female drow is the top of the pecking order in most if not all the subraces and faiths of drow..

That bolded part is so blatantly, horribly incorrect I don't even know where to start.

Answer this for me then since you just ♥♥♥♥♥♥ know ALL about drow apparently...

When Nere enters my mind, we share eachothers mind... How do you think a member of the cult of the absolute act when they know I helped the druids? their literal enemies?

Like I said, it's not how a drow would interact with anther drow of my character being from Seldarine, it's also not how a true soul would act with a Seldarine drow, and in general the female drow is the top of the pecking order in most if not all the subraces and faiths of drow.. But when he's freed he proves how drow he really is lol, but we can't use him being a drow as evidence... tf is going on here..

How does a drow of the true soul absolute cult act with a Seldarine Drow? no difference? well what if I stated that when Nere enters your memories/mind, no doubt he would have saw that I helped the druids.. also their sworn enemies..

[Pelican-1]

I'd hope you're familiar with Ed Greenwood and his book "The Drow of the Underdark" (1991)
I guess you're right and he's wrong when it comes to drow lol amazing.

[WitchWarrior1]

They didn't really break any of the lore though? The drow aren't so murdery that they kill eachother on sight, if they did they wouldn't have cities, have kids or etc. The priestess murdering her son still holds up because in the game it is still valid that female drow are above the males and they will kill their sons if they have others or sacrifice male babies if they have too many boys. Also, Nere isn't your average male drow, he is a member of the absolute. I think your taking Viconia as the true source when she 1. rejected Lolth and is Shar worshipper 2. is biased herself. I'd suggest going to the forgotten realms wiki to read up on the lore.

[ihatevnecks]

Originally posted by booger_911:

When Nere enters my mind, we share eachothers mind... How do you think a member of the cult of the absolute act when they know I helped the druids? their literal enemies?

He connected with you and recognized you as a 'fellow True Soul,' but even that's just an assumption on his part due to the presence of your tadpole. Your whole question here is based on a flawed premise of some kind of telepathic deep-dive, so there's nothing to answer.

How does a drow of the true soul absolute cult act with a Seldarine Drow? no difference? well what if I stated that when Nere enters your memories/mind, no doubt he would have saw that I helped the druids.. also their sworn enemies..

He was a True Soul interacting with another True Soul. That's what he knew, and that's what the context of the interaction was. One True Soul to another presumed True Soul.

You've made this giant assumption that his connection with you somehow gave him full access to your mind, which is never stated. If you play that scene out with a non-drow, he has the exact same reaction to you. He doesn't attack you, he doesn't look down on you, he sees you as a fellow True Soul - because that's what is important to him.

I'm done babysitting. You're wrong, plain and simple. Live with it :)

[Pelican-1]

Originally posted by ihatevnecks:

Originally posted by booger_911:

When Nere enters my mind, we share eachothers mind... How do you think a member of the cult of the absolute act when they know I helped the druids? their literal enemies?

He connected with you and recognized you as a 'fellow True Soul,' but even that's just an assumption on his part due to the presence of your tadpole. Your whole question here is based on a flawed premise of some kind of telepathic deep-dive, so there's nothing to answer.

How does a drow of the true soul absolute cult act with a Seldarine Drow? no difference? well what if I stated that when Nere enters your memories/mind, no doubt he would have saw that I helped the druids.. also their sworn enemies..

He was a True Soul interacting with another True Soul. That's what he knew, and that's what the context of the interaction was. One True Soul to another presumed True Soul.

You've made this giant assumption that his connection with you somehow gave him full access to your mind, which is never stated. If you play that scene out with a non-drow, he has the exact same reaction to you. He doesn't attack you, he doesn't look down on you, he sees you as a fellow True Soul - because that's what is important to him.

