Does Flamesword or Shillelagh take any hit modifier from STR/DEX?

[Aksolotli]

So Flamesword and Shillelagh get their hit modifiers from +Wisdom, but does it add from STR/DEX? Like if i summon my Flamesword then drink Elixir of Hill Giant would it mean i could get +Wisdom and +Strength to the hit modifier?

[Aksolotli]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Flameblade should use your Wis modifier (the wiser you are, the hotter the flames burn).

Shillellellelighlegh should use either Str or Wis, whichever is higher (at the end of the day, it's still a staff, a Str based weapon, and while magically enhanced, you still hit with your Str).

True. But Flameblade could still be +Wisdom more Damage and +Str or +Dex more hit.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by Haven923:

Originally posted by dolby:

nah Shillelagh should always use wisdom if you ask me cos the die changes so you have to use casters modifier. at least that's how i would see it.

I mean... nah? You'll automatically use your highest valid armor calculation or attack modifier.

Also, does flameblade use wis in BG3? It should use your normal attack modifier. It is treated as a scimitar so it can use either your strength or your dex mod.

The problem I have with that is that the flames of Flameblade are made of energy created by a spell, they are not solid physical matter. Therefore it should use Wis modifier only.

[dolby]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Flameblade should use your Wis modifier (the wiser you are, the hotter the flames burn).

Shillellellelighlegh should use either Str or Wis, whichever is higher (at the end of the day, it's still a staff, a Str based weapon, and while magically enhanced, you still hit with your Str).

well it changes your weapon magicly so it's directly linked to you wisdom power. I say sure use your str but you need to use your old dice hehe and yes i know that's now how you dnd peopel would rule it out but it just makes sense to me that way...

[Hobocop]

Originally posted by Haven923:

Originally posted by dolby:

nah Shillelagh should always use wisdom if you ask me cos the die changes so you have to use casters modifier. at least that's how i would see it.

I mean... nah? You'll automatically use your highest valid armor calculation or attack modifier.

Also, does flameblade use wis in BG3? It should use your normal attack modifier. It is treated as a scimitar so it can use either your strength or your dex mod.

Flame Blade isn't actually a scimitar, but a facsimile that resembles one that you can use your action to do a specific thing with. The spell doesn't say that it has any weapon properties unlike say, Shadow Blade does.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by Aksolotli:

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Flameblade should use your Wis modifier (the wiser you are, the hotter the flames burn).

Shillellellelighlegh should use either Str or Wis, whichever is higher (at the end of the day, it's still a staff, a Str based weapon, and while magically enhanced, you still hit with your Str).

True. But Flameblade could still be +Wisdom more Damage and +Str or +Dex more hit.

Oh, you mean using Str or Dex for the attack roll, and Wis for dmg?

If a player asked me to do it that way, I'd probably let them, there is a certain logic to it.

How is Larian doing it?

[Haven]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Flameblade should use your Wis modifier (the wiser you are, the hotter the flames burn).

Shillellellelighlegh should use either Str or Wis, whichever is higher (at the end of the day, it's still a staff, a Str based weapon, and while magically enhanced, you still hit with your Str).

The damage is determined by the spell slot used (more magic more hotter). The attack modifier is based on scimitar, so STR or DEX.

[dolby]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Originally posted by Aksolotli:

True. But Flameblade could still be +Wisdom more Damage and +Str or +Dex more hit.

Oh, you mean using Str or Dex for the attack roll, and Wis for dmg?

If a player asked me to do it that way, I'd probably let them, there is a certain logic to it.

How is Larian doing it?

just checked it's casters wisdom only so i win :)

[Haven]

Originally posted by dolby:

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Oh, you mean using Str or Dex for the attack roll, and Wis for dmg?

If a player asked me to do it that way, I'd probably let them, there is a certain logic to it.

How is Larian doing it?

just checked it's casters wisdom only so i win :)

so in BG3 it is using wisdom modifier? That's... interesting... Favoring the player sure, but technically incorrect. Also not sure what you're winning.

