Trading

[Ravioli]

I'm aware of trading from Larian's previous games. This one confuses me a bit. If I were to buy an item that costs 380 gold from the npc panel, and then costs 930 gold in the trade window. Why? Also what's the point of the barter and trade options? Bartering, I just give them items without counter trading, and straight up trading just makes the item cost the 930 gold.

[Standing Raccoon]

I am also confused by the dramatic changes in price from the NPC to the trade panel.

[Eelectrica]

Completely broken at the moment. Even for a high charisma character.
Guess that's what Early Access is for. Be interesting to see how/if this changes.

[Shadow♥]

yes it definitely is not working right now. i see 350 for price then i go to buy it and price suddenly is like more than 800 gold. you cant go by any of the prices listed. i tried buying a head tiara that gives a great skill and it was listed for sale a 640 gold then it ended up actually being like 1300 gold. it is crazy right now. lol

[N/A]

Anyone got the core 5e rulebooks and could type the rules on exchange rates down real fast, that'd be awesome

[guard65]

I do not think they have any of the trading scripts active in play during EA.

Currently traders always sells at double the list price (inventory list value) on the item and buys at half the list price of the item.

Plus the inventory is blah in EA.

[Shadow♥]

Originally posted by guard65:

I do not think they have any of the trading scripts active in play during EA.

Currently traders always sells at double the list price (inventory list value) on the item and buys at half the list price of the item.

Plus the inventory is blah in EA.

yes. agree. the best items are the ones you get from defeating battles and are ones that some certain character needs . lol. actually a lot of those seem kinda cursed in some way anyway except sword of justice and crones staff. those both i have used and they are good. but the traders inventory is bad. there's only one trader in underdark that has some very useful gear but its very expensive.

[dolby]

Heh, never looked at the prices cos the first thing i did was steal everything! And if for some reason something is hard to steal you just buy it with their money so...

First thing they need to do is balance pickpocketing... Before they even look at the numbers for items... A good balance would be make it a dialogue thing. But seeing how they really like their systemic systems that option is out and pickpocketing will remain broken. I guess time will tell.

[ColdFaeHeart]

it's a combination of things: relationship between you and the trader (giving gifts ups relationship and drops prices, your charisma modifier, etc.... Similar to tabletop, different traders and areas some things will have different values. I don't pay or charge my players the same thing the book lists as the price. Sometimes they don't have the bard with them, some times a particular thing is rare in a region, etc...

[oco.hollis]

Here is some info from the official Larian BG3 forums... https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=750321#Post750321

I'm not 100% sure it will copy correctly so we'll see. If the first post from that thread copies correctly I'll edit this post to add some explanation. It didn't but I'll explain more below.

Originally posted by BraveSirRobin:

[img]https://i.imgur.com/tBQ3PeD.png[/img]

I made this spreadsheet showing how charisma and vendor attitude affects the cost of buying items and the return you get for selling them. The lower your charisma and vendor attitude the less they'll pay for your stuff and the more items will cost. This attitude system is much like DOS2 in this regard. You can check your attitude with a vendor by right clicking them and selecting examine. Donating items by putting them in the barter window and selecting barter without hitting the scales so you get nothing back will raise your faction. When you leave the vendor screen it won't show you your new faction level until you select another char and then go back to that char. Faction is only increased on the donation char, not your whole party.

Originally posted by OcO:

Any toon of any charisma can buy attitude to max for 200G. The game does track this value over more than 1 transaction with the vendor changes appearing to scale up to max. You can do this directly by just giving the vendor 200G in one go or over time in the form of gold directly and/or items. The "value" of an item toward buying attitude is the amount shown in the vendor trade screen when you add it to a sell slot NOT the value listed on the item itself. As shown in the data above lower charisma toons will have to donate more in items to max attitude since the items "value" is less.

There are 2 primary factors that determine a vendor's buy/sell prices...your CHA attribute and the vendor's Attitude toward that toon.

If you look at the linked spreadsheet image you see buy/sell prices for items at various CHA levels and at 0 or 100 Attitude. To determine Attitude right click on the vendor and examine. Note Attitude is per vendor per toon in your party. Donating gold or goods to 1 vendor with 1 party member does NOT change the prices for other vendors or change the prices for other members of you party who try to sell/buy.

Imo the data listed is easier to read if you drop the last digit rounded up and thus read it as a percent.

For example
@8 CHA- buying an item costs 260% of the value listed on the item itself if 0 Attitude and 210% of the value listed if 100 Attitude. When selling the vendor offers 38% of the listed value at 0 Attitude and 48% list value at 100 Attitude.
@20 CHA buying an item costs 200% listed vlaue at 0 Attitude and 150% at 100 Attitude, while selling nets you 50% of the list value if 0 Attitude and 69% at 100 Attitude.

As you can see raising the vendor's Attitude through either directly gifting 200G or the equivalence in goods drops 50 percentage points off the price of buying an item and up to almost as much as +20% on an items sell value.

For those that see the numbers but don't know what to really make of it all here are basic tips...

1. Always use your highest CHA toon for buying or selling items.
2. If a particular vendor has goods with a list price of 400G or more in total(either 1 item or multiple that add up to 400G) you will save money by simply gifting that vendor 200G right off the bat to lower the prices of their goods.
3. Even if you are going to steal everything from the vendors rather than buy it, you should max Attitude with at least 1 vendor per main area or act to sell your goods to for maximum profit.

