A question for those more familiar with 5e

[Aniaran]

So I've been playing some version of tabletop since a fair bit before 3.5 and kind of skipped out on DnD since 4e onward. Pathfinder 1e and, to a lesser extent 2e, filled the gap for me rather nicely but I felt like giving BG3 a go since it's one of my favorite series and Larian at least make decent games. All the same I've got a couple questions for anyone with a bit of experience.

Is the character advancement supposed to feel this limiting? I'm honestly not certain if this is a 5e system limitation or Larian's interpretation in making it work for a CRPG, but it's a pretty stark contrast to what I'm used to. If it's Larian's rendition has there been any word on if there's going to be more variety for choices on leveling, or character creation?

Just strikes me as a bit surprising going from a system like Pathfinder where there's a ton of choices in what you can do for leveling progression to a much more limited system. Curious if that's the intended style of play or a side effect of the system translation.

[Ghost]

There are some limitations with conversion from tabletop, but 5E is nothing like 3.5/pathfinder.

[His Dudeness]

I heard 1-15 lvl for normal campaings and heroes, 15-20 for more like god-like characters and events.

[brendan_in_china]

BG3 hasn't yet implemented multi-classing, which is an option at every level.

The origin companions come with some important decisions already made, so not many choices there.

Your main character has the most choices. At level 1 you choose race, class, ability scores, spells, skills. By level 3 you will have chosen your class' archetype and at level 4 you have the first big choice of ability score or feat.

Low level characters don't have much variation, but it's additive and by mid levels characters start to differentiate. By high levels (11+) characters are pretty much unique.

[Heu, Iterum Id Feci]

Originally posted by Aniaran:

Just strikes me as a bit surprising going from a system like Pathfinder where there's a ton of choices in what you can do for leveling progression to a much more limited system.

The Problem with systems like Pathfinder is, while they offer a lot of choices, they always have some that are objectively better then others, ending with everyone making the same decision. You have to take feat x etc. And especially Pathfinder, so I've been told, has a lot of "traps". I.e. Choices that might sound good on paper, but really hinder your character.
D&D5e took out a lot of that.
Also in regards to Baldurs gate 3. Not every class/subclass has been implemented. Additional, the only confirmation that we have is the PHB stuff. A lot of the subclasses in D&D5e are however in the additional books, like Tashas Cauldron or Xanathars Guide. On the tabletop you almost always have someone with access to these, so unless we get these additional subclasses the game will be more limited then most people will experience on the tabletop.

[Wyrtt]

5ed is THAT primitive. Its a tabletop rpg for modern gamers after all. Its designed to be a social exp with light rules to guide you. As CRPG 5e is terrible beyond any reason. Some JRPG offer more control than 5e.

[larhtas]

4th edition was THE BEST OF ALL!
(I'm putting myself out and i present to all of you apologies for the disturbance)

[dolby]

all you can do is multiclass... The rest is meh.. may fav level up so far is rogue lvl 2 ROFL, not...but sadlly you got to suffer through it to get to level 3 subclass and level 4 feat...

[brendan_in_china]

Hold a sec, you guys all know that levels 1-2 are designed to zip by real fast and level 3 is the first sustained level right?

I mean, many TT games start level 3.

BG3 implements this well. You don't play at all long at levels 1-2.

[Lord Adorable]

Originally posted by brendan_in_china:

Hold a sec, you guys all know that levels 1-2 are designed to zip by real fast and level 3 is the first sustained level right?

I mean, many TT games start level 3.

BG3 implements this well. You don't play at all long at levels 1-2.

And if you kill Zhalk and his Cambions and THEN the Mindflayer(Assuming he survives to turn hostile), you won't have to play level 2 at all.

[A Sociopath]

Originally posted by brendan_in_china:

Hold a sec, you guys all know that levels 1-2 are designed to zip by real fast and level 3 is the first sustained level right?

I mean, many TT games start level 3.

BG3 implements this well. You don't play at all long at levels 1-2.

So BG3 implements it terribly? Since you don't start at level 3 at all.
The target audience is also people who've never played a single campaign of DnD in their life, or have a clue about the rules for that matter, so yeah. Bad.

[Yojo0o]

Originally posted by Aniaran:

So I've been playing some version of tabletop since a fair bit before 3.5 and kind of skipped out on DnD since 4e onward. Pathfinder 1e and, to a lesser extent 2e, filled the gap for me rather nicely but I felt like giving BG3 a go since it's one of my favorite series and Larian at least make decent games. All the same I've got a couple questions for anyone with a bit of experience.

