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TrueWarlord真の武 has Baldur's Gate 3

Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:01pm

Turn-Based PLEASE!

Guess we had enough D&D games with "RTwP". I mean, nearly all of them are RTwP, while a very few like ToEE are turn-based. And seriously, after Pathfinder Kingmaker I'm just sure I don't like RTwP at all.

Important to say since many people don't get it, being able to pause the game is NOT the same as a turn-based game.

RTwP = Requires AI, everyone moves at the same time. AI often do dumb things and we need to fix dumb AI behavior by pausing and assigning new orders (every time).

Turn-Based = Everyone only moves and act in his own turn. No need to predict where anyone will be to cast a fireball. No need to "fix AI behavior" since you have full control of your party. It feels closer to what a tabletop RPG would be like.

Also, I do think that in order to have a proper GM mode where we can play real "pen and paper RPG", it must be turn-based, because you know, that is how any tabletop RPG plays.

I've seen many people asking for "mods" to turn RTwP games into turn-based. I guess now is the time for us to let developers know what we want instead of asking for "mods" later.

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Originally posted by namco:

The only argument real time has is "nostalgia". Literally your only gripe (those saying real time only).

You claim "well you can pause and micromanage each character then un-pause" which you literally do ANYWAY when you play real time, which literally makes it turn based.... so that means turn based is NOT an issue.

You claim that "turn based is too slow" yet if you are constantly pausing to issue commands in real time, you are slowing it down anyway making it turn based. Again, meaning turn based is NOT an issue.

Then you say how in turn based, you end up reloading or starting a fight over, either because of a bad move or mistake, or because of another player ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ up (in multiplayer) YET YOU DO THE SAME EFFING THING IN REAL TIME WITH PAUSE. Oh that fireball you threw, the AI just decided to move from that location randomly, and now your fireball missed, and then you died right after, forcing you to reload. SO ITS LITERALLY THE SAME.

The only real gripe with turn based, is that it doesn't fit your nostalgia of BG1/2.... that's it! There is literally NOTHING superior about it. The "speed" of the fight is NEGATED once you start micromanaging which is required in any strategy game. You literally have no argument for real time over turn based.

Turn based is far superior, especially because you don't have to modify D&D rules AT ALL to fit. Both BG1/2 were modified to fit the real time segment, making it less D&D then it really is. Same with any game that goes real time. Even PATHFINDER had to modify the base game because real time just doesn't work with how the game is actually played via the official rule set. The only reason Divinity Original Sin 1/2 isn't D&D is because technically that makes it an infringement on Wizards of the Coast.... which they could have been sued for.... now with making an actual D&D game, everything can be turn based, the way its meant to be, and the rules do not have to be modified. Just watch Critical Role, they are playing 5e currently in season 2 (probably because of being voice actors for BG3, we just don't KNOW yet) and when you see things like initiative and battle order, not only do you roll, but you have stats for it. You go real time, and that whole system is thrown out the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ window. Things like spells and timed things end up ruined. A battle is generally slowed down in D&D, each turn even though it takes you a bit to say what you want to do and roll dice, is only a fraction of time "in the game world". If you made that real time, things like "last for 1 minute" ends up ruined, because 1 minute ends up being nothing compared to in game time. YES, you could have an in game time counter to help this, but you are just adding in more work.

D&D is a turn based game. Just because old studio's chose to ♥♥♥♥ it up back then, doesn't mean they should ♥♥♥♥ it up now. Larian is turn based. The Wizards of the Coast knew this, that's why Larian got the damn contract.

Now on that note, I am ALL FOR having BOTH game modes available. YES that means more work on the devs. But at least everyone is satisfied. However, I do think they should have some kind of feedback system to see how many people play real time vs turn based, just to see which is more popular. I GUARANTEE turn based is more popular. When you break down real time, its essentially turn based, but requires MORE WORK, when the devs could just do turn based and save them the trouble of changing things.

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Showing 1-15 of 584 comments

My Name Is Mud Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:06pm

Turn based is too slow and boring imo

I need more action and faster combat

WolfEisberg Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:09pm

Yup I am hoping for Turn based as well, otherwise I won't be buying it. So either turn based game, or have it as an option like how it is done in Pillars of Eternity 2 where you can have both either Turn Based or RTWP.

In my old age I no longer find RTWP fun anymore, so really hoping they have Turn based as at least an option.