[Shadow♥]

Originally posted by oco.hollis:

Here is some info from the official Larian BG3 forums... https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=750321#Post750321

I'm not 100% sure it will copy correctly so we'll see. If the first post from that thread copies correctly I'll edit this post to add some explanation. It didn't but I'll explain more below.

Originally posted by BraveSirRobin:

[img]https://i.imgur.com/tBQ3PeD.png[/img]

I made this spreadsheet showing how charisma and vendor attitude affects the cost of buying items and the return you get for selling them. The lower your charisma and vendor attitude the less they'll pay for your stuff and the more items will cost. This attitude system is much like DOS2 in this regard. You can check your attitude with a vendor by right clicking them and selecting examine. Donating items by putting them in the barter window and selecting barter without hitting the scales so you get nothing back will raise your faction. When you leave the vendor screen it won't show you your new faction level until you select another char and then go back to that char. Faction is only increased on the donation char, not your whole party.

There are 2 primary factors that determine a vendor's buy/sell prices...your CHA attribute and the vendor's Attitude toward that toon.

If you look at the linked spreadsheet image you see buy/sell prices for items at various CHA levels and at 0 or 100 Attitude. To determine Attitude right click on the vendor and examine. Note Attitude is per vendor per toon in your party. Donating gold or goods to 1 vendor with 1 party member does NOT change the prices for other vendors or change the prices for other members of you party who try to sell/buy.

Imo the data listed is easier to read if you drop the last digit rounded up and thus read it as a percent.

For example
@8 CHA- buying an item costs 260% of the value listed on the item itself if 0 Attitude and 210% of the value listed if 100 Attitude. When selling the vendor offers 38% of the listed value at 0 Attitude and 48% list value at 100 Attitude.
@20 CHA buying an item costs 200% listed vlaue at 0 Attitude and 150% at 100 Attitude, while selling nets you 50% of the list value if 0 Attitude and 69% at 100 Attitude.

As you can see raising the vendor's Attitude through either directly gifting 200G or the equivalence in goods drops 50 percentage points off the price of buying an item and up to almost as much as +20% on an items sell value.

For those that see the numbers but don't know what to really make of it all here are basic tips...

1. Always use your highest CHA toon for buying or selling items.
2. If a particular vendor has goods with a list price of 400G or more in total(either 1 item or multiple that add up to 400G) you will save money by simply gifting that vendor 200G right off the bat to lower the prices of their goods.
3. Even if you are going to steal everything from the vendors rather than buy it, you should max Attitude with at least 1 vendor per main area or act to sell your goods to for maximum profit.

thanks for this in depth explanation. I had no idea. that will make it much better for me now that i know this. :)

[oco.hollis]

Originally posted by N/A:

Originally posted by N/A:

Anyone got the core 5e rulebooks and could type the rules on exchange rates down real fast, that'd be awesome

No one? Can anyone at least say if CHA affects item pricings in the 5e ruleset?

Lemme level with you, I really don't want to funnel all my items to the CHA guy every time we have to trade. In solo, sure, whatever, fine, but if the charisma guy is another player, who could be off doing something else, having a character interaction of any length, and I just want to buy a specific item that only helps my character, that could get extremely annoying for both of us.

I could buy it myself obviously, but at a loss of gold, which the party needs to buy revives from the skeleton, inscribe spells into the Wizard's book, or maybe deal with situations in the future that might depend on having gold on hand, paying bribes, buying an important item for a quest or battle, any number of things they might add with later acts. There are also spells in the base ruleset that require components that cost gold before they can be cast. It's about preparedness.

But, see, it could suck for the charisma guy too, who'd have to deal with extra inventory stuffing and being dragged around from any personal errand he might be on to buy stuff for his party. He could be talking to an NPC and having an interesting dialogue, only to get poked to warp to whatever town because a trader had a +2 dagger on hand or something, a problem neither person would deal with if the game had fixed prices.

Also it's another ache you'd get to deal with if you don't have a CHA character on hand. It's only sensible to have at least one, yeah, but with the considerably different paths dialogue can take based on speech checks, it doesn't feel necessary making a party that just quietly gets things done have to additionally deal with inflated prices on everything.

If the rules the game's based on condone it, fine, but if not, please just have set prices at release. I didn't enjoy all the item juggling when I played DOS2 with mates and I have no idea what it would even add to BG3. Just add a persuasion check players can make to slightly improve a trader's prices for the rest of the day if you're keen on compromise, at least any player could make and pass something like that.

You get where I'm coming from, here?

I just tried a quick google search and actually didn't see anything at a quick glance that indicates that it does. In fact I found a thread discussing BG2 and how CHA did not affect barter, I honestly couldn't remember myself if it had or not. I think CHA + vendoring may be a Larian homebrew.

[ColdFaeHeart]

I just tried a quick google search and actually didn't see anything at a quick glance that indicates that it does. In fact I found a thread discussing BG2 and how CHA did not affect barter, I honestly couldn't remember myself if it had or not. I think CHA + vendoring may be a Larian homebrew. [/quote]


I am always used to seeing cost of items varying at the table too. It's generally a "how good are you at haggling (persuasion, charisma, intimidation) however you play wanting to do it" which are all usually charisma based. Which is usually why games go for charisma behind the scenes being the controlling factor.

[guard65]

I get you there. Item juggling in this UI is a real massive pain. One item at a time, if you could select all items or highlight a group of items that would be one thing, but no...

In Dos2 i always added the mod for party trader values. So no matter who traded the best value out of all the party members was applied to trading.