Panzer Corps 2 vs. Order of Battle? Which is better at it's core?

[merkava808]

Hi! I grew up on the original Panzer Corps games and loved them. I now own many of the Order of Battle campaigns, as well as Panzer Corps 2. Could someone more experienced than me write which they prefer and why? I am more interested in which one has the better core engine/game design--as individual campaigns can be bought at user discretion, so I'm more interested in which has the more optimal engine/design to throw my eggs in that basket. Thank you so much in advance!

[Eva]

Well you will certainly get people who have an opinion on how one is better than the other. I have read people that think Order of Battle is in some ways more realistic.

I don't care. I tried Order of Battle, and no matter how realistic (or not) it is, it just didn't click with me. I didn't care for it as a game. Perhaps (probably) I didn't give it a fair chance. Enough people play it and enjoy it there has to be a good game lurking in there somewhere.

On the other hand, I do like Panzer Corps 2 as a game. I could go on probably much of the day about how this or that aspect of Panzer Corps 2 is wrong or oversimplified. But I like it, as a game.

[Evil Carlonis]

Originally posted by Eva:

Well you will certainly get people who have an opinion on how one is better than the other. I have read people that think Order of Battle is in some ways more realistic.

I don't care. I tried Order of Battle, and no matter how realistic (or not) it is, it just didn't click with me. I didn't care for it as a game. Perhaps (probably) I didn't give it a fair chance. Enough people play it and enjoy it there has to be a good game lurking in there somewhere.

On the other hand, I do like Panzer Corps 2 as a game. I could go on probably much of the day about how this or that aspect of Panzer Corps 2 is wrong or oversimplified. But I like it, as a game.

Same with me I played all campaigns in order of battle but don't ring my bell, on the other hand I liked Pz2 much more I don't know maybe the nostalgia from Pz2 that reminded me panzer general and ssi serie of games.

[FOTUS (Felon of the U.S)]

PZ2 is far and away better. The graphics are much better. Some claim that doesn't matter and I agree in this genre they are less important than others, but seeing highly detailed models blow the crap out of each other versus something that looks much is worse, is going to be a much better experience.

I've played through 4 or 5 campaigns in Order of Battle and while I think the game does a very good job with the Naval battles where supply isn't much of an issue, I believe it suffers in the land battles. On land battles you can't move a unit 2 hexes without running into an enemy unit and getting ambushed. It gets pretty predictable that an enemy unit is going to be on EVERY city hex.

Another very annoying aspect , is the way it calculates battle losses and lies to you in it's battle estimate. The game essentially expects you to flank and surround every unit you attack. If you don't, the battle outcome will always be far less and the enemy will run away. I had a Tiger II go up against a Sherman or some lesser tank with an outcome of 8:1 (I do 8 kills, they do 1). The outcome ended up being that I killed 2 units and he inflicted no damage and then runs away. So I have to spend several turns taking my slow heavy units, which should have the advantage to chase down their weaker units. Doesn't make for a fun experience. And in the end the game's own data become unreliable in certain situations like this.

The WORST offender by far however, is that a single stupid fast unit can run behind your lines and break your supply. It's udder ridiculous to think that a single tank or a scout car can run up behind your entire army and all of a sudden no supplies can make it to them. I absolutely hate that aspect of the game and it's the main reason why I can't go back to it after Playing Panzer Corps 2.

[oddball]

Originally posted by h4rry^ - merkava:

Hi! I grew up on the original Panzer Corps games and loved them. I now own many of the Order of Battle campaigns, as well as Panzer Corps 2. Could someone more experienced than me write which they prefer and why? I am more interested in which one has the better core engine/game design--as individual campaigns can be bought at user discretion, so I'm more interested in which has the more optimal engine/design to throw my eggs in that basket. Thank you so much in advance!

If you want variety of content OOB has you covered in spades. Pacific (playable from both sides), Burma and Marine campaigns? Yes. Western, Soviet and Nazi campaigns? Yes. Finland Campaign? Yes. Japanese Invasion of China campaign? Yes.

If you just want to play as the Nazis and only the Nazis Panzer Corps 2 is probably a better option as it covers every single time a Nazi scratched their ass in WW2.

Combat system wise OOB is tops IMO as the hero system makes Panzer Corps 2 pretty miserable and I don't care for hordes of fantasy units duking it out. I also hate having to push the "put in reserve" button for units I don't want to use in a scenario. OOB just lets me not deploy those units without additional fiddling. Encirclement in OOB is based around a visible front line while in PzC2 it's mostly guesswork and I've reverted to just surrounding units on all sides as in PzC1 (imo still the better game). Artillery in OOB works like artillery. You fire it on your turn from concealment at long distances. Arty in PzC2 fires from fairly short ranges and interacts weirdly with other units, often replacing them (your 155mm do everything guns).

Graphics wise whatever, I don't really care for the more plastic look of 3D as implemented in PzC2 but that's mostly a visual design thing.

[(🍰🍰🍰) Man_Who_Eats_Your]

I like both. I meybe like OoB more. Its more smallball and slower. One action dont have so big inpact. Panzer corps is more hurry many times you have to do bad decisions becouse you dont have time and luck have big impact in game. OoB is more relaxing in PZ you have to thinking in every movie.

[Boredflak]

Originally posted by Kaz:

Panzer corps is more hurry many times you have to do bad decisions becouse you dont have time.

There are ways around the turn limits. But they will impact achievements, Use the chaet code:
setany round #

# is the turn number you want it to set current turn. This code can be used as many times as you like,

[oldman23]

You have to have great eyes for OoB the text is tiny.

[FOTUS (Felon of the U.S)]

Originally posted by Kaz:

I like both. I meybe like OoB more. Its more smallball and slower. One action dont have so big inpact. Panzer corps is more hurry many times you have to do bad decisions becouse you dont have time and luck have big impact in game. OoB is more relaxing in PZ you have to thinking in every movie.

My experience is the exact opposite. As I mentioned in my previous post about needing to chase down units with 3-4 battles if you don't completely flank them, which causes the turn limit in OoB to be even more restrictive.

[skifbebro]

Originally posted by oldman23:

You have to have great eyes for OoB the text is tiny.

I agree the GUI is a big plus for PzC2 vs. OOB. There it shows that OOB is ca. 5 years older.

Another advantage of PzC is how fast/fluid it plays (AI turns) in "normal" map sizes.

PzC has a huge variety in ground units. In naval units OOB has more, but then PzC is geared less towards naval to begin with.

Content-wise OOB still offers more variety, but this may change over time with more PzC stuff.

Modding-wise OOB allows an easier entry, as the editor is quite powerful. If you're a LUA wizard otoh PzC2 opens up more possibilities, but it's tougher to get into this.

[oldman23]

I like your game but it puts to much strain on my old eyes

[Droogan]

It has been a while since I played OOB but my take was it was too slow. Literally having to grind to hit 1 point here and 1 point there. Have a massive advantage over a random infantry unit out in the open? Well you going to have to shoot at it 47 times to destroy it.

I like the variety of campaigns, but onesy, twosy, for eternity to resolve any action makes it tedious. Also, I fall firmly in the camp of hating resource management so the supply system makes the slow play even worse. Imo PC2 removes most of the tedium, which may be a pro or con depending on your nature.

I'm still baffled at people who don't like heroes in PC2. Not only does it make the gameplay more unique and exciting, you literally don't have to use them. Like not at all and your weird little complaint is solved. It's like if something exists people are compelled to use it, even if they hate it. Super strange to me. More choices = better (always).