Rolling ability scores vs. using the standard array

[Zyenu]

Did Larian ever mention if they will allow us to roll for scores, and/or hp during lvl up? Its would be fun to play with friends and see both get crap ability roles

[Ronin Gamer]

Don't quote me on this, but I believe it will be added, or be present on full release. They said initially it would be buy, but are aware many people had an interest in rolling for it as well.

[RealDealBreaker]

And even if it doesn't get added (though I too seem to recall Larian mentioning that rolling would be added eventually) it is an easy mod that someone will make. And even if rolling in game is too difficult to mod, it is super easy to modify ability scores so you could always just roll IRL and modifie the files accordingly. It is a single-player/co-op game so really you can do whatever you want.

[Mosey]

Yeah, like anyone is going to play a character that got 9's on all their stats. Dice rolling for your stats in a video game just means people are going to exploit it by rerolling until they get all 18's.

Remember Neverwinter Nights, and how literally everyone in multiplayer would level up at least a dozen times trying to get that maximum HP role? Yeah, it'll be that all over again.

No thanks.

Still, it's fine if people want that I suppose. I just think it'll generate a thousand times more complaints than it will generate happy players. People already complain about DC checks with maximum primary stats, imagine how much they'll complain when their primary stat is a 3.

[alanc9]

Who cares what other players do with the feature?

[dolby]

Originally posted by Mosey:

Yeah, like anyone is going to play a character that got 9's on all their stats. Dice rolling for your stats in a video game just means people are going to exploit it by rerolling until they get all 18's.

Remember Neverwinter Nights, and how literally everyone in multiplayer would level up at least a dozen times trying to get that maximum HP role? Yeah, it'll be that all over again.

No thanks.

Still, it's fine if people want that I suppose. I just think it'll generate a thousand times more complaints than it will generate happy players. People already complain about DC checks with maximum primary stats, imagine how much they'll complain when their primary stat is a 3.

No one will complain cos it's optional and if going by that logic we don't need save cos people save scum anyway?

I would love it if i could start the gameplay as a kid and then get stats depanding on what i do in the world but that's not gonna happen anytime soon will it? At best we get to pick a background in some games.

[alanc9]

That approach to stats isn't a D&D thing. Even if I liked it I'd say this is the wrong game for it.

[guard65]

To be honest when I was DMing I let players roll 4d6 and take the best 3 dice. Once all six scores were rolled they get to move these fixed scores to the abilities that suite their build.

Personally the way the ability scores are being done now are just fine by me. If I want god powers I will just give them to my character...

[R3sistance]

Originally posted by OrcBro:

Originally posted by alanc9:

That approach to stats isn't a D&D thing. Even if I liked it I'd say this is the wrong game for it.

It is literally a D&D thing. In 5e it's either a standard array or roll 4d6 and choose 3 highest rolls. Read Player's Handbook

I don't even need to check to know this is correct, Dice rolls are the default rules where point buy and standard array are variant optional rules.

[Hobocop]

Standard Array is included in the the default ability score generation rules as an alternative to save time or for those who prefer not to have randomly generated ability scores. Point Buy is the variant.

You generate your character’s six ability scores randomly. Roll four 6-sided dice and record the total of the highest three dice on a piece of scratch paper. Do this five more times, so that you have six numbers. If you want to save time or don’t like the idea of randomly determining ability scores, you can use the following scores instead: 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8.

[R3sistance]

Originally posted by Hobocop:

Standard Array is included in the the default ability score generation rules as an alternative to save time or for those who prefer not to have randomly generated ability scores. Point Buy is the variant.

You generate your character’s six ability scores randomly. Roll four 6-sided dice and record the total of the highest three dice on a piece of scratch paper. Do this five more times, so that you have six numbers. If you want to save time or don’t like the idea of randomly determining ability scores, you can use the following scores instead: 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8.

dang, well dice roll is still stated first! woot, my memory isn't too far off.

[lindad7999]

Originally posted by alanc9:

That approach to stats isn't a D&D thing. Even if I liked it I'd say this is the wrong game for it.