[dolby]

Originally posted by Haven923:

Originally posted by dolby:

just checked it's casters wisdom only so i win :)

Also not sure what you're winning.

satisfaction in knowing that my logic is same as the leadings crpg dev right now :)

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by dolby:

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Oh, you mean using Str or Dex for the attack roll, and Wis for dmg?

If a player asked me to do it that way, I'd probably let them, there is a certain logic to it.

How is Larian doing it?

just checked it's casters wisdom only so i win :)

Saying that the character would wield it like a non-magical weapon, but just deal magical damage, has a logic to it that would reward characters who had proficiency with either of those weapons pkus high Str or Dex.

Using the Wis modifier (for attack rolls) I think was intended to help Druids who were assumed to put all their points into Wis. It was intended to ve a boon in case they had lower Str/Dex scores.

I get the reasoning, but given the near infinite ways we can build characters, I see no reason to disallow a Druid the option to use a physical stat instead for the attack roll. For Flameblade I'd only allow Dex (since Str would add nothing to an energy attack), and staves aren't finesse weapons, so I'd let them use either Str or Wis.

It's a minor change, and if it makes creative players happy, I'm all for it.

[dolby]

Originally posted by Pan Darius Kairos:

Originally posted by dolby:

just checked it's casters wisdom only so i win :)

Saying that the character would wield it like a non-magical weapon, but just deal magical damage, has a logic to it that would reward characters who had proficiency with either of those weapons pkus high Str or Dex.

Using the Wis modifier (for attack rolls) I think was intended to help Druids who were assumed to put all their points into Wis. It was intended to ve a boon in case they had lower Str/Dex scores.

I get the reasoning, but given the near infinite ways we can build characters, I see no reason to disallow a Druid the option to use a physical stat instead for the attack roll. For Flameblade I'd only allow Dex (since Str would add nothing to an energy attack), and staves aren't finesse weapons, so I'd let them use either Str or Wis.

It's a minor change, and if it makes creative players happy, I'm all for it.

yeah i mean i dont really care in the end i guess. but i like magice and as a concept magice is fulled by your caster stats so it makes sense that way to me.

but ok i could go half way and say you can add str to damage but not to attack
even if you go full either or i guess it's no big deal in the end it just gives more options. Edit: that potion needs a nerf anyway :)

[sevensided]

Originally posted by Haven923:

Originally posted by dolby:

just checked it's casters wisdom only so i win :)

so in BG3 it is using wisdom modifier? That's... interesting... Favoring the player sure, but technically incorrect.

Uhm, its actually technically correct. Flame Blade in 5e is a melee spell attack, and its damage is based on the spell. So if you were a wisdom caster, all it would use is Wisdom. So if thats what BG3 is doing, then that is spot on to the spell in 5e (save for the fact Shill and Flame Blade should use spellcasting ability, not simply wisdom)

Not sure where you get the idea flame blade should use any physical attributes from. Maybe you are confusing it with Shadow blade?

[dolby]

i would give flame blade wisdom damage modifer though or remove concentration and give it extra charge so you can only make one...

Got to get something for that spell slot as is right now, you get nothing but the fact that you can use caster stat for attack... and that just not enough compared Shillelagh where you get both and due to dips it does more damage way way more if you use strong poison not to mention extra weapon effects, special attacks and damage from weapons themselfs.

[IgnatiusJ.Reilly]

Originally posted by Aksolotli:

Originally posted by IgnatiusJ.Reilly:

Shillelagh should use either wisdom or strength, whichever is higher, but I haven't quaffed a strength potion and tested it.

Wouldn't it be OP if it had both....

It doesn't add both, it simply uses the better of the two. Also, I'm only going by the spell description in the Player's Handbook, I'm not sure about in game.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Originally posted by dolby:

i would give flame blade wisdom damage modifer though or remove concentration and give it extra charge so you can only make one...

Got to get something for that spell slot as is right now, you get nothing but the fact that you can use caster stat for attack... and that just not enough compared Shillelagh where you get both and due to dips it does more damage.

I really like Flameblade for certain builds, but I wish it didn't have concentration.

On the other hand, in BG3 it lasts until long rest, so it's an efficient use of a spell slot, and as a Divine caster it's always available so you can sideline it until you need it at no cost.