A Standard Action to Equip a Weapon... Big Mistake

[ctreid1987]

Does anyone else think this is a mistake?

I noticed that Patch 7 requires a Standard Action to equip a weapon. However, in the 5th Edition Player's Handbook this type of action is actually used as an example of an action that can be done "in tandem" with the Standard Action and the Move Action.

Page 190 of the Player's Handbook (Third Paragraph Down)

"You can also interact with one object or feature of the environment for free, during either your move or your action. For example, you could open a door during your move as you stride toward a foe, or you could draw your weapon as part of the same action you use to attack."

There are two more paragraphs that follow and a side bar at the bottom of the column as well. (Equipping a shield requires a standard action, but equipping a weapon can be done for free once per turn according to the rules.)

[Holy Muff Diver]

in my game i count interacting with objects or switching weapons towards their bonus actions.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

Holy Muff Diver a écrit :

in my game i count interacting with objects or switching weapons towards their bonus actions.

Making it a bonus action instead of a full action would also be a better idea.

[Gaius]

The optimal gameplay would be boring AS HELL if changing weapons was a free action.

I prefer a simpler and most elegant solution: Allow the second weapon to be either melee or ranged and each player decide if hey want to swap for the best melee solution and lose ranged combat capacities or keep it the way it is now.

[branmakmuffin]

Tinball a écrit :

ctreid1987 a écrit :

I knew someone would bring up dual wielding, that is different than what I had in mind. I'm talking about having multiple weapons ready for the main hand. The off-hand weapon takes some form of penalty or penalties, I believe, and deprives you of using a shield. I understand if they won't let you have 100 weapons ready to draw, that's obviously not possible IRL, but all I'm asking for is different weapon sets to be readily available for a free action draw.

Yes, they should allow you to do that. Like pick the mace over the long sword. You should be able to draw as a free action what weapon you want as you posted from the rule book.

The line "you could draw your weapon as part of the same action you use to attack" pretty much makes explicit that drawing your weapon is part of your attack action. But if you wanted to switch weapons and attack with the new one, seems to me you'd have to drop your current weapon, not stow it, because "If you want to interact with a second object [which IMO is what you would have to do in order to stow the current weapon and draw the new one], you need to use your action." Unless of course the character is using its off-hand to draw the new weapon, then ii could draw the new weapon and attack with either (or both if it still has its bonus action available).

Bottom line is I don't see any way, following 5e RAW, for a character to stow its current weapon, draw a new weapon and attack with the new weapon all in the same turn.

[Gaius]

branmakmuffin a écrit :

Tinball a écrit :

Yes, they should allow you to do that. Like pick the mace over the long sword. You should be able to draw as a free action what weapon you want as you posted from the rule book.

The line "you could draw your weapon as part of the same action you use to attack" pretty much makes explicit that drawing your weapon is part of your attack action. But if you wanted to switch weapons and attack with the new one, seems to me you'd have to drop your current weapon, not stow it, because "If you want to interact with a second object [which IMO is what you would have to do in order to stow the current weapon and draw the new one], you need to use your action." Unless of course the character is using its off-hand to draw the new weapon, then ii could draw the new weapon and attack with either (or both if it still has its bonus action available).

Bottom line is I don't see any way, following 5e RAW, for a character to stow its current weapon, draw a new weapon and attack with the new weapon all in the same turn.

Mind you, as a free action you could ALSO swap back after the attack for, say, more damaging attacks of opportunity.

[Pan Darius Cassandra]

A lot of what people are asking for/talking about assumes that all these weapons they want to draw for free are on the belt (or back, as it may be).

Try to keep in mind that what you are carrying is in your backpack (and yes, I know it's a bit ridiculous that we can fit so much crap in our backpacks) and not in a scabbard on your belt or on your back.

The whole idea behind "drawing a weapon for free" just means drawing the weapon you have sheathed at your side, not the ability to rummage through your entire inventory for anything you want and then also put the other weapon you were carrying away too.

When you equip a weapon in BG3 you are designating that as your held weapon when you go into combat. Yes, you have to choose beforehand. But when you "draw your weapon as part of your attack" they are referring to your EQUIPPED weapon, i.e. the one in your scabbard, that you draw and then attack with, not anything and everything in your inventory.

It's perfectly fine to require an action to re-equip to another weapon - although, for convenience sake, I probably would make this a bonus action, as it would be a lot more fun.

[KingOfFriedChicken]

Holy Muff Diver a écrit :

in my game i count interacting with objects or switching weapons towards their bonus actions.

