Starting Levels..

[Martin]

One of the aspects of the game I dislike is we're starting at lv 1.. lv 1 to about 12 are rubbish levels. Boring levels.

One of the reasons I think why games continually force you to level 1 or limit you to the low levels end is so you'll have a low hp pool and won't ever get access to useful skills/spells like resurrection. Which is around a lv 7 spell, to which you usually need 2 levels per level of spell to attain.. in games, so to get to lv 7.. you need to be at least level 14.. for example, different games have different rules on this. But raise dead is invariably one of the most important spells.. for obvious reasons.

But really, D&D doesn't usually offer up anything interesting to fight at lower levels.. you might see the odd troll, maybe an ogre or some ghouls.. the rest is skeletons, zombies, rats, wolves the odd bear.. it's BORING.

At least it would be better imo to let us rapidly get to around lv 5 before getting into the main game.. say make lv 1-5 the tutorial area..

Obviously it makes the game more "challenging" to have everyone play at lv 1.. fighting 4 lv 1 characters is quite an extreme fight at lv 1.. fighting 4 level 20s at lv 20.. not so much. But D&D isn't really about the fights, it's about exploration, tactics, strategy, story, lore, the journey.. so why nerf people from the get go.. BG3 shouldn't be so much about the combat, as much as about the story. It's a tale.. for a Bard to sing about.. imagine the song for "they met, they went 100m into the woods and 3 of them died" kind of a boring song that.. not really an epic saga.

I don't much look forward to huffing around 2 dead companions for 5 hours.. grinding gold to get a temple res. Thanks.. but no. And I don't see why we should be forced into save scumming either.

[DoM]

Boring or not the dnd xp system when you Reached >14 lvl made you feel like you really earned them.

[DoM]

And starting bg1 with 8 hp and had to run even from tough squirrels made it fun.

[Wraith]

um no? I actually like the fact that I'm starting as level one.
What kind of adventure get you to level 5 after the tutorial...

[Martin]

It's really one of the major differences between rpg and aRpgs to me.. aRPGs get interesting quicker.. they're like the more fun part of the grindy rpg. And it shouldn't be like that. I don't need to feel like I earned something, I want to fight interesting stuff that uses variable attacks.. but doesn't slaughter me outright.

[Wraith]

of course aRPG get interesting faster.
That the point.
Their focus is literally endgame grind. so you level up fast to get there.

[The Infinity Sock]

I am not a fan of starting level one myself that's why i use cheats to max out my level also it helps me to build the right build first without having to do the story about ten times to find out which build is the best for me

[Martin]

I don't like cheating, I don't like save scumming either.. I detest die to win games, ie you have to die alot to work out how something behaves.. games, good games, should be winnable from the get go. From your very first party.. with little to no variation in original builds. Rerolling a new class, should be solely for making a new character to replay the entire game.. not a necessity because you only got 4' into the gameplay before "THE END" get's displayed on screen.

[Cecis]

I disagree, the first levels in BGI in a game that throws you into the world and you get TPK by some wolves if you are careless, the sense of growing from nothing are one of the best memories for me. I never felt like grinding in that game (heresy!). I think it's good because you get to "know" your character skills and how to use the party.

What I really dislike is games that make you level so fast that it becomes even tedious to open the character page, and this is something I definitely felt in DOS2. Luckjly Swen mentioned that DnD leveling is slower, so at least it's in their radar.

[Martin]

I prefer playing in a more comfortable role.. than desperately winning by the skin of your teeth.. which sounds more like your cup of tea..

I don't like carelessness.. I prefer planning and I expect my planning to win the war.. not get destroyed because there's 400 enemies and only 3 of us..

[UnholyDentist]

Maybe this will be different in BG3, I enjoyed the early levels in DOS games, I suppose it will be a similar vibe in BG3 as well.

[Martin]

Yeh I do like the push skills, throwing boots, bottles of poison, etc the interactivity between environs, so throw down oil, light oil.. etc.. make ice, melt ice, fire lightning onto it.. all that stuff really appeals to me and opens up all kinda of ambush moves and alternative abilities the ai probably won't use.. hopefully won't use.. I can see an ai sprinting through fire to get up a ladder to shove me off a tower into the fire below..

I'm sure you've all played that game as well. It's the midgame that I enjoy most.. not the foreplay nor the endgame..

[Finrod]

In PnP or even in videogames, for a D&D based ruleset, I totally agree, the first 4 level are a true pain.

That's one of the reasons why I like Baldur Gate 2, you begin level 7, (8 with my BG1 save), You quickly get to level 9, and Jaheira get harpist call, your first ressurect. (My cleric too)

Even if I loved temple of elemental evil, I didn't like the game being only from level 1 to 10...

The expansions of Neverwinter nights 1&2, hordes of the underdark and mask of the betrayer, begining at level 18... These were awesome

Regarding gameplay and public, I understand the reason why we have to begin from level one
-if you begin at level 5 or higher, a newcomer can botch the build. Beginning from level 1 let you learn how to play and what you need to level up.

-sometimes people want rapid action, run the game and play, not spending the entire afternoon choosing feats and spells...
(Every player of those games is not a PnP player)

[Faray]

I don't mind starting at 1 but i'd prefer if 1-4 were fairly quick and then it slows down after that.

[rgb651]

" lv 1 to about 12 are rubbish levels. Boring levels. "
What? The most interesting levels is 1-8, like BG1

[DoM]

Originally posted by rgb651:

" lv 1 to about 12 are rubbish levels. Boring levels. "
What? The most interesting levels is 1-8, like BG1

I agree. This is the role playing experience for me.