Wyll doesn't have Lv1 spell slots...

[Sogreth]

I don't think I have ever come across this before. Am I doing something wrong? I have Lv1 and 2 spells available, I'm fully rested, but Wyll has 0 Lv1 spell slots. And it's only letting me cast my Lv1 spells, as Lv2.

[zenebatos1]

Thats how PAct MAgic for Warlocks works.

Contrary to other Spell casters, who have a slew of spells slots of different levels as you level up.

A Warlock has a very small amount of spell slots, But these spells slots get more powerfull as you level up.

Its also the reason why Warlocks get their spell slots back after a short rest, contrary to ALL other Spell casters, that get sthem back After a LONG rest.

Wich means that you are ALWAYS casting your spells at their MAx (up to lvl 5) Output.

Now you get 4 Pact slots at lvl 17 MAX, and these will be MAX lvl 5 (they max at lvl 5 when you reach lvl 9 Warlock).

But after that you'll get whats called Mystic Arcaneums, wich is Spell like abilities that you cast Once per day without using any spell slots ( at lvl 11 you'll get your first Mystic Arcaneum, wich lets you cast 1 6th Lvl Spell, then at lvl 13, One 7th lvl spell, at lvl 15 One 8th Lvl spell and at lvl 17, One 9th lvl spell)

BUt this ain't very important for now, since its most likely that the game at release at least will not go much more over lvl 12-14( not yet fixed).

It can be confusing and strange, its just How the Warlock works, cause unlike other casters, they have their Powers from an external source, wich is not devotion like a Cleric or paladin, Nor Studies, like Wizards.

If you wish for more detailed info; https://www.dndbeyond.com/classes/warlock#WarlockClassDetails

[Pepino]

In short, Warlocks don’t get many spell slots, but the few they have cast at the highest they can be and recharge on short rests, for example in early access they cast at lvl 2 spell slots at character lvl 3-4. Finished a battle? Used all your spell slots? Click the short rest button and your good to go again!!!

The trade off for Warlocks spell slots are also recharged on short rests not long rests, most of spell slots from other classes need long rests, which is amazing in the pen and paper DnD but in the video game currently you can long rest everywhere soo not so much an advantage.

[Metallicus]

Other than getting to torment my players who play Warlocks with their fiend ‘benefactors’ I believe the Warlock class isn’t very good. You can have a lot more fun with nearly any other caster class.

[N/A]

Originally posted by Metallicus:

Other than getting to torment my players who play Warlocks with their fiend ‘benefactors’ I believe the Warlock class isn’t very good. You can have a lot more fun with nearly any other caster class.

I kinda like having some of the quirks of being a martial with short rest resource replenishment and using more or less the same attack as my main damage source, without having to think about my actual equipment besides armor

Plus you have a lot of freedom to tailor them with Eldritch Invocations that let you augment your force laser or cast certain spells that other classes need a slot for on demand. To boot, they have a nice helping of spells tailored around them. Hunger of Hadar is awesome

Also CHA caster + morally ambiguous, so fun to use in social encounters

That's just me though

[Something completely different]

Warlocks also get their slots back through a short rest compared to a long rest for the other caster classes.

It's a trade off, less slots, general higher caster level, easier to get the slots back and additional utility with evocations.

Is it worth it? Depends on your play style I think.

[RealDealBreaker]

Originally posted by Sogreth:

I don't think I have ever come across this before. Am I doing something wrong? I have Lv1 and 2 spells available, I'm fully rested, but Wyll has 0 Lv1 spell slots. And it's only letting me cast my Lv1 spells, as Lv2.

That's how warlocks work in 5e. They always cast spells at X level (1st for level 1 and 2, 2nd at level 3 and 4, ..., 5th at levels 9+). Later they get Mystic Arcanum which allow them to cast a level 6 (and even later a 7th, 8th, and 9th) spell once per long rest.

Warlocks lack the ability to moderate the spell power they access. It is either all or nothing. This is balanced by them having fewer spell slots but the spell slots recharge on a short rest.

