I wonder how the game economy system works (I have a problem with the economy)

[pzkpfw_vi]

Playing 1910-1940 in Japan, I noticed my naval income is very low to maintain my fleet.

I just having 12 battlecruisers 8 heavy cruisers 16 light cruisers and 32 destroyers

And this worked very well during 1920-1930 with plus naval income

However, after 1930, my government has been changed, and they don't give proper budget.

so I'm started to get closer to bankruptcy. and of course, they didn't give me a talk to increase budget since 1930 after changing of government.

I have conquered several provinces almost of east asia and brunei (?) which gives oil production

However, this conquer doesn't seem to be bonus on my naval budget.



So, with this experience, now I really want to know how the economy works.

1. Is the change of government (revolution or election) affects naval budget?

as I wrote above, I have economic problem after the election. they literally decreased my budget a lot

2. Is conquering wealthy province or oil producing province helpful to economy?

I feel they are not helpful

3. When the government suggests increase budget of navy? only random?

after election, I haven't received any suggestion of budget.



4. Is there any method to cheat on my budget?

- I don't want to file a bankruptcy due to decreased budget. So...


I really need help.

I can't find community of UAD in other site. So I asked here.

[Lucky]

There is a long game and there is a short game. You played the latter and these are the consequences.

[Spin]

set your crew to minimal before it mothballs and change your ships to 'in being' i think it is. This will keep your costs down until you're at war

[pzkpfw_vi]

Originally posted by Spin:

set your crew to minimal before it mothballs and change your ships to 'in being' i think it is. This will keep your costs down until you're at war

Well, I didn't tried minimum crew. But, I tried to make my ships 'in being' but still my budget goes minus 500 million $ per month

[pzkpfw_vi]

Originally posted by Lucky:

There is a long game and there is a short game. You played the latter and these are the consequences.

I don't think so. Before the government changed by elections, I made my budget plus 100 million $ per month. And new government decreased my budget a lot and no suggestion of increasing budget

[Lucky]

Originally posted by pzkpfw_vi:

Originally posted by Lucky:

There is a long game and there is a short game. You played the latter and these are the consequences.

I don't think so. Before the government changed by elections, I made my budget plus 100 million $ per month. And new government decreased my budget a lot and no suggestion of increasing budget

Plus 100 mil in 1920-1930?

How about plus 500 in 1920? And yes at this point Japan's economy became number one in the world.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2996763528

This is a long game.

[Jabberwock]

Originally posted by glythe:

Another good trick is to keep "old" ships and put them in a place where you won't be fighting. What good are lots of old ships? Invasion is done purely by ship weight. If you made super cheap designs then those can be useful for naval invasions. Old cheap ships also help you have a high logistics score even if you have lots of land.

As time passes you cannot choose to build ships that have the most cost efficient engine/weight. You can only build ever increasing cost/weight ships. The biggest challenge with old ships is trying to tell them to stop getting into fights.

Give them the lowest possible range. They will take longer getting to the next invasion site, but they will do it without running all over fighting every task force on the way there.

To the OP:
Don't be afraid of bankruptcy, be afraid of unrest. If you can maintain low unrest (keep winning battles), then you can go bankrupt with impunity. The penalties for bankruptcy are unrest and prestige, the bonuses are cash and an increase to the naval budget (your goal).

Another tip, play tall. Expand by baby steps. Take all the territories around one sea zone, then move on. A compact empire keeps fuel costs down. Sending an invasion fleet to a distant target makes fuel costs skyrocket. Wide empires also make protecting transports an issue.

[pzkpfw_vi]

Originally posted by Lucky:

Originally posted by pzkpfw_vi:

I don't think so. Before the government changed by elections, I made my budget plus 100 million $ per month. And new government decreased my budget a lot and no suggestion of increasing budget

Plus 100 mil in 1920-1930?

How about plus 500 in 1920? And yes at this point Japan's economy became number one in the world.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2996763528

This is a long game.

You don't gonna tell me how did you make it, Right?

You're just making boast of your well played game without giving any advice to this poor man.

Of course I tired to play long game and I think I tired my best because I saved lots of money and this made me to command my fleet with minus budget (500 mil per every month) over 10 years since 1930 when the government changed.

THE POINT IS :

I got "Stolen" my budget by new Government Party

And they not gonna suggest any increase of my budget

I NEED Specific ADVICE not boasting

[pzkpfw_vi]

Originally posted by Jabberwock:

Originally posted by glythe:

Another good trick is to keep "old" ships and put them in a place where you won't be fighting. What good are lots of old ships? Invasion is done purely by ship weight. If you made super cheap designs then those can be useful for naval invasions. Old cheap ships also help you have a high logistics score even if you have lots of land.

As time passes you cannot choose to build ships that have the most cost efficient engine/weight. You can only build ever increasing cost/weight ships. The biggest challenge with old ships is trying to tell them to stop getting into fights.

Give them the lowest possible range. They will take longer getting to the next invasion site, but they will do it without running all over fighting every task force on the way there.

To the OP:
Don't be afraid of bankruptcy, be afraid of unrest. If you can maintain low unrest (keep winning battles), then you can go bankrupt with impunity. The penalties for bankruptcy are unrest and prestige, the bonuses are cash and an increase to the naval budget (your goal).

