What did you do to armor????

[Sogreth]

That Stamina reduction doesn't quite seem worth it.

Was heavier armor even that good? I always aimed for Hidden Plates and Survival.

[Fennrir42]

Heavy Armor is now basically the worst. I find I am keeping Superior Light on at least one hero (the one I want to play the most damage cards) until I reach the 3rd Street, when I can pick up something like Hidden Plates or Survivalist's etc.

[Sogreth]

Originally posted by Fennrir42:

Heavy Armor is now basically the worst. I find I am keeping Superior Light on at least one hero (the one I want to play the most damage cards) until I reach the 3rd Street, when I can pick up something like Hidden Plates or Survivalist's etc.

I didn't realize they nerfed Hidden Plates too, it has the same stamina reduction that heavy armor has now. Survival didn't change, and now we have Steadfast armor now though (+8 armor every turn). I have my two characters with Steadfast and Bastion. 23 armor and 1 Stamina each turn.

Screw heavy armor now lol.

[holy-death]

Heavy armor was the best flat armor in the game, because it gave you the most armor at no extra cost.

It can be still be worthwhile to use, if you level up your Stamina first, but with 2 Stamina cost I think they need to increase the base armor value to at least 30.

[Wrenny]

Heavy Armor is more suited to basic tank builds.
They won't do much but they won't die immediately in the beginning.
Though that exhaustion kinda sucks.

If Heavy Armor was like 80 instead that would be cool.

[Warhydra]

It's always annoying to see recruits show up with heavy armor and cant use any of their cards...

[Fennrir42]

Originally posted by Warhydra:

It's always annoying to see recruits show up with heavy armor and cant use any of their cards...

THIS.

I understand that there isn't time to switch armor between every battle, but if you have time to find more Blackfoots in the tavern, couldn't you maybe trade armor then?

The number of unviable recruits is making it much harder to get to 6 heroes. For some with talents and passives that really synergize, I will carry their deadweight for a few battles. But I find I am passing on recruits pretty often, despite enjoying a big party.

[Sogreth]

Originally posted by holy-death:

Heavy armor was the best flat armor in the game, because it gave you the most armor at no extra cost.

Are you sure about that? Wasn't the heaviest armor like 38 or something?

Hidden Plates starts you off with 40, and gives you 40 everytime you have no armor left. And with no downside (well, it does have a downside now).

[holy-death]

Originally posted by Sogreth:

Originally posted by holy-death:

Heavy armor was the best flat armor in the game, because it gave you the most armor at no extra cost.

Are you sure about that? Wasn't the heaviest armor like 38 or something?

Hidden Plates starts you off with 40, and gives you 40 everytime you have no armor left. And with no downside (well, it does have a downside now).

I said "the best FLAT armor in the game". Light and medium armors only gave you less armor back then, so there was no contest. This is why the armors were rebalanced (and more unique armors became a bit more popular, before that they were really, really rare. At least in my experience).

[Sogreth]

Originally posted by holy-death:

I said "the best FLAT armor in the game". Light and medium armors only gave you less armor back then, so there was no contest. This is why the armors were rebalanced (and more unique armors became a bit more popular, before that they were really, really rare. At least in my experience).

And I'm totally okay with some rebalancing. But they should rebalance what's actually NEEDED. Hidden Plates having a stamina debuff? 100% agree. It had very high armor with no downside. It beat out every single basic armor piece, no contest. Even giving Hidden Plates a base armor of 5 and keeping the effect it had would have been a decent enough nerf to it.

Light armor now is actually really decent. Combine a leather wearer with Bastion and they will be beastly. I won't even go passed Medium armor now, since Superior Med. starts the stamina debuff, and it just gets worse the higher you go.

Unless they buff heavy armor to give a HUGE amount of starting armor, or add some other type of effect that could reduce damage, give bolster or something, heavy won't be worth using for any build. Especially now that we seem to run into more unique armors early on like Steadfast.

[holy-death]

Originally posted by Sogreth:

Light armor now is actually really decent. Combine a leather wearer with Bastion and they will be beastly. I won't even go passed Medium armor now, since Superior Med. starts the stamina debuff, and it just gets worse the higher you go.

Superior Medium is actually pretty good, because it's just 1 Stamina for 24 armor.

I agree on Medium armor being worse than Superior Light (the one that gives you +1 Stamina and 10 armor), because 14 armor is not that great.