[RealDealBreaker]

Originally posted by Metallicus:

Other than getting to torment my players who play Warlocks with their fiend ‘benefactors’ I believe the Warlock class isn’t very good. You can have a lot more fun with nearly any other caster class.

Warlocks are great. They are far from weak and 'compete' (not that d&d is a pvp game) with the other class just fine.

[RealDealBreaker]

Originally posted by GrandMajora:

Originally posted by Something completely different:

Is it worth it? Depends on your play style I think.

I would say that it isn't. So you can cast your spells at their highest available slot level. Big deal, you only get 2 shots off in battle before you need to reload, upgrading to a whopping 3 shots at level 11 and then a greedy 4th shot at level 17.

Holy damn, you're gonna take down an army with that kind of fire power! ~sarcasm.

Wizards, Sorcerers and pretty much any other spell casters in the game get far more slots over the course of their progression, and also have the option to cast them at their highest level. Then when they use up all their available slots for that level, they can downgrade the spell to 1 slot level lower until that ammo depletes, then keep moving down the list.

It seems like the Warlock's saving grace isn't their usefulness as a spell caster, but rather the invocations they gain access to in order to upgrade their abilities. Eldritch Blast eventually becomes a multi ray cantrip, and it's effects stack. So if you take Repelling Blast and make all three shots target the same enemy, you can send them flying 15 feet away from you!

Devil's Sight gives you dark vision that even works on magical darkness, something which I think is supposed to be difficult to obtain for low level characters.

Beast Tongue gives you unlimited castings of Speak with Animals, which is a very entertaining spell in this game.

What your analysis neglects is that most combat encounters in 5e (in my experience playing, DMing, and watching streamed games) last 2-5 rounds and most groups will only have one or two combat encounters between short rests*. In a 2-5 round fight most casters will only cast a spell or two (maybe three at higher levels) unless they have reason to believe this is the only fight they are likely to encounter before a long rest and just use cantrips on the other rounds. A warlock can do the same but get a bigger bang out of their spells and be recharged for the next fight.


*Some groups only have 1 or two combats between long rests. In those games, yes warlocks are weak compared to other casters since everyone knows/becomes conditioned to going nova every fight.

[Thrax]

Warlocks fit into the category of strong in campaigns with plenty of access to short rests.
Many of those balancing issues go out the window when you can simply load save, or meta things, let alone rest at your leisure.

POEII addressed things fairly well by balancing everything around encounters, which alleviated the issues between so many classes requiring rests and others not in the first game. Too bad the main story and destination sucked hole. Which I dare say can also be said of Pathfinder Kingmaker, except they make the journey a chore.

Warlocks function, but welcome to the 5E setting if things feel slow early on.

[zenebatos1]

Originally posted by GrandMajora:

Originally posted by Something completely different:

Is it worth it? Depends on your play style I think.

I would say that it isn't. So you can cast your spells at their highest available slot level. Big deal, you only get 2 shots off in battle before you need to reload, upgrading to a whopping 3 shots at level 11 and then a greedy 4th shot at level 17.

Holy damn, you're gonna take down an army with that kind of fire power! ~sarcasm.

Wizards, Sorcerers and pretty much any other spell casters in the game get far more slots over the course of their progression, and also have the option to cast them at their highest level. Then when they use up all their available slots for that level, they can downgrade the spell to 1 slot level lower until that ammo depletes, then keep moving down the list.

It seems like the Warlock's saving grace isn't their usefulness as a spell caster, but rather the invocations they gain access to in order to upgrade their abilities. Eldritch Blast eventually becomes a multi ray cantrip, and it's effects stack. So if you take Repelling Blast and make all three shots target the same enemy, you can send them flying 15 feet away from you!

Devil's Sight gives you dark vision that even works on magical darkness, something which I think is supposed to be difficult to obtain for low level characters.

Beast Tongue gives you unlimited castings of Speak with Animals, which is a very entertaining spell in this game.

