the alt-history campaign final

[Lord Morblan]

SPOILERS AHEAD


devs, your vision of another possibilities during the campaign was incredible, but i don't understand why you didn't even mention the nazi party. Why after Hitler's death there is no any nazi resistance towards military coup? Moreover, there is nazi oficials in the Rommel government(Spear, for example), but they didn't even mentioned.. it is quite a naive that people really may choose their leader in totalitarian state where party rules everything :) If you have any more plans for further content for Germany please pay attention to that matter because without it the entire story feels just like a story-tale

[Metal Izanagi]

Originally posted by Lord Morblan:

SPOILERS AHEAD


devs, your vision of another possibilities during the campaign was incredible, but i don't understand why you didn't even mention the nazi party. Why after Hitler's death there is no any nazi resistance towards military coup? Moreover, there is nazi oficials in the Rommel government(Spear, for example), but they didn't even mentioned.. it is quite a naive that people really may choose their leader in totalitarian state where party rules everything :) If you have any more plans for further content for Germany please pay attention to that matter because without it the entire story feels just like a story-tale

Any sort of alternate history where Germany does well in the war is by necessity a fairy-tale scenario because the reality is that Germany had no chance.

[RobOda]

Originally posted by Metal Izanagi:

Originally posted by Lord Morblan:

SPOILERS AHEAD


devs, your vision of another possibilities during the campaign was incredible, but i don't understand why you didn't even mention the nazi party. Why after Hitler's death there is no any nazi resistance towards military coup? Moreover, there is nazi oficials in the Rommel government(Spear, for example), but they didn't even mentioned.. it is quite a naive that people really may choose their leader in totalitarian state where party rules everything :) If you have any more plans for further content for Germany please pay attention to that matter because without it the entire story feels just like a story-tale

Any sort of alternate history where Germany does well in the war is by necessity a fairy-tale scenario because the reality is that Germany had no chance.

I don't think there's any argument that's it's fantasy, but it has to be grounded in some reality.

The removal of Hitler should come with some serious repercussions in the country, especially from the Nazi elements, you don't just 'magic' it out of existence or pretend they're now a little bit of a conservative government the moment the leader is felled.

There were a lot more zealots waiting in the wings, never mind the hanger ons that would have tried to make a play for power.

[Lord Morblan]

Originally posted by Metal Izanagi:

Originally posted by Lord Morblan:

SPOILERS AHEAD


devs, your vision of another possibilities during the campaign was incredible, but i don't understand why you didn't even mention the nazi party. Why after Hitler's death there is no any nazi resistance towards military coup? Moreover, there is nazi oficials in the Rommel government(Spear, for example), but they didn't even mentioned.. it is quite a naive that people really may choose their leader in totalitarian state where party rules everything :) If you have any more plans for further content for Germany please pay attention to that matter because without it the entire story feels just like a story-tale

Any sort of alternate history where Germany does well in the war is by necessity a fairy-tale scenario because the reality is that Germany had no chance.

Well, you are right, but we are talking about the grounded scenario with serious history work, because many options provided by developers were quite reasonable and make nazi just disappear destroys spirit of realism. They even mentioned Himler and SS but they just do nothing? :)
SS is a special army devoted to the nazi party, they would never agree on Rommel's government. I think they would prefer kill him just after his 'suprise" appearance because of his connections with german resistance

[Valks]

SS even at its peak (largely mass unwilling conscripts following July plot and AH's loss of trust in WH) could never stand up to the Wehrmacht/OKW. Not by manpower, not by logistics, not by any other means bar a riot or a coup attempt at a given city.

With the modern politicial correctness BS I do not expect the team to tackle in depth the holocaust or hyperfocus on that aspect of the war - it could only bring harm to the game or get some justice warrior on a ban campaign. Even now you can find threads calling this game 'Nazi' because you play as *germans* or a fully fledged regular WH units in a game called 'Panzer Corps'. At least OoB doesn't get called out for being Communist or favorable to Imperial Japan if you play the Soviet/IJA(N) campaign..

I enjoy the alt-fiction of AH succumbing to his July plot wounds, drugs abuse and deteriorating health from leading the war. And by repeatedly making miracles happen to 'win' the war in the east figures such as ER/Manstein would surpass Himmler in any sense of political respect and goodwill. Goering was deposed and Kesselring carries respect on his own, Speer would have no issues with the new leadership, neither would the other likes of Ribbentrop etc. The direction taken is one of far more grounded alt-fics for WW2 without Germany magically steamrolling UK/US as it was forced due to shorter scenario length of the vanilla campaing.