I will consider using heavy armor, but not until I have 2 or 3 Stamina left to use after wearing it (which depends a lot on what weapons and cards I have) and not if I will have better options on the table.

But yes, with these changes some balancing to Medium and Heavy armors is needed.

[Loviatar]

I am hard pressed to think of any situation where superior medium or heavy armour is not the worst choice. I can see that it was an effort to make it worthwhile to consider anything other than the superior heavy before the update. But the increase over the regular armours in no way is worth a permanent -1/-2 stamina for the entire fight. Once you're on the second street, you're looking at an increase in armour that absorbs one, perhaps two hits.

With Light armour being buffed, I fail to see why Medium isn't the 'base' armour ...just straight armour, no benefit or negative. Heavy could perhaps sit at a -1 stamina malus. The base armours are just that, base; they're meant to be upgraded asap.

Otherwise, superior heavy needs a boost to make it even a consideration,perhaps add retaliation to it. Or at the very least make it so stamina debuff expires at the end of the round, rather than the start, so there's at least some interaction with things like Cornered.

[Sogreth]

Originally posted by Loviatar:

I am hard pressed to think of any situation where superior medium or heavy armour is not the worst choice. I can see that it was an effort to make it worthwhile to consider anything other than the superior heavy before the update. But the increase over the regular armours in no way is worth a permanent -1/-2 stamina for the entire fight. Once you're on the second street, you're looking at an increase in armour that absorbs one, perhaps two hits.

With Light armour being buffed, I fail to see why Medium isn't the 'base' armour ...just straight armour, no benefit or negative. Heavy could perhaps sit at a -1 stamina malus. The base armours are just that, base; they're meant to be upgraded asap.

Otherwise, superior heavy needs a boost to make it even a consideration,perhaps add retaliation to it. Or at the very least make it so stamina debuff expires at the end of the round, rather than the start, so there's at least some interaction with things like Cornered.

Would be cool to have some type of damage reduction to heavy armor, instead of just a flat amount. Like reducing the damage from each attack by 2-3, to a minimum of 1. Or something along those lines. As you said, have Medium as the "base" armor, while Light and Heavy give you other bonuses aside from flat armor.

[Wrenny]

My Proposed Idea for Armor:
Light (+1 Stamina) (15 armor)
Medium (Stamina is unchanged) (25 armor)
Heavy (-1 Stamina) (50 armor)
Hidden Plates (0 armor) (Always has 1 stack of brace)
Survivalist (0 armor) (Gain 3 armor and 3 vitality every start of your turn)
Soldier (15 armor) (Any damage above 50 is converted into armor, death comes first however)
Rogue (10 armor) (+1 Stamina every time the wearer uses a weapon card or is moved)
Templar (30 armor) (Gain +1 will when a enemy dies)
Journeyman (0 armor) (Gain 3 armor for every card played on your turn)
Talbard (20 armor) (Allies in rank gain 5 armor every time the wearer hits someone)
Gambeson (10 armor) (When being hit with a multi attack, the hits after the first only do 1 damage)

[Meeky]

My take on armor is simple:

If you only have 1-2 heroes, then light armor / medium armor tiers are good.
If you have 3+ heroes, heavy armor starts to look really, really attractive.
If you have characters who cancel out +Winded or take advantage of it, Heavy Armor is more attractive.

There's some benefits to playing with different armor types. If you want to use Heavy Armor, try a composition that has more than 2 heroes and you'll notice that having the stamina spread across your heroes helps a lot.

I found 4 heroes was a good number for a team composition that leaned into heavy armor a lot (one hero with Bastion, 3 others sitting in the rear).

[Sogreth]

Originally posted by Meeky:

My take on armor is simple:

If you only have 1-2 heroes, then light armor / medium armor tiers are good.
If you have 3+ heroes, heavy armor starts to look really, really attractive.
If you have characters who cancel out +Winded or take advantage of it, Heavy Armor is more attractive.

There's some benefits to playing with different armor types. If you want to use Heavy Armor, try a composition that has more than 2 heroes and you'll notice that having the stamina spread across your heroes helps a lot.

I found 4 heroes was a good number for a team composition that leaned into heavy armor a lot (one hero with Bastion, 3 others sitting in the rear).

If I was using 3+ heroes, I would still ignore heavy armor, and go for Light/Med. Or get Steadfast (+8 armor each turn)

And it's even more frustrating when you go pick up a new recruit and he's got heavy armor on, and he can't even do anything until you change his armor/level him up.