That is a D&D thing point buy is for the most part a recent thin before that you rolled your stats. I find the point buy to be tedious oh boy i can have a 16 and some ok stats every place else not me I prefer the roll and the luck of the dice.

[Lumby]

if this isn't on launch im sure someone will mod it in.

[Mosey]

Originally posted by dolby:

Originally posted by Mosey:

Still, it's fine if people want that I suppose. I just think it'll generate a thousand times more complaints than it will generate happy players. People already complain about DC checks with maximum primary stats, imagine how much they'll complain when their primary stat is a 3.

No one will complain cos it's optional and if going by that logic we don't need save cos people save scum anyway?

I'm fine with it being added, I'm just not so sure anyone will use that feature when it has the potential to massively gimp your character to the point of unplayability right from the get-go, which essentially means people are going to just reroll characters until they get all 18's.

No one except a masochist is going to play a character with two minimum stats, for example. Or even just one minimum stat.

In tabletop the bad stats issue is easy enough to resolve with a GM that probably won't let you gimp yourself that badly for their campaign, and if they do they're a bad GM IMO.

It's a bit different save scumming to succeed at a particular conversation or one particular roll, but save scumming to give your character all 18's from the start seems like a bigger deal to me.

And for that matter, a character who rolls all 1's for their HP would be similarly unplayable. Hence why EVERYONE in NWN rerolled each level up until they got max HP. You'll see the same thing here, I guarantee it.

Basically the amount of variability with stat rolling is non-ideal for a video game version of D&D. The game is balanced around a certain stat distribution, and once you go outside that distribution it drastically changes difficulty of the game.

There are ways to implement it to minimize those problems, but the problem of starting with max stats is harder to resolve since it's not that hard to remake a game lobby until you get that perfect setup for what will probably be a 40+ hour campaign.

Hooray to games with a host who has 18's across the board, while I have to take what I can get or rejoin a dozen or more times to get the same distribution.

[OrcBro]

Originally posted by Mosey:

Hooray to games with a host who has 18's across the board, while I have to take what I can get or rejoin a dozen or more times to get the same distribution.

Just play how you like with people you like to play with. D&D is nothing but flexible. You can alter races, backgrounds, stats, everything to make yourself a "superhero of Forgotten Realms" of your dreams. Yes, some people will make sure to roll 18s across the board, some people won't. I will obviously make my Half-Orc Moon Circle Druid have a minimum of 17 WIZ and no stats lower than 10 at start, not even a question... but at the same time I'm running around making sure i accidentally didn't learn a wrong spell with a wizard right now, because "it's not canon" and "you won't have this ♥♥♥♥ fly at launch" hehehe

[Mosey]

Originally posted by OrcBro:

Originally posted by Mosey:

Hooray to games with a host who has 18's across the board, while I have to take what I can get or rejoin a dozen or more times to get the same distribution.

Just play how you like with people you like to play with. D&D is nothing but flexible. You can alter races, backgrounds, stats, everything to make yourself a "superhero of Forgotten Realms" of your dreams. Yes, some people will make sure to roll 18s across the board, some people won't. I will obviously make my Half-Orc Moon Circle Druid have a minimum of 17 WIZ and no stats lower than 10 at start, not even a question... but at the same time I'm running around making sure i accidentally didn't learn a wrong spell with a wizard right now, because "it's not canon" and "you won't have this ♥♥♥♥ fly at launch" hehehe

D&D might be 'flexible' but GM's that let their players have all max stats are terrible GM's, even if you have to reroll a hundred times to get there.

This is the reason why most video game versions of D&D only have the point buy option. It's because it protects players from crap rolls and ensures a minimum level of function from the character, even if you can still horribly break a character from the get go it's much harder to do so.

It also makes it less attractive to restart the game/lobby dozens of times looking for the perfect stats, which is mostly a waste of the players time but still so valuable in terms of gameplay that it's super attractive to waste that time, especially as a host.

Might as well ask Larian to include a mode where everyone starts with 18's plus racial bonuses, because that's effectively what it will be just with lots of wasted time to get there.