Optimal way to play?

[Packy]

I understand that the game is very RNG but I feel like the game doesn't give you enough of anything.
I was under the impression that the more you play the more you get strong but I don't think that's the case.
I tried doing different approaches like stacking terrors or focusing on skills or gathering souls for the grim reaper but the benefits of each are barely enough, sure it helps but there's a huge power spike at around Chapters 4-5 where enemies start to hit for 30-40+ multi-hits -- in which case Taunt and Protection will barely do anything for you. AOE attacks are also a bit OP imo, there's no real way to protect yourself from them. Relics are behind OP elites (I'm looking at you twin sisters) and the relics themselves aren't even that helpful.

While I do enjoy the game aesthetically and as a roguelite, I feel like balancing is definitely an issue here.

[HeliosAFlame]

Hi hi. Not an expert, but played 4 runs and won 3, lost run was my first run because I didn't understand how damage worked and got 1 shot by a normal encounter :(

quick guide:
General rules:
Damage is king. By chapters 4 or 5 you want to be able to 1 shot at least 1 enemy each round so that you can kill whatever is doing a bs attack. Other utility is nice. Exhaust, lowering enemies attack, but they are plan B not plan A.

To get this damage you need to do things more powerful than just play cards. Cards without buffs just do not have high enough numbers. When you are in events the most important stat you are looking for is +damage for a character, even if they have terrible social stats for the encounter if you can use their damage buff, get it.
Treasures that give damage buffs are good, for example 'for each 40 souls you have, your disciples have +1 damage' can win a run on its own, giving +1 or +2 in the early/mid game then suddenly giving you +8 or more as you near the boss and no longer has as many things you want to buy.

Multiplication is also strong. Vlad vulnerability, mary mirror. These are the simplest default strategies. Get a way to reliably turn on something that doubles the value of every card you play, then give that character 7 cards and all of the card upgrades.

Energy. You need some way to break the default mana curve, 5 mana per turn and full price for cards is simply not good enough.
Headless horseman gets a card that deals damage to himself to gain mana next turn. It is insane, giving you extra economy and triggering his passive. Treasures that give you free action refreshes, bonus mana, cheaper cards. All of them are really strong and very high priority.

Choose carefully on what cards to upgrade. If you have a 2 cost card that does 8 damage and gives exhaustion, then giving it +4 damage from an upgrade is almost pointless. The value of the card is the exhaust and that did not change.

Generally speaking you want to upgrade your primary damage cards or cards which have upgraded utility as they level up.
Rough upgrade order: Your best damage cards > cards that become cheaper > cards that inflict more status's.

That is how you deal enough damage to burst your way through late game fights in the first few turns. energy + additive damage increases + multiplicative damage increases. All of them scale off each other and multiplicatively raise your power level.

Once you have strong damage gold rarity cards you do not get much value from picking up mid rarity damage options, because it will be more efficient to just refresh your character and use the gold cards again.
Once your main damage is set up you should start looking for utility cards to cover problematic situations. Exhaust or flat damage reduction are great. Debuff and buff removal. At least one card that can deal damage of both sp and hp so you do not instantly lose the run to fanatic. Anything that looks fancy to round out your weaknesses.

More specific advice:
In standard fights the most important thing early game is terror and the least important thing is cards. Paper rarity cards are mostly useless late game (notable exceptions for some utility cards like give an enemy exhaust). If you end up getting paper rarity cards you should focus on trying to triple them rather than ending up with multiple different weak low tier cards.

Higher terror increases how many mid rarity cards you are offered. You don't really want to draft cards at all until you are at least terror level 2, but if you can get terror level 3 before spending time drafting that is even better.

Battle elites. If you are fine early game then you are dying from lack of scaling late game, fighting elites and getting relics for one node is a great way of leveraging early power into later game advantage.

Reminder for events. THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IS TO PICK UP ADDITIVE DAMAGE ON CHARACTERS WHO CAN USE IT. Don't pick up physical damage on white lady, but other than that you should have a very good reason if you are going to pass a damage increase from an event. Special case, headless horseman. He might not want to pick up damage increases, because it increases how much self damage he does with his best card.

When shopping try to always use the 20 soul upgrade a card. It is super efficient if you can survive till you get the card back.


General early game priority for nodes
elite > shop if you have high money > event/normal battle > sacrifice alter > shop with low money > heal shrine


Hope this helps!

[Samseng Yik]

This guy sum it up.
What he telling here is exactly how I play the game.
I am however a tactical strategist from many other games such as Monster Train, Into The Breach, Last Spell, Darkest Dungeon, STS, Chrono Ark, Pathfinder.
I also a loser in first book due to first few runs without understanding much mechanic.

Appreciate him willing to write up in such detail because I definitely don't have the patience to write long.

[David]

Nowhere near as experienced but I'd hazard you should pick up a skill or two you don't want early if you don't start with any, and if you think you'll pass several altars early. If you're not going to path through altars, go for early terror as indicated.

