Why no Tac0?

[Coalition]

Hello, I know dices rolls are essential, and how it works in DnD, but why did they chose to display %chances to hit instead of Tac0 ?

[Aria Athena]

I don't like the percentages, but I like THAC0 even less. I wish mouse over or selecting an enemy would just show you their AC and saves. But I don't expect the %s to go anywhere, they simplify the math significantly, which is very convenient, I don't think many people care to learn which spell targets what save for example. But I also think it's rather boring, so an option would be nice.

[dulany67]

The % displayed is based on THAC0. It is a simplification for display purposes.

[Capt.Luke]

tac0 was abandoned in dnd 3 edition.
the base ac is 10 now not 0

[Boink]

Originally posted by Capt.Luke:

tac0 was abandoned in dnd 3 edition.
the base ac is 10 now not 0

/\ True.

[Coalition]

Originally posted by Aria Athena:

I don't like the percentages, but I like THAC0 even less. I wish mouse over or selecting an enemy would just show you their AC and saves. But I don't expect the %s to go anywhere, they simplify the math significantly, which is very convenient, I don't think many people care to learn which spell targets what save for example. But I also think it's rather boring, so an option would be nice.

I would rather have a system with my dice rolls being displayed maybe an option to change % into something like"you need to roll a 18 to hit" for instance the same as in dialogues checks. That would be nice

Originally posted by Capt.Luke:

tac0 was abandoned in dnd 3 edition.
the base ac is 10 now not 0

I checked a wiki and right,

Originally posted by wiki:

Dungeons & Dragons third edition (2000) changed to a more intuitive ascending armor class system, where a higher armor class is better. Characters and monsters now have an attack bonus, which is added to a d20 roll and compared to the target's armor class to determine a hit.

This change eliminated the need for THAC0. All editions of the game since then have continued to use the ascending armor class system.

[dulany67]

We knew what you meant.

[Soft Lockpick]

Just a picture of a taco every time you target something?

[Malus]

Originally posted by Capt.Luke:

tac0 was abandoned in dnd 3 edition.
the base ac is 10 now not 0

THAC10

[zenebatos1]

Originally posted by Soft Lockpick:

Just a picture of a taco every time you target something?

Great now i'm hungry...

[Dragon Master]

THAC0 has not been a thing for 20 years. It stopped being a thing since AD&D 2nd Edition. Starting from 3rd edition onwards it's been AC (armor class).

[Donduffino]

I'm totally for including tacos in the game.

[Malus]

Originally posted by Donduffino:

I'm totally for including tacos in the game.

They are called Kobold Crunchies

[MyLittleJohny]

Originally posted by Capt.Luke:

tac0 was abandoned in dnd 3 edition.
the base ac is 10 now not 0

Technically THAC0 still exist. Let's say someone has AC16, you know your chance is negative 16 to touch AC 0. It's just that the mechanic/math behind it works different because your character doesn't carry thac0 as an atribute. But generally speaking you are still trying to hit AC0, just simplified (as I said, it's not carried as an Chance to hit atribute, it's an outcome of an encounter based on your other stats). BTW the base AC doesn't really matter cause it doesn't enter the equation. But correct me if I am wrong.


I am still not sure if this system is better. I appreciate the scaling of THAC0 system more and more, even tho it was too complicated for beginners and not so convinient as 3e system.

Originally posted by Aria Athena:

I don't like the percentages, but I like THAC0 even less. I wish mouse over or selecting an enemy would just show you their AC and saves. But I don't expect the %s to go anywhere, they simplify the math significantly, which is very convenient, I don't think many people care to learn which spell targets what save for example. But I also think it's rather boring, so an option would be nice.

I was a fan of % at the begining but since this game has so many homebrew variables, sometimes it's little bit annoying not to understand why suddenly you have only 30% chance to hit. I still like the existance of %, but sometimes it would be good to understand what is actually happening before I land the attack.

[wendigo211]

They didn't change the base AC in 3rd edition, characters always had a base 10 AC even in second edition. In second edition, AC 0 was a 18 dex character in splint mail armor.
What they did was rearrange the equation from:
You hit if: d20>=THAC0-AC (2nd edition)
To
You hit if: d20+AB>=AC (3rd edition)

The actual change was, AB=20-THAC0 and AC(3rd)=20-AC(2nd)
It was basically a change from lower is better to higher is better.

5th edition went a step further and got rid of separate AB progression for each class. Now each class get a proficiency bonus instead which is based solely on character level.

[MyLittleJohny]

Originally posted by wendigo211:

They didn't change the base AC in 3rd edition, characters always had a base 10 AC even in second edition. In second edition, AC 0 was a 18 dex character in splint mail armor.
What they did was rearrange the equation from:
You hit if: d20>=THAC0-AC (2nd edition)
To
You hit if: d20+AB>=AC (3rd edition)

The actual change was, AB=20-THAC0 and AC(3rd)=20-AC(2nd)
It was basically a change from lower is better to higher is better.

5th edition went a step further and got rid of separate AB progression for each class. Now each class get a proficiency bonus instead which is based solely on character level.

This is my understanding explained without my lame english and stylistics :D