A better Merc tier list

[raeven]

This list is based off a formula I created. The value of certain signature perks is taken into account, but price is not. Therefore the high tiers will unsurprisingly be dominated by more expensive mercs, because they are better.

I've eliminated mercs that are too slow or too stupid from consideration.

I've added their 'class' (my own devising) to the merc name as well.

S tier:
Gus - Mech / Demo / Doctor / Sniper / Leader
Reaper - Sniper / Scout
Scully - Leader / Demo / Sniper
Magic - Sniper / Scout / Mech
Shadow - Sniper / Scout
Ivan - Gunner / Sniper

A Tier:
Thor - Doctor / Scout
Wolf - Mech

B Tier:
Sidney - Sniper
Vicki - Mech
Barry - Demo
Dr. Q - Doctor
Blood - Scout
Scope
Ice - Gunner

C Tier:
Raider - Leader
Meltdown - Gunner
Igor
Fox - Doctor
Raven - Gunner / Sniper

D Tier:
Livewire - Mech
Grunty
Buns
Mouse - Scout

Everyone else is F tier.

Edit: after looking over the other thread, I bumped up the value of fox's perk which put her in a higher tier. Also tweaked a few other perk values which altered the ranking within tiers.
Edit 2: After consideration, I've added Gus. Len and Fauda are still out though.

[raeven]

Um

Q and Thor are the best medics in the game, dude. 🤣

[buchecker]

The formula not accounting for synergies and wasted points(which admitedly would be very hard), makes it borderline useless. What you have here is almost a tier list if you were to play with a single merc (in which case leadership is valued way too low).

Escrito originalmente por raeven:

Um

Q and Thor are the best medics in the game, dude. 🤣

Because of your formula or actual performance in the campaign?

You come across like you found some magic formula that can compress all the subtlety into a single number and everybody that cant see it is an idiot.

[raeven]

Escrito originalmente por buchecker:

The formula not accounting for synergies and wasted points(which admitedly would be very hard), makes it borderline useless. What you have here is almost a tier list if you were to play with a single merc (in which case leadership is valued way too low).

Escrito originalmente por raeven:

Um

Q and Thor are the best medics in the game, dude. 🤣

Because of your formula or actual performance in the campaign?

You come across like you found some magic formula that can compress all the subtlety into a single number and everybody that cant see it is an idiot.

I changed the ranking to reflect leadership better and abandoned the idea of a fully mathematical formula.

Jeez dude, I'm not trying to act like this is magic, I'm realizing it's not and trying to adjust based on what people have said. There's no need to be an ass, I haven't been rude to anyone.

I haven't used Thor yet but I'm using Q and Fox extensively. I think it is pretty obvious to almost all players that Q and Thor are the best medics in the game, it's not exactly a controversial point of view.

[raeven]

Honestly I hadn't planned on showing any of this to anyone, I didn't want to deal with people getting offended by it. It was only when someone posted a tier list that was obviously completely off base that I decided to share what I had been working on. I'm grateful to some degree for doing so because it caused me to reevaluate some of my decisions and change the rankings a bit, but the flak people dump on you just for sharing a point of view is pretty ♥♥♥♥♥♥. Like I said, make your own.

[Der Kage]

lifewire is A tier or even s tier, only thing she needs is learn how to aim and her high wisdom makes this easy. her wallhack is just to broken + she has 50 med so can be your doc until you have a real one

[lx]

you need to wear a flak vest these days. come prepared next time.

one thing though, these days there is a lot of heat about objective and subjective, so what do you think, about the title of this topic? you said it yourself, that your "work" was flawed.

[raeven]

Escrito originalmente por lx:

you need to wear a flak vest these days. come prepared next time.

one thing though, these days there is a lot of heat about objective and subjective, so what do you think, about the title of this topic? you said it yourself, that your "work" was flawed.

I said it's a better tier list, and I was right.

[RasaNova]

Escrito originalmente por raeven:

Honestly I hadn't planned on showing any of this to anyone, I didn't want to deal with people getting offended by it. It was only when someone posted a tier list that was obviously completely off base that I decided to share what I had been working on. I'm grateful to some degree for doing so because it caused me to reevaluate some of my decisions and change the rankings a bit, but the flak people dump on you just for sharing a point of view is pretty ♥♥♥♥♥♥. Like I said, make your own.

