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I think he means that both Ancients and Devotion play more into the "heroically honorable" paladin trope. Where Vengeance and Conquest are the "darker" paladins that can even be outright villains.
Though I mean...Oathbreaker is in the game for that too. Evil paladin right there if OP wants.
On the other hand, Oathbreaker plays fine, Vengeance should be coming at release.
The thing is that compared to BG1 and 2, if you played a paladin you had to be lawful good and a human. Doing any act such as killing an NPC out of nowhere could get you the status oathbreaker making you lose all your class benefits. In short there was really no reason to do that.
In BG3 the aspect of the oathbreaker is something that is done but has to occur more, thematically. You just do something evil and there, done.
If you dont like it you can spend money at the oathbreaker knight to restore your default oath.
Its a game, for gameplay purposes. No need to overthink it. Rather I like this for many many reasons, you know why?
If there just happens to be a really infuriating character who gives you quest trouble or you just want to GTA rampage a settlement...well theres the option.
I played lawful good characters in many RPGs like Fallout 3. Then I would go into a place like tenpenny tower and wipe out every NPC there. Then go back to megaton and just donate crap tons of caps to get back into good karma. I did it in that game, I may just do it again if I need to.
Its a game, a work of fiction. Dont overthink it. If you want to take the RP seriously then stick to your oath as you envision it.
You can have evil oath of devotion and ancients just as you can have good oath of vegence and conquests. Its harder to fit it, but hell you make it work for your own needs.
The only real thing alignment may have overall is if dependent on specific and I mean some pretty specific items are involved such as book of exalted deeds vs book of vile darkness. Holy avenger being for good while another soul taking dark sword is there for all the evil players.
I wouldn't call that "alignment-locking", given that there's no alignment in the game. There's some rules of engagement to follow, but between Devotion, Ancients, Vengeance, Oathbreaker, I think that covers most values and practices that could be desired. And any other paladin subclass that pops up post-launch via DLC or mods will further broaden the scope. We'll hardly be limited to LG like in BG1-2.
Agreed wholeheartedly with all of that. Plus the game already has a thriving mod scene. I don't know if there's mods that add in more Paladin classes, but I saw every Sorcerer subclass has already been added to the game. Can see paladins maybe being trickier to add with determining what dialogue/decisions make you break your Oath but I still expect them. I'm quite looking forward to Conquest myself.
Conquest is such a cool subclass, I'd love to play it as well.
One of my favorite tabletop characters is a glaive-wielding conquest paladin who makes use of Wrathful Smite and fear aura to control the flow of melee, most fun I've ever had as a tank.
This is when only humans could be paladins but also couldnt dual class in any capacity.
Half elves had the most options out of dual classes.
Other races had specific combos or limits in those classes they could rise.
This was something the Eye of the beholder trilogy did and they also kept in many of the rules quite close.
When the enchanced edition of BG 1 and 2 were released, they did make a few changes. Blackguard was more or less the evil option for a paladin. Other races had a "unique" class in the archtypes like Dwarves had the dwarven defender, a very strong endurance option that was pretty solid in most playthroughs.
But 5e was much more freeform, so if you are a paladin what makes or breaks you in situations is your oath of choice. Oath of devotion is pretty balanced overall and can work in many ways, you have sacred weapon for more accuracy and fairly useful oath spells on command. Vengence you are a solid boss killer with mobility options, ancients you are hard to kill etc.
You are not alignment locked but your actions still matter in the long run of the game. If you act like a jerk well..some places will try to make an example out of you. If you help settlements like the druids and tieflings find common ground, party for everyone?
Tenets of Devotion
- Honesty: Don’t lie or cheat. Let your word be your Promise.
- Courage: Never fear to act, though caution is wise.
- Compassion: Aid Others, protect the weak, and punish those who threaten them. Show mercy to your foes, but temper it with Wisdom.
- Honour: Treat Others with fairness, and let your honourable deeds be an example to them. Do as much good as possible while causing the least amount of harm.
- Duty: Be responsible for your ACTIONS and their consequences, protect those entrusted to your care, and obey those who have just Authority over you.
Tenets of the Ancients
- Kindle the Light: Through your acts of mercy, kindness, and forgiveness, kindle the light of hope in the world, beating back despair.
- Shelter the Light: Where there is good, beauty, love, and laughter in the world, stand against the wickedness that would swallow it. Where life flourishes, stand against the forces that would render it barren.
- Preserve Your Own Light: Delight in song and laughter, in beauty and art. If you allow the light to die in your own heart, you can't preserve it in the world.
- Be the Light: Be a glorious beacon for all who live in despair. Let the light of your joy and courage shine forth in all your deeds.
Tenets of Vengeance
- Fight the Greater Evil: Faced with a choice of fighting my sworn foes or combating a lesser evil, I choose the greater evil.
- No Mercy for the Wicked: Ordinary foes might win my mercy, but my sworn enemies do not.
- By Any Means Necessary: My qualms can't get in the way of exterminating my foes.
- Restitution: If my foes wreak ruin on the world, it is because I failed to stop them. I must help those harmed by their misdeeds.