why do ships not fire in full main battery salvos?

[ohthot1227]

Well, sometimes they do.
But soon enough each turret's firing cycle get out of sync and they start firing one at a time with short delays between them.
Sometimes even firing only a few of the entire main gun turrets available.

Apart from not looking cool, I think this is bad for accuracy too.
when you read the accuracy modifier stats during main gun firing, the "recoil" debuff piles up as each turret fires and you can see the 3rd~4th turret's shells just flying off to nowhere.

If the turrets all fire together, this effect of the subsequent turret suffering from the previous turrets's recoil would not happen.

So...can't we just have ships to wait a bit more until all main guns available are reloaded and fire them in a one big BOOM??
should look cool too.
Or maybe we could even have a button to select fire mode between turrets fire at will or centralized salvos.

[Lucky]

Look at the right info panel. If it doesn't have green AIMED word on it that means that you lost the target's range completely and the whole Ladder thing started from the scratch. However, if you are to achieve full lock on - you will get your full and quick broadsides.

[DropShot]

Well... technically all the guns in the same turrets don't even fire together. They fire a fraction of a second off from each other to avoid muzzle blast from the adjacent gun from throwing off the next shell. Although i do not know if that is modeled in game, i haven't really looked closely, and i'm not even sure if it would be noticeable to begin with.

I would question if it was feasible to fire all guns at the same time and how you would do it. I do not believe the guns had a Central station to fire the guns form. Certainly a the fire control mast directs all of the guns, walking them in and adjusting appropriately, but they're still fired from the crew in the turret. I suppose you could use a lighting system or radio, but you would still be relying on the human reaction speed. More likely the case, it would make it difficult to direct further fire if you had all the splashes of the guns at the same time. One turret goes high, the next goes low, one hits and you can't tell what was what?

i'm just spitballing, maybe It was common practice to fire all, i don't know with any authority.

[ohthot1227]

Originally posted by Lucky:

Look at the right info panel. If it doesn't have green AIMED word on it that means that you lost the target's range completely and the whole Ladder thing started from the scratch. However, if you are to achieve full lock on - you will get your full and quick broadsides.

Well...NO.
My 'salvos' are landing at least one shell per 'salvo'. Three times in a row, and the 'range found' bonus is like +390%.

And yet the turrets are still firing one at a time (the 4th firing one takes especially longer to fire) not a one quick BOOM, more like a boom.....boom...boom.....................booom.

And if that's not 'properly aimed' I don't know what is.

[ohthot1227]

Originally posted by DropShot:

Well... technically all the guns in the same turrets don't even fire together. They fire a fraction of a second off from each other to avoid muzzle blast from the adjacent gun from throwing off the next shell. Although i do not know if that is modeled in game, i haven't really looked closely, and i'm not even sure if it would be noticeable to begin with.

I do know of that fact. But It was a measure taken for the triple barrel turret designes.
And besides, the in game turrets take seconds between each one firing, not fraction of a second.

Originally posted by DropShot:

I would question if it was feasible to fire all guns at the same time and how you would do it. I do not believe the guns had a Central station to fire the guns form. Certainly a the fire control mast directs all of the guns, walking them in and adjusting appropriately, but they're still fired from the crew in the turret.

Wrong. A modern Battleship's turrets were fired from a centralized firing trigger in the firing control center. Firing all turrets in a slavo. The Each turret's Rangefinders aren't even used normally.
When the central fire control is knocked out or something should each turret's crew start firing indipendantly.

[DropShot]

Well, the delay between firing separate turrets would have nothing to do with the muzzle blast, and never insinuated as such. A bit of a fun fact more than an answer or excuse.

You also never specified a Modern battleship. I would argue a majority of the game revolves around early tech, and as such figured it was a safe bet you were not modern.

[DropShot]

Additionally, and i do not know so this is a genuine question, this game's version of a "modern" hull is 1940s tech. So is the centralized fire control station actually used in 1940's ships, or is that a more modem development given we still used the Iowa with modern tech slapped on up until (i think) the early 1990s when they were deployed in the gulf war?

I know they've been retired since the 2000's, i just don't care enough to look up the exact date.

[[TWC] Empirion0]

I don't know about you, but the staggered firing made sense to me. First, I won't wanna put all my eggs in one baskets where it is all or nothing. Especially against small and fast targets they AI likes to spam.

Even in real life it made sense, as that is how I imagine how "Bracketing Salvo" worked. As the gunnery officer I can track which turret's shell splashes, the time it took to travel, not to mention the angle of the turret to the target. All these factors are very dynamic so I imagine more reference is better?

You know, only after playing this game and started to read up about naval engineering, I am surprised just how mathematically precise everything needs to be. The shell pierced 5 inch armor? Make it 5.1 inch thick, because that's all you really need. That 0.1 inch metal is the difference between death and survival.

[munroburton]

Originally posted by DropShot:

Additionally, and i do not know so this is a genuine question, this game's version of a "modern" hull is 1940s tech. So is the centralized fire control station actually used in 1940's ships, or is that a more modem development given we still used the Iowa with modern tech slapped on up until (i think) the early 1990s when they were deployed in the gulf war?