Don't let the criticisms and know-it-alls (like me) get you down. I'm glad you shared it, even if I think it's fundamentally flawed.

Doesn't even matter that people don't agree, we're taking about it, and that's a good thing. We're getting different perspectives, and seeing how others rate mercs and their abilities. I personally love this stuff.

[mr_oluap]

Escrito originalmente por raeven:

Honestly I hadn't planned on showing any of this to anyone, I didn't want to deal with people getting offended by it. It was only when someone posted a tier list that was obviously completely off base that I decided to share what I had been working on. I'm grateful to some degree for doing so because it caused me to reevaluate some of my decisions and change the rankings a bit, but the flak people dump on you just for sharing a point of view is pretty ♥♥♥♥♥♥. Like I said, make your own.

It's always like this with sort of discussion, i think your way is interesting !

Personnaly i don't really care with tier list in this game, i just hire who i need when i need them, and mostly based on personal preferences :)

[chrismyco]

this might be worst tier list for this game i have seen so far. the other way better and far more useful for something who is going to start playing the game.

[Keyboard Cowboy]

IMHO a lot the "recruit" mercs are the best statwise, since you are able to basically mold (with perks and such) them to your liking during the span of the game.

[FatalException]

Escrito originalmente por raeven:

Honestly I hadn't planned on showing any of this to anyone, I didn't want to deal with people getting offended by it. It was only when someone posted a tier list that was obviously completely off base that I decided to share what I had been working on. I'm grateful to some degree for doing so because it caused me to reevaluate some of my decisions and change the rankings a bit, but the flak people dump on you just for sharing a point of view is pretty ♥♥♥♥♥♥. Like I said, make your own.

I think you can safely ignore anyone who doesn't make an effort to add to the discussion.

And I too think it's really interesting to see all the different (and flawed) perspectives. I've learned a lot about the design of this game by both critizising and being critizised.

People like dorok and Rhapsody tend to be a bit... overbearing, but in the end we're all just passionate about a pretty damn good game.

So, tell us why we are wrong an you are right. You won't convince us and we won't convince you (most of the time anyway), but we'll all learn more from standing our ground and having our positions examined.

[RasaNova]

Escrito originalmente por FatalException:

Escrito originalmente por raeven:

Honestly I hadn't planned on showing any of this to anyone, I didn't want to deal with people getting offended by it. It was only when someone posted a tier list that was obviously completely off base that I decided to share what I had been working on. I'm grateful to some degree for doing so because it caused me to reevaluate some of my decisions and change the rankings a bit, but the flak people dump on you just for sharing a point of view is pretty ♥♥♥♥♥♥. Like I said, make your own.

I think you can safely ignore anyone who doesn't make an effort to add to the discussion.

And I too think it's really interesting to see all the different (and flawed) perspectives. I've learned a lot about the design of this game by both critizising and being critizised.

People like dorok and Rhapsody tend to be a bit... overbearing, but in the end we're all just passionate about a pretty damn good game.

So, tell us why we are wrong an you are right. You won't convince us and we won't convince you (most of the time anyway), but we'll all learn more from standing our ground and having our positions examined.

Yeah I think that's what I was trying to say in my last reply, but you said it better.

In the end, you can ask 10 gamers what determines the best merc and get 10 different answers. But many of those answers are very interesting, and whether or not I agree I am gaining insights from the discussion which make me a better player.

[Dorok]

Escrito originalmente por RasaNova:

you can ask 10 gamers what determines the best merc and get 10 different answers.

The problem is there's no answer appart if you play solo with only one merc:
- It's a team.
- It's even multi teams.
- There isn't one way to play, nor one tactic, nor one strategy.
- The core of the system is to hire merc not hire and keep them up to end game.
- You can't really compare rocks and tomatoes, that is Medic and Mech for example.
- It depends of the point reach in the play.
- More.

Those lists are too general and have no good answer. Even if you stick to ignore anything but combats.

[HozzMidnight]

I have played on all three difficulties and tried almost every merc. On day 1, Fox is a better hire than either Q or Thor. She's cheaper and her perk is insanely good, she is the best dex trainer in the game and if you just keep her in the squad from day 1 she organically becomes a very good combat merc, fairly quickly if you gear her appropriately.