Any further attempt on ER's life by the SS would result in purging of the SS. Do not forget they and Gestapo were not liked in nazi germany - they were largely feared and ruled through terror and the people would enjoy seeing it disappear.

For flavor sake and considering what the game is and the complete fiction throwing together famous generals and names (Rommel, Guderian, Manstein, Kesselring, Model...) makes sense and keeps the briefings fun.

[Complex Strategy]

Originally posted by Valks:

SS even at its peak (largely mass unwilling conscripts following July plot and AH's loss of trust in WH) could never stand up to the Wehrmacht/OKW. Not by manpower, not by logistics, not by any other means bar a riot or a coup attempt at a given city.

With the modern politicial correctness BS I do not expect the team to tackle in depth the holocaust or hyperfocus on that aspect of the war - it could only bring harm to the game or get some justice warrior on a ban campaign. Even now you can find threads calling this game 'Nazi' because you play as *germans* or a fully fledged regular WH units in a game called 'Panzer Corps'. At least OoB doesn't get called out for being Communist or favorable to Imperial Japan if you play the Soviet/IJA(N) campaign..

I enjoy the alt-fiction of AH succumbing to his July plot wounds, drugs abuse and deteriorating health from leading the war. And by repeatedly making miracles happen to 'win' the war in the east figures such as ER/Manstein would surpass Himmler in any sense of political respect and goodwill. Goering was deposed and Kesselring carries respect on his own, Speer would have no issues with the new leadership, neither would the other likes of Ribbentrop etc. The direction taken is one of far more grounded alt-fics for WW2 without Germany magically steamrolling UK/US as it was forced due to shorter scenario length of the vanilla campaing.

Any further attempt on ER's life by the SS would result in purging of the SS. Do not forget they and Gestapo were not liked in nazi germany - they were largely feared and ruled through terror and the people would enjoy seeing it disappear.

For flavor sake and considering what the game is and the complete fiction throwing together famous generals and names (Rommel, Guderian, Manstein, Kesselring, Model...) makes sense and keeps the briefings fun.

Personally I disagree because the campaign spends 3 entire missions setting up the story of this and to me it seems extremely weird that somehow just dealing with goering cleared the way for a bloodless coup that no one tried to overthrow. IMO there really should have been a scenario where you have to deal with some opposing force that was also trying to seize power. Even from the start of war in europe in 1939 there was tons of bickering and power struggles from those under Hitler and he intentionally fueled such rivalries to maintain power. His death should have caused a lot more chaos rather than a simple "Rommel is actually alive and becomes the leader".

I think it's one of my bigger issues with the DLC and it overall hurt the narrative. I also personally was not a fan of the way the Soviets got peaced out through faking the use of a nuclear strike by the western allies. I feel like these combined took an interesting "what if" scenario and has kinda degraded the story to jump the shark because they want to rush ending the war with the soviets so they can just do a single 1946 AO where we conquer America and the world.

[Valks]

[/quote]Personally I disagree because the campaign spends 3 entire missions setting up the story of this and to me it seems extremely weird that somehow just dealing with goering cleared the way for a bloodless coup that no one tried to overthrow. IMO there really should have been a scenario where you have to deal with some opposing force that was also trying to seize power. Even from the start of war in europe in 1939 there was tons of bickering and power struggles from those under Hitler and he intentionally fueled such rivalries to maintain power. His death should have caused a lot more chaos rather than a simple "Rommel is actually alive and becomes the leader".

I think it's one of my bigger issues with the DLC and it overall hurt the narrative. I also personally was not a fan of the way the Soviets got peaced out through faking the use of a nuclear strike by the western allies. I feel like these combined took an interesting "what if" scenario and has kinda degraded the story to jump the shark because they want to rush ending the war with the soviets so they can just do a single 1946 AO where we conquer America and the world. [/quote]

I'm afraid you're expecting a bit much in terms of 'flavor' or story depth from what PC2 is at its core as a strategy game. It's a choice they took and it leads to some interesting options for '46 - as for the nuances of politics, power-struggles, homefront dealings... we can have that if there ever is a WW2 themed Mass Effect game :)

We won't know what '46 will be until it's out, and who knows you might get a chance to slug it out with SS diehards yet.