Is the character advancement supposed to feel this limiting? I'm honestly not certain if this is a 5e system limitation or Larian's interpretation in making it work for a CRPG, but it's a pretty stark contrast to what I'm used to. If it's Larian's rendition has there been any word on if there's going to be more variety for choices on leveling, or character creation?

Just strikes me as a bit surprising going from a system like Pathfinder where there's a ton of choices in what you can do for leveling progression to a much more limited system. Curious if that's the intended style of play or a side effect of the system translation.

So, the modern perspective on 3.5e is that the depth of character creation resulted in bloat. Your mileage may vary, of course. But 5e, while superficially keeping a lot of the facets of 3.5e, implements a design concept called "Bounded Accuracy", which is an overall reduction in number growth in order to prevent hyper-focused builds or power creep within a campaign, in theory at least. You won't be rolling at +40 to beat an AC of 50 in this system, you'll be rolling at +5-ish at level 1 and like +13-ish by max level to beat ACs that won't get higher than mid twenties. Other rolls within the system will follow this design philosophy.

As far as choices go, there's still a lot of build expression, certainly much more than there was in BG1-2, but not necessarily as much as in 3.5e. Rather than allocating your skill points each level, you'll define which skills you're "proficient" with as part of your build, and they will continually scale with your overall "proficiency score", a value that scales from +2 at level 1 to +6 at level 17. Rather than allocating a ton of feats at level 1 and continually throughout for incremental bonuses, you'll have fewer chances to get feats, but they tend to be a good bit more impactful: 5e's Great Weapon Master is comparable to 3.5e's Power Attack AND Cleave at the same time.

Multiclassing works similarly in 5e. It's a bit less powerful than it was in 3.5e, since there's been more of a design focus on making sure each class gets a feature with each level-up. No XP penalty for odd builds, though. This isn't in BG3 yet, but will be in 1.0.

Subclasses are a notable new addition in 5e compared to 3.5e, allowing for many more design paths within a single class. They kick in between level 1 and 3.

[larhtas]

Originally posted by brendan_in_china:

Hold a sec, you guys all know that levels 1-2 are designed to zip by real fast and level 3 is the first sustained level right?

I mean, many TT games start level 3.

BG3 implements this well. You don't play at all long at levels 1-2.

I agree BG3 is implementing it well. I have the same experience as you have.

[Popsicles]

Originally posted by Wyrtt:

5ed is THAT primitive. Its a tabletop rpg for modern gamers after all. Its designed to be a social exp with light rules to guide you. As CRPG 5e is terrible beyond any reason. Some JRPG offer more control than 5e.

5e is the most successful and most played version of D&D ever. The player base is more broad than it ever has been before. What is your proof to back up 'Its a tabletop rpg for modern gamers?'That is totally false. I play with tons of people that are 50 years old plus.

It's a social experiment? Please explain?

D&D 5e is collaborative story telling at its heart. Whilst there are a few grognard lites on this board that have their nostalgia glasses on in regards to the number crunching of 3.5.

[Popsicles]

Originally posted by Lord Adorable:

Originally posted by brendan_in_china:

Hold a sec, you guys all know that levels 1-2 are designed to zip by real fast and level 3 is the first sustained level right?

I mean, many TT games start level 3.

BG3 implements this well. You don't play at all long at levels 1-2.

And if you kill Zhalk and his Cambions and THEN the Mindflayer(Assuming he survives to turn hostile), you won't have to play level 2 at all.

They need to get rid of that exploit. This game is easy enough to not need a two level bump at the beginning of the game.

[Wyrtt]

Originally posted by Balltin:

Originally posted by Wyrtt:

5ed is THAT primitive. Its a tabletop rpg for modern gamers after all. Its designed to be a social exp with light rules to guide you. As CRPG 5e is terrible beyond any reason. Some JRPG offer more control than 5e.

5e is the most successful and most played version of D&D ever. The player base is more broad than it ever has been before. What is your proof to back up 'Its a tabletop rpg for modern gamers?'That is totally false. I play with tons of people that are 50 years old plus.

It's a social experiment? Please explain?

D&D 5e is collaborative story telling at its heart. Whilst there are a few grognard lites on this board that have their nostalgia glasses on in regards to the number crunching of 3.5.

Party game sell better than complex boardgames. 5ed can just get rid of all rules and still be sucessful. DM can create any kind of adventure with most basic systems. Doesnt make a good PC game though