Max level question

[Baklavah]

So, we know it'll be between 10 and 20, but we won't be able to go to 20. I know it's because level 20 spells, mechanics and feats are mega busted and can basically turn your characters into demigods. But that's half the fun. The journey to "semi-godhood". Sure it won't be in. But will the modding community make it happen?

[SpaceNvader]

Check out expansion on nexus. Much has already been modded in.

[Baklavah]

Originally posted by manwitch:

Check out expansion on nexus. Much has already been modded in.

Waiting for release before I do any delving tbh. I'm going to buy the game at the beginning of August, just in time to get access to my deluxeness version.

[Power]

Originally posted by Baklavah:

So, we know it'll be between 10 and 20, but we won't be able to go to 20. I know it's because level 20 spells, mechanics and feats are mega busted and can basically turn your characters into demigods. But that's half the fun. The journey to "semi-godhood". Sure it won't be in. But will the modding community make it happen?

They shouldn't shy away from god/demigod-hood. "Pathfinder: Wrath of the righteous" Let's you become godlike. A dragon, a walking swarm, an angel, or a demon. You can still have challenge and fun while being uber strong lol.

[EricHVela]

I'm going to guess it's WotC's preference not to take it all the way to 20 in one campaign. I suspect that getting to the cap is also meant to be arduous.

Most TT D&D games I've seen skip XP and go for "milestone" leveling instead.

I was a little surprised that Larian didn't use that method since it helps pace the players and also gives an easy difficulty modifier. It's also easier on Human DMs, making it the more common thing players could encounter at physical tables.

Then again, BG3 is part video-game that cannot be ignored. XP is far more common when an advanced calculator is running the show.

[Power]

Originally posted by EricHVela:

I'm going to guess it's WotC's preference not to take it all the way to 20 in one campaign. I suspect that getting to the cap is also meant to be arduous.

Most TT D&D games I've seen skip XP and go for "milestone" leveling instead.

I was a little surprised that Larian didn't use that method since it helps pace the players and also gives an easy difficulty modifier. It's also easier on Human DMs, making it the more common thing players could encounter at physical tables.

Then again, BG3 is part video-game that cannot be ignored. XP is far more common when an advanced calculator is running the show.

People would have been angry if it was milestone based. But also Larian is pretty good at structuring their XP and Game worlds. Even back in DOS1 they had a good handle on level gaining.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Yes.

[Heu, Iterum Id Feci]

Maxlevel in D&D5e usually (and especially in official material, which this should probably be seen as) depends on the scope of the story according to the tiers of play:

https://arcaneeye.com/dm-tools-5e/what-are-the-tiers-of-play-in-dd/

Seeing as this game was originally announced as lvl10 max, tells us about the story and it's bbeg. They might expand it a bit, but at some point, especially when going from tier 2 to tier 4, things would have to have a drastic story rewrite, as the tier4 bbeg, usually threatens the whole realm and wouldn't bother with just 1 "little" city.
You have to keep in mind, that WOTC probably mostly wants to address D&D tabletop players with this, and with that there are certain expectations like this.

[Baklavah]

Originally posted by Dαятн Wαfflεmαncεя:

Maxlevel in D&D5e usually (and especially in official material, which this should probably be seen as) depends on the scope of the story according to the tiers of play:

https://arcaneeye.com/dm-tools-5e/what-are-the-tiers-of-play-in-dd/

Seeing as this game was originally announced as lvl10 max, tells us about the story and it's bbeg. They might expand it a bit, but at some point, especially when going from tier 2 to tier 4, things would have to have a drastic story rewrite, as the tier4 bbeg, usually threatens the whole realm and wouldn't bother with just 1 "little" city.
You have to keep in mind, that WOTC probably mostly wants to address D&D tabletop players with this, and with that there are certain expectations like this.

No reason the BBEG can't scale up and become scarier depending on the current max level of the party. If they're all 20, nothing says they can't introduce "Epic Levels" for the BBEG to be a proper challenge. D&D is LITERALLY about imagination and shattering limitations.

[dolby]

btw some of 5e level 20 stuff is crap ... especially in video game that lets you rest at will.

[Heu, Iterum Id Feci]

Originally posted by Baklavah:

Originally posted by Dαятн Wαfflεmαncεя:

Maxlevel in D&D5e usually (and especially in official material, which this should probably be seen as) depends on the scope of the story according to the tiers of play:

https://arcaneeye.com/dm-tools-5e/what-are-the-tiers-of-play-in-dd/

Seeing as this game was originally announced as lvl10 max, tells us about the story and it's bbeg. They might expand it a bit, but at some point, especially when going from tier 2 to tier 4, things would have to have a drastic story rewrite, as the tier4 bbeg, usually threatens the whole realm and wouldn't bother with just 1 "little" city.
You have to keep in mind, that WOTC probably mostly wants to address D&D tabletop players with this, and with that there are certain expectations like this.

No reason the BBEG can't scale up and become scarier depending on the current max level of the party. If they're all 20, nothing says they can't introduce "Epic Levels" for the BBEG to be a proper challenge. D&D is LITERALLY about imagination and shattering limitations.

I said nothing about it being a challenge for the players or not. A BBEG for a level 20 campaign has a completely different story goal then the BBEG for a level 10 campaign.
If he's powerful enough to be a challenge for a level 20 party he's way to powerful to be bothered by just 1 little city. it's like Darth Vader waging war with his death star against a single city and making a whole movie about that. Why does Darth Vader bother with that? Doesn't he have better things to do?

[Heu, Iterum Id Feci]

Originally posted by dolby:

btw some of 5e level 20 stuff is crap ... especially in video game that lets you rest at will.

It's a quite common opinion that the levelrange from 5-12 is the most engaging and fun range in D&D5e. After level 12 you start to need more and more specialized campaigns, and the focus is usually more on building alliances etc rather then on individual fights. It's not that uncommon from my observations that fights and dungeon delving gets rarer and rarer in the 14+ range, though I'm only a single guy and I don't have any real numbers on that.
However according to WOTC statistics I've seen 13+ campaigns are rather rare...
One of the reasons why there's only very little official material for tier 3 and 4 play.

[Baklavah]

Originally posted by Dαятн Wαfflεmαncεя:

Originally posted by Baklavah:

No reason the BBEG can't scale up and become scarier depending on the current max level of the party. If they're all 20, nothing says they can't introduce "Epic Levels" for the BBEG to be a proper challenge. D&D is LITERALLY about imagination and shattering limitations.

I said nothing about it being a challenge for the players or not. A BBEG for a level 20 campaign has a completely different story goal then the BBEG for a level 10 campaign.
If he's powerful enough to be a challenge for a level 20 party he's way to powerful to be bothered by just 1 little city. it's like Darth Vader waging war with his death star against a single city and making a whole movie about that. Why does Darth Vader bother with that? Doesn't he have better things to do?

Because the BBEG... gets... off... on... it?