I'm done babysitting. You're wrong, plain and simple. Live with it :)

You're literally wrong about the drow and their characteristics according to the originator of drow lore lololol

I brought up that "Connection" part because that was my last attempt to get you to see that him being drow was everything. I know he didn't look into my mind per say on a deep level. He peered into my mind and saw that I was capable of helping him, TRUSTING ME WITH HIS LIFE ROFL... ffs it's like you're not listening to anything I've stated about drow and their faith and their characteristics. You seem to believe it doesn't have anything to do with how he acted towards my drow.. remember? you were there.. ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

I'm wrong about this "Pecking order" but it's in Ed Greenwood's book oddly enough.
I'm also somehow wrong that he wouldn't have trusted me being from Seldarine AND another drow, AND female, which the female part can also be looked into with his book.

so again this goes back to my original post about how Larian goofed. BG1 and 2 has the lore of FR, and so does Ed's book seeing how BG 1 and 2 were directly pulled from FR and Eds book has lore that's embedded in stone already, all of which doesn't add up with Nere and how he reacted to a female drow from his opposing faction, and the fact that he assumed I was a true soul then even doubts it himself later in that SAME DIALOGUE roflrofl... it only proves he should have acted MUCH differently to my drow.

That's the "Set in stone" I was talking about you schmuck. so again- Nere wouldn't have acted so trustworthy of my drow, point blank, period.

[Pelican-1]

So let me state this again. the drow lore from BG3 doesn't match BG1 or 2 in regards to Nere(YET), and so far, ONLY him.. everything else is spot on.

Based on the 1991 book, "The Drow of the Underdark" and BG1 and BG2, Nere would have been more paranoid with my drow, he would have either been at my throat, or paranoid and not trusted me, instead, he doesn't acknowledge my drow for what she is. Which is my entire point you missed.

There isn't enough lore about drow true souls yet so maybe there is wiggle room for that being the reasons why he acted the way he did, which is why I say "Yet".. there are no books in-game, or lore in-game about that cult and how they act towards drow of Selarine.. but we'll see. so far there aren't enough dots to connect. We can only assume that since Nere was once a child of Lolth, and I am the opposite, and Drow even kill their own kind who abandon their faith for Lolth, that Nere would be specially paranoid about me "Helping him" and him also entrusting his own life to me, a Seldarine Female Drow.. HUGE red flag for a Drow.. like, incredibly huge and red and flag shaped.

[Fizzban]

I remember shagging the Drow Matriarch or whoever she was. My party was disgusted, but I HAD TO coz I wanted to keep my party safe....


and I wanted to. Sorry Aerie.

[ihatevnecks]

Man I've never seen someone so joyously wrong as OP. It's wild.

[Pelican-1]

Originally posted by ihatevnecks:

Man I've never seen someone so joyously wrong as OP. It's wild.

You're simply wrong and I proved it with my last 2 comments. Nere would NOT have acted that way towards my female drow. that's according to the person who originated the drow race lmfao, so he's wrong? you're right?

[Pelican-1]

1991, Ed Greenwood's book titled "The Drow of the Underdark" drow characteristics are defined. Read it then come back to me and tell me I'm wrong.

[Steffan]

Originally posted by booger_911:

I was playing BG2 to pass the time waiting for BG3 to release and I came across some dialogue with Viconia, the Drow. She states "The drow wish to rule, as do duergar, kuo-toa... even illithids, but our feet are clay. We distrust each other almost more than other races...."
...

So it happens that I have also played BG2 (until the Throne of Bhaal, at least).

The episode you describe of the priestess killing a male is not indicative. You should not take everything a drow priestess says in her anger as truth. Her intention was clearly to humiliate the male before she killed him. Even in your quote of Viconia... she says 'almost more' which is just the opposite of drows trusting the other races.

Drows are racists and believe in the superiority of their race. The silver dragon gives an illusion of looking like a drow and not a mindflayer or a duergar. Such races would have been killed on sight or kept at a safe distance. As a drow at least you have a chance to survive in Ust Natha.

Nere is an interesting case. At first, he thinks you are a servant of the Absolute like him. That is what binds you. If you decide to join him and turn him against the Absolute, my guess is that he has other worries than attacking a person who has opened his eyes. Plus attacking alone a party of 4 is suicidal.