I know they've been retired since the 2000's, i just don't care enough to look up the exact date.

Yes. The Iowa class had centralised fire control in multiple stations(so if the primary station was hit, the others could take over). And a very small delay between guns in the same turrets built into the system so it was literally impossible to fire every barrel exactly simultaneously.

That was because if you have three 1,200kg shells travelling in parallel with a starting velocity of 1600mph, they end up pushing each other away because of turbulence.

[ohthot1227]

Originally posted by DropShot:

You also never specified a Modern battleship. I would argue a majority of the game revolves around early tech, and as such figured it was a safe bet you were not modern.

I don't ONLY mean super-modern ships like IOWA/YAMATO 1930 BBs.

Even the Queen Elizabeth class(Built 1914~, Fought in World war 1) had central fire controls.
Moreover the naval gunnery concept of 'Straddling' is impossible unless the Main guns all fire in quick succession/salvo.

So each turrets firing with thier own crews only makes sense in pre-dreadnought ships with mixed gun caliber.

So I don't know 'exactly' when, but it would be reasonable to assume dreadnoughts would have started suing central fire control form 1915~ in-game time.

And since the campaign is from 1980 to 1940, 1915 and after is a longer time period then before 1915.

[ohthot1227]

Originally posted by TWC Empirion0:

Even in real life it made sense, as that is how I imagine how "Bracketing Salvo" worked. As the gunnery officer I can track which turret's shell splashes, the time it took to travel, not to mention the angle of the turret to the target. All these factors are very dynamic so I imagine more reference is better?

Go read the naval gunnery concept of 'Straddling' bruh....
Not just relying on your imagination.

It may make sense to fire "Bracketing Salvo"s at first, But once your shells start landing near your target, You fire a full salvo to achieve 'straddle'.

[Lucky]

Originally posted by ohthot1227:

Originally posted by Lucky:

Look at the right info panel. If it doesn't have green AIMED word on it that means that you lost the target's range completely and the whole Ladder thing started from the scratch. However, if you are to achieve full lock on - you will get your full and quick broadsides.

Well...NO.
My 'salvos' are landing at least one shell per 'salvo'. Three times in a row, and the 'range found' bonus is like +390%.

And yet the turrets are still firing one at a time (the 4th firing one takes especially longer to fire) not a one quick BOOM, more like a boom.....boom...boom.....................booom.

And if that's not 'properly aimed' I don't know what is.

Can you post a picture of your ship? Preferably with the gun stats.

[ohthot1227]

Originally posted by Lucky:

Can you post a picture of your ship? Preferably with the gun stats.

how do you do that? I've seen guys post schreenshot in comments and I'v always wanted to do that too.

[cylindricalseal]

Originally posted by ohthot1227:

Originally posted by Lucky:

Can you post a picture of your ship? Preferably with the gun stats.

how do you do that? I've seen guys post schreenshot in comments and I'v always wanted to do that too.

F12 while in the game.
Then in the steam app,
View > Screenshots > Upload your captured photo.
After uploaded (it will have cloud icon in it), press View online.
Ctrl+C or Right click+ save the page link, then Ctrl+V or paste in the Discussion forum.

[[TWC] Empirion0]

Originally posted by ohthot1227:

Originally posted by TWC Empirion0:

Even in real life it made sense, as that is how I imagine how "Bracketing Salvo" worked. As the gunnery officer I can track which turret's shell splashes, the time it took to travel, not to mention the angle of the turret to the target. All these factors are very dynamic so I imagine more reference is better?

Go read the naval gunnery concept of 'Straddling' bruh....
Not just relying on your imagination.

It may make sense to fire "Bracketing Salvo"s at first, But once your shells start landing near your target, You fire a full salvo to achieve 'straddle'.

Granted my knowledge of naval gunnery is non-existent, but I did read up a bit on what "salvo" is. To put in dumb English, it just means applying the greatest number of damage onto an area in an instant. There were numerous variation of how a "salvo" is applied, with each nation has its own terms and methods.

What you are describing sounds like what a "Broadside" is to me. You found the range, the target's beam is facing you and you want to "One-punch Man" delete the eyesore across from you... correct?

Then I think we just simply don't have the correct function in game. Sure, you can turn off main guns, get in range and turn them on then hope the AI will aim at the same time. But I am sure there will always be "that one turret" that will desync.

To be honest, I also notice my dreadnought behaved a lot like the traditional ship-of-the-line. Like how the game has very old fashioned "Line" and "Abreast" only and how 14 inch guns behaved like 24-pounders. Tbh, they probably copied the code for naval gun-play from their Age of Sails game.

[Capt. Picolinni]

This is something that is annoying me. The rest of your guns delay long enough for the recoil to affect their aiming. There are numerous pictures of battleship firing in a single salvo, with one naval officer (US Navy Admiral) pointing out you didn't want to have a more than a fraction second delay as the cannons would physically move the ship.