Unlocking skill slots is helpful and you don't want to be sacrificing good cards if you can help it as you won't see them again the way the altar works. Better to sacrifice a card you don't want to see again, which will somewhat filter the card pool too.

[OG.UA SAPUTRA]

what part of this game is "very" RnG ? If anything this game is less RnG-y than other games like this, why do people hyperbole so much ?

[Samseng Yik]

Oh yes, agree there is really low RNG due to non card game nature
Way lower RNG than others

[SchweddyBalls]

Originally posted by Samseng Yik:

This guy sum it up.
What he telling here is exactly how I play the game.
I am however a tactical strategist from many other games such as Monster Train, Into The Breach, Last Spell, Darkest Dungeon, STS, Chrono Ark, Pathfinder.
I also a loser in first book due to first few runs without understanding much mechanic.

Appreciate him willing to write up in such detail because I definitely don't have the patience to write long.

You must be looking forward to Age of Darkness: Final Stand// having played all those other games :P

[Fortytudo]

Originally posted by Samseng Yik:

Oh yes, agree there is really low RNG due to non card game nature
Way lower RNG than others

Skills are rng, relics are rng, map is rng, events are rng, traits and character "reactions" are rng, should I continue?

I had a run with a White Lady having NO relics for her masks and NO mask skills apart from her initial one, so by the lategame she was still with 7 damage. I had to turn her into an SP dpser with multihit attacks. I felt so incredibly weak that run because RNG was not on my side at all, so yes - it IS heavily RNG dependant.

[Samseng Yik]

Originally posted by Schweddy Balls:

Originally posted by Samseng Yik:

This guy sum it up.
What he telling here is exactly how I play the game.
I am however a tactical strategist from many other games such as Monster Train, Into The Breach, Last Spell, Darkest Dungeon, STS, Chrono Ark, Pathfinder.
I also a loser in first book due to first few runs without understanding much mechanic.

Appreciate him willing to write up in such detail because I definitely don't have the patience to write long.

You must be looking forward to Age of Darkness: Final Stand// having played all those other games :P

Thanks for the recommendation.
I just aware of this game thanks to your recommendation. Added to my follow list.
If the game can pause or is turn based i am happier

[SchweddyBalls]

It does have a pause button/function. No problem! when you mentioned last spell i immediately thought of this Someone else also mentioned they are billions which is another similar game

[Samseng Yik]

Scoff at the RNG.
If this is RNG. Then Monster Train is a card game
Then you need to get the right relic.....
Then you need to get the right hero upgrade path
then you need to get the correct unit upgrade
then you need to get the correct unit card
then you need to draw the correct card on correct turn
Yet it having overwhelming good review, so customer must be crazy and masochist eh?

Not all games going to please everyone. Either self improve, or observe the game before buy.
I would say this game need some balance check and fully rework the UI

[Fortytudo]

Originally posted by Samseng Yik:

Yet it having overwhelming good review, so customer must be crazy and masochist eh?

Both are RNG as RNG is a part what makes roguelikes fun. Except when it does not. Some games handles RNG right, some wrong, and this one is on the wrong side.

Its apparent that some relics/skills/events are way better than the others, so if you dont get those during a run - you will feel underwhelming. This is what makes it bad - the difference between skills and relics. You get good skills and relics - you breeze through the run. You dont get those - you wont be able to play around them, because theyre worse than what you could get.

I already gave you an example of The White Lady relying heavily on her masks. Try building her into a DPS character without those and you will see the difference.

[Myth Alric]

Monster train has a lot more good relics than this game, where most of the relics are kind of questionable. Also mentioned above, you start out messed up mana wise so rng is a lot more punishing if you don't get things to fix it.

[OG.UA SAPUTRA]

Originally posted by Fortytudo:

Originally posted by Samseng Yik:

Yet it having overwhelming good review, so customer must be crazy and masochist eh?

Both are RNG as RNG is a part what makes roguelikes fun. Except when it does not. Some games handles RNG right, some wrong, and this one is on the wrong side.

Its apparent that some relics/skills/events are way better than the others, so if you dont get those during a run - you will feel underwhelming. This is what makes it bad - the difference between skills and relics. You get good skills and relics - you breeze through the run. You dont get those - you wont be able to play around them, because theyre worse than what you could get.

I already gave you an example of The White Lady relying heavily on her masks. Try building her into a DPS character without those and you will see the difference.

masochist ? there is a difference in learning the game and realize if this game isnt "comletely unfair" at all vs losing one and go on a tantrum

[Fortytudo]

Originally posted by OG.UA SAPUTRA:

masochist ? there is a difference in learning the game and realize if this game isnt "comletely unfair" at all vs losing one and go on a tantrum

Where did I say this game is "comletely unfair"? If you cant cope with other peoples opinions, dont comment.