I've played a male drow in EA and the petrified drows had no qualms in backstabbing each other or him. Drow politics are very much backstabby as they have always been.

Basically in a classical Lolth-sworn society you have the pristesses-> female drows-> male drows (those with value, like sorcerers and etc.)-> other male drows -> slaves

Originally posted by Fizzban:

I remember shagging the Drow Matriarch or whoever she was. My party was disgusted, but I HAD TO coz I wanted to keep my party safe....

P.S. Actually unless the game weaves something else to explicitly contradict that, my head cannon is that my Dark Urge drow is a direct descendant of my BG1 & 2 elf and a random female drow in the brothels of Ust Natha. Yeah, and my elf also slept with Phaere (she was actually the daughter of the matriarch and a wannabe matriarch) only triplecross her and her mother for Viconia's delight (my elf was otherwise a decent guy). I guess he had a drow fetish as despite being freindzonesd by Vicky, he continously valued her company.

P.S.2 The Aerie romance died the moment my character killed the elf who assaulted Viconia in Amn. I think 1-2 guards were also killed in self-defence.

[Pelican-1]

Originally posted by steffan8:

Originally posted by booger_911:

I was playing BG2 to pass the time waiting for BG3 to release and I came across some dialogue with Viconia, the Drow. She states "The drow wish to rule, as do duergar, kuo-toa... even illithids, but our feet are clay. We distrust each other almost more than other races...."
...

So it happens that I have also played BG2 (until the Throne of Bhaal, at least).

The episode you describe of the priestess killing a male is not indicative. You should not take everything a drow priestess says in her anger as truth. Her intention was clearly to humiliate the male before she kills him.

Drows are racists and believe in the superiority of their race. The silver dragon gives an illusion of looking like a drow and not a mindflayer or a duergar. Such races would have been killed on sight. As drow at least you have a chance to survive in Ust Natha.

Nere is an interesting case. At first, he thinks you are a servant of the Absolute like him. That is what binds you. If you decide to join him and turn him against the Absolute, my guess is that he has other worries than attacking a person who has opened his eyes. Plus attacking alone a party of 4 is suicidal.

I've played a male drow in EA and the petrified drows had no qualms in backstabbing each other or him. Drow politics are very much backstabby as they have always been.

Basically in a classical Lolth-sworn society you have the pristesses-> female drows-> male drows (those with value, like sorcerers and etc.)-> other male drows -> slaves

Originally posted by Fizzban:

I remember shagging the Drow Matriarch or whoever she was. My party was disgusted, but I HAD TO coz I wanted to keep my party safe....

P.S. Actually unless the game weaves something else to explicitly contradict that, my head cannon is that my Dark Urge drow is a direct descendant of my BG1 & 2 elf and a random female drow in the brothels of Ust Natha. Yeah, and my elf also slept with Phaere only triplecross her and her mother for Viconia's delight (my elf was otherwise a decent guy). I guess he had a drow fetish as despite being freindzonesd by Vicky, he continously valued her company.

I was just playing BG2 and that happened upon entering the drow city just after Viconia stated such things would happen. So far it's true what she says about her people of the Lolth faith. which adds up when the priestess has a slave being punished by a male drow.

"Drow Priestess: Understand this, fool. You are easier to replace than a trained slave. (I guess that's the humility but....)"

"Drow: But-mistress, please! No..."

"Drow priestess: I have other sons."

"Drow: Death"

"Drow priestess: Idiot! Where shall I find a slave now?"

I don't think it was a lesson in humility rather a testament of the drow kind. and according to Ed Greenwood, that's a perfect fit to his lore of drow and their characteristics seeing how the male died and didn't learn due to being dead and not capable of lessons :P

Aside from that I agree with you.

PS If it was truly about humiliating the male drow before killing him, then that kinda proves that the drow kind IS that evil (the ones of Lolth faith) and only makes Viconia's statement ring even more true.