Randy Marsh has Baldur's Gate 3

Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:17pm

maybe an option to choose would be nice eh?

WolfEisberg Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:19pm

Originally posted by Randy Marsh:
maybe an option to choose would be nice eh?

Yeah, as long as the game has Turn based, either as the only option or as one of the options, then all is good for me.

TrueWarlord真の武 has Baldur's Gate 3

Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:23pm

Originally posted by Randy Marsh:
maybe an option to choose would be nice eh?

Good for me bro, I would very much support this idea. I just can't see myself playing it if it's RTwP only, reasons stated in the post.

Rhawkas

Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:24pm

Hoping for something like what Divinity: Original Sin (or X-Com 2) has. For staying faithful to D&D's mechanics it just works better.

Gon Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:26pm

The first two were RTwP, but Larian make turn-based RPG's, so... Who knows.

Disabled Velociraptor has Baldur's Gate 3

Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:31pm

Turn based has never ever ever been Baldurs Gate, Icewind Dale, Neverwinter nights. None of these games in the Forgotten Realms have ever been turned based. If it's an option, I understand, though I will never buy the game if it's just turn based. That's not what I grew up with.

WolfEisberg Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:32pm

Lets be honest here, Turn based has been bigger sellers than RTWP have been for some years now.

Pathfinder is between 200k to 500k sales
Pillars of Eternity is between 1 million to 2 million
Pillars of eternity 2 is between 200k to 500k
Divinity Original Sin is between 1 million to 2 million
Divinity original sin 2 is between 2 million and 5 million

I think it would be very smart of them to have RTWP and Turn based as options, they'll grab both kinds of players.

Coldhands Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:36pm

I wouldn't mind the option, but it's Baldur's Gate 3; if it can only be one or the other, it has to be Real Time.
If you're going to use the name, you should stick to the established genre.

#10

mm.324 Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:43pm

I'm for turn-based or they can have both and let the player choose.

#11

TrueWarlord真の武 has Baldur's Gate 3

Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:45pm

Originally posted by Coldhands:
I wouldn't mind the option, but it's Baldur's Gate 3; if it can only be one or the other, it has to be Real Time.
If you're going to use the name, you should stick to the established genre.

Guess if they wanted stuff to stay how it was, they would stick with the same DEVs.
Now, if you look at it, there must be a reason to choose Larian. DoS2 is the bestseller new cRPG, and honestly, the best one around.

As the person above you stated, just look at recent sales.

I played all the RTwP D&D games of the past, enjoyd it in the past. But it simple does not work for me anymore. Pathfinder Kingmaker was the last RTwP game i brough, will not buy any of it anymore.

I'm very convinced that if the turn-based crowd STOP buying RTwP games (for the ones that actually care about it) these games will never be successful.

Last edited by TrueWarlord真の武; Jun 6, 2019 @ 3:46pm

#12

Cheese Jun 6, 2019 @ 4:00pm

No thanks. Turn based < real time with pause.

#13

Coldhands Jun 6, 2019 @ 4:23pm

Originally posted by TrueWarlord真の武:
Originally posted by Coldhands:
I wouldn't mind the option, but it's Baldur's Gate 3; if it can only be one or the other, it has to be Real Time.
If you're going to use the name, you should stick to the established genre.

Guess if they wanted stuff to stay how it was, they would stick with the same DEVs.
Now, if you look at it, there must be a reason to choose Larian. DoS2 is the bestseller new cRPG, and honestly, the best one around.

As the person above you stated, just look at recent sales.

I played all the RTwP D&D games of the past, enjoyd it in the past. But it simple does not work for me anymore. Pathfinder Kingmaker was the last RTwP game i brough, will not buy any of it anymore.

I'm very convinced that if the turn-based crowd STOP buying RTwP games (for the ones that actually care about it) these games will never be successful.

I don't think turn based is any better or worse than real time, and I'm not going to complain if BG3 is turn based only, but I think you'll end up with a whole lot of upset Baldur's Gate fans if you make Baldur's Gate 3, after all these years, and it isn't real time with pause. I mean, why use the name now, if not to court the fans of the original IE games? It not like the BG name carries any weight with anybody else after 20 years.

Plus, Larian's made more real time games than turn based, DOS is just their biggest success so far.

I still think, if they're using the BG name, the game needs to be real time, with or without the option for turn based.

#14