I have always preferred the object interaction, This allows you to do one action per turn involving any object IE barrels, weapons, you could use this spare action to allow one swap of melee without letting people swap over and over. This would solve barrel placements in the 100s on 1 turn, weapon swapping, and other things. but where do you draw the line for rules in a video game? I dont think it should be used for doors buttons or levers, but would we limit this to dropping candles? is it worth programming into the game though?

Also you can drop a lit candle any turn you want right now and dip your weapon into it for bonus fire as well, Almost no one has complained about this.

[branmakmuffin]

Brigador a écrit :

Mind you, as a free action you could ALSO swap back after the attack for, say, more damaging attacks of opportunity.

What do you mean by "swap back?" Once I have attacked, are you assuming I stow my weapon or just drop it? If I stow it after I have attacked, that uses up my free "interact with the environment" and I just used my action by attacking. If I am willing to drop my weapon, then I can use my free "interact with the environment" to draw my new weapon, but now my other weapon is on the ground.

I can't attack, stow current and draw new all in the same turn. I can attack, drop current and draw new.

I'm talking RAW PnP. Larian can do it however they want.

[ctreid1987]

Well, my entire point is this ... if the rule set was implemented correctly in the first place, with a limited object interaction of 1/turn, none of this would be a problem. Larian wants to play D&D? Please read the rules first. I should probably correct my initial solution to say that dropping an item from your hand is a free action, maybe dropping a barrel counts for the object interaction. And yet we still have this problem with shields being equipped in the offhand adding to AC while having a two-handed bow equipped? That should obviously be fixed as well...

[branmakmuffin]

Tinball a écrit :

branmakmuffin a écrit :

Bottom line is I don't see any way, following 5e RAW, for a character to stow its current weapon, draw a new weapon and attack with the new weapon all in the same turn.

By RAW you are correct.

Most DMs I've played with typically allow you to switch out a one handed weapon as a free action. I think this is the rule as intended. I'm not going to tell a player they have to use an action to switch from a long sword to a mace. But that's just my opinion.

By "switch out" I assume you mean "sheathe, draw" with attack somewhere in the mix, not "drop, draw" with attack somewhere in the mix.

Hold the phone, Yes, Mearls does Tweet that allowing to switch out a weapon as a free action is the rule as intended.

https://twitter.com/mikemearls/status/490632291656667136

So, this is a judgement call by the DM.

The only thing of any merit I see on that link is Mearls saying "DM is free to make a call, based on the situation." That's like saying "You're free to feel thirsty if you need a drink."

If I undergo a lobotomy and start GMing 5e, I would require an action to "sheathe old and draw new,' which would require the player to make a tactical decision about having the character drop its current weapon as opposed to sheathing it. Happens all the time when I play Runequest.

[cantila1]

Your idea would make disarm useless, just equip another from your inventory or pick it up from the ground for free. It's a terrible idea for other reasons too (like shield swapping). Your reference to the rulebook is misinterpreted, you already get to draw your weapon for free. This is what that section refers to.

What your find boring like 90 % of the players find necessary to prevent what really is boring, to never face difficulties by always having the perfect weapon ready at hand. What's the point of monsters being resistant to slashing if you can just swap weapon at will?

[ctreid1987]

Yes. I am pigeon-holed in to drawing ONE WEAPON for free. A single melee weapon. There is no ability to drop the current weapon and fill the slot with another once per turn. (Anyways, I suspect this is the case, I cannot check because the game won't work right now.) A better option would be to allow 2 melee weapons to be ready, and maybe a ranged weapon (3 weapon sets or something). I also did not know disarm was in the game, I saw Weak Grip or something but I have not tried that yet.

[cantila1]

Disarm is in the game, for example in the fight with Anders I got disarmed by one of the characters, also was disarmed when fighting the monsters in the cave before facing Auntie Ethel.

The fighter also has disarm as one of the pickable special actions requiring a superiority dice. So the player can use this too.

I believe Weak Grip is a different effect than disarm.

[branmakmuffin]

cantila1 a écrit :

Your idea would make disarm useless, just equip another from your inventory or pick it up from the ground for free. It's a terrible idea for other reasons too (like shield swapping): You reference to the rulebook is misinterpreted, you already get to draw your weapon for free.

No one ever said you can't. In fact multiple people, including me, said you can.

Disarm is useless no matter how you slice it. You disarm me, on my next attack action I can ready a weapon, presumably including the one you just knocked out of my hand since it is also just "one object or feature of the environment," as part of my attack action.

So that's all disarming accomplishes: it forces the disarmee to "waste" its so-called free action on readying a weapon. And if you think someone has misread page 190 of the PHB, why don't you tell us how it should be read.

[765]

I would like it to be a bonus action too.
A skilled fighter should be able to pick up a weapon and attack in one motion if not pressured too much.