LIke you said Warlock is NOT only about spellcasting, but also the Invocations AND Pacts and their Patrons.

Warlocks contrary to other classes has 4 Layers to their Cakes.

Class, Patron, Pacts, Invocations

WHile all other classes as 2 Layers.

Class & Subclass.

Its up to the Warlock player to find what fits his/her playstyle.

Warlocks in facts are NOT Spellcasters or even Half Casters, they are their own thing.

They are Gishs that can shift around their utilities and has much more versatility in their Growth.

Warlocks is a nuanced class that requires a bit more thinking about what they cast and when they cast it.

While the others can cast willy nilly all over the place, before needing 8 Hours rest like an 80's Porn star who needs 8 hours after one scene.

Is the Warlock underpowered compared to others?

Maybe so, the issue is that the Geniuses at WotC when doing their Beta test with DnD NEXT( name of D&D5 during tests), they where afraid that a class that was good at melee, good at magic and capable of wearing armor was gonna be too OP.

So they preimptively Nerfed it by VASTLY limiting their spell slots progression.

...Then they made the paladin and the Bards...

Wich is the biggest ♥♥♥♥ you i've ever seen, and those incompetent Twinks never bothered to adress the issues and balance it again ( even if Warlocks only has like 8 slots, i'll be fine with that)

Whats even more ridiculous is that after that they gave the Figther the Eldritch Knight subclass and the Rogues the Arcane Trickster...

So suddenly they where not afraid of martial with armors and casting spells?

When people pointed it out, they admitted that yes it was a mistake, but if they had to redo the Warlock, then it would be VASTLY different from what it is now...

Its basically like telling Kids "Yeah it sucks you're grounded, but you should shut up or else i'll give you something to cry over for real this time"...

Thats why personaly i say ♥♥♥♥ it and MC into paladin, and WOTC can suck my arse if they like...

[zenebatos1]

Originally posted by GrandMajora:

Originally posted by RealDealBreaker:

What your analysis neglects is that most combat encounters in 5e (in my experience playing, DMing, and watching streamed games) last 2-5 rounds and most groups will only have one or two combat encounters between short rests*. In a 2-5 round fight most casters will only cast a spell or two (maybe three at higher levels) unless they have reason to believe this is the only fight they are likely to encounter before a long rest and just use cantrips on the other rounds. A warlock can do the same but get a bigger bang out of their spells and be recharged for the next fight.


*Some groups only have 1 or two combats between long rests. In those games, yes warlocks are weak compared to other casters since everyone knows/becomes conditioned to going nova every fight.

Be that as it may, BG3 is sadly not operating under the idea of table top, where combat is scarce and battles are quick. Combat is actually the primary method in which we seem to address our problems in the game right now. And without access to the 3rd level AoE spells, or multiple attacks for martial combatants, the fights tend to drag on longer than they perhaps should.

Video games also can't take into account player ingenuity, or the possibility that DM's will bend or tweak the rules in order to support the "rule of cool." Playing D&D in video game format, is like playing D&D with a Rules Lawyer as your DM. Everything must be done by the book, or by however the game happens to be designed.

Yes, Warlocks get their spells back on a short rest, but you can't take a short rest in the middle of combat, now can you?

Between the choice of casting Magic Missile twice as a 2nd level spell, or casting it 3 times as a 2nd level spell and 4 times as a 1st level spell, I know which option I'm going with.

-----------------------------

But just to clarify, I agree that Clerics and Warlocks do have far greater role play opportunities in table top, where things are not so restricted by programmed mechanics. The relationship with your patrons and deities can be a great theme to explore.

Sadly, video games make them out to be nothing more than a source of spell selections, without actually going into more depth about the fact that you are the servant of some higher power.

Thats why there is mods.

Of Larian's version is the closest to Official rules( we know, we know, there's some Homebrew in it)

Then mods is basically the Homebrew you need yo go around the things you don't like.

And i'm sure that there will be a Mod that gives you +2/4/6 Pact Slots as a Warock pretty darn fast.