Another tip, play tall. Expand by baby steps. Take all the territories around one sea zone, then move on. A compact empire keeps fuel costs down. Sending an invasion fleet to a distant target makes fuel costs skyrocket. Wide empires also make protecting transports an issue.

Thank you So much Oggmeista, glythe and Jabberwock.

That's really helpful.

[Lucky]

Originally posted by pzkpfw_vi:

Originally posted by Lucky:

Plus 100 mil in 1920-1930?

How about plus 500 in 1920? And yes at this point Japan's economy became number one in the world.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2996763528

This is a long game.

You don't gonna tell me how did you make it, Right?

You're just making boast of your well played game without giving any advice to this poor man.

Of course I tired to play long game and I think I tired my best because I saved lots of money and this made me to command my fleet with minus budget (500 mil per every month) over 10 years since 1930 when the government changed.

THE POINT IS :

I got "Stolen" my budget by new Government Party

And they not gonna suggest any increase of my budget

I NEED Specific ADVICE not boasting

From what I can see the typical complaint here is made on the assumption that player's actions were sound and its the game whats in the wrong. Meaning that a complainer is unable to comprehend the possibility that the dissapointing result is a mere consequence of player's choices. And it is a player who is at a fault here.

You are the perfect example of this.

"I got "stolen" my budget"

No. It was you who robbed your country of economical growth in pursuit of some ephemerical gains. And it was you who didn't control the fallout of this choice.

What choices of yours what led to this?

1. You kept Nationalist Party government for its Naval Budget bonus disregarding the hit on the GDP growth.
2. You made those "+ naval budget" choices what undermine your economic base.
3. You didn't suppress the unrest level prior to elections hence new party won it.

So, for half the game you preferred the short term results above all else and literally build your country around that fleet of yours. And in the midgame you let the change into long term policy happen. But you have no long term anymore. You have only your navy with something what resembles a country attached to it.

And this is the architecture of your mistake.

Can something be done about that?

Yes.

You should create political instability and see how internal balance will change. If leftwing party will start to gain ground than you should quell the unrest by whatever means necessary and go with plan B: scrap you precious fleet and build a new, affordable, one. If the situation will swing into right than you should keep the unrest level and after the next elections you will get your budget back.

[Lucky]

Originally posted by glythe:

Originally posted by pzkpfw_vi:

You don't gonna tell me how did you make it, Right?

I NEED Specific ADVICE

Let me tell you how to do something better.

1. Start game as Japan in 1890. Don't build any ships on game start. Set crew pool to 0% and tech/transport sliders to 100%.
2. Research some technology for 10 years and don't build any ships. If you get some trade partners you could design something that isn't too terrible like a torpedo boat and make them if you want. Don't use the politics tab unless someone is starting to go heavy negative.
3. After 10 years build some BB or LC depending on whichever tech lines up first. Build up to like 20 LC and 10-15 BB. Make sure you have plenty of tonnage for invasion power.
4. While you are building either your LC/BB turn naval spending up to 51% and start using the politics tab to get china to about 70% and hold there until the fleet is built.
5. Declare war on china. Fight them and blow up their good ships then Naval Invade : NE China and E china. After that you can let land battles play out and invade some other areas or you can end the war.

6. Go to war with Spain and take East/West Philippines (these will discover oil). You may or may not need more ships depending on how Spain does with the USA. Do not bother taking anything else.

7. Build up a lot of ships and then go after ENG. The main target is SIngapore and Brunei. If you really want to dig in deep you can go for East/West India (but you can also "earn" those by doing well in the fighting.

8. Why are we going for these places? Oil. If you ever get entangled with Russia you can liberate Vladivostok.

9. One reason not to take minor islands that never get oil is that if the enemy owns it you get "free transport raiding" in that zone and it's +1 area they have to defend.

While you are absolutely correct that something could be done better the actual advises will have too litle of impact to even consider them. And the difference will be choosing centrist government over right wing one. I didn't bother by that because, you know, techically I have already won and whatever left in the game was huge mopping up operation. Too boring to actually go with it.

[pzkpfw_vi]

Originally posted by Lucky:

Originally posted by pzkpfw_vi:

You don't gonna tell me how did you make it, Right?

You're just making boast of your well played game without giving any advice to this poor man.

Of course I tired to play long game and I think I tired my best because I saved lots of money and this made me to command my fleet with minus budget (500 mil per every month) over 10 years since 1930 when the government changed.

THE POINT IS :

I got "Stolen" my budget by new Government Party

And they not gonna suggest any increase of my budget

I NEED Specific ADVICE not boasting

From what I can see the typical complaint here is made on the assumption that player's actions were sound and its the game whats in the wrong. Meaning that a complainer is unable to comprehend the possibility that the dissapointing result is a mere consequence of player's choices. And it is a player who is at a fault here.

You are the perfect example of this.

"I got "stolen" my budget"

No. It was you who robbed your country of economical growth in pursuit of some ephemerical gains. And it was you who didn't control the fallout of this choice.

What choices of yours what led to this?

1. You kept Nationalist Party government for its Naval Budget bonus disregarding the hit on the GDP growth.
2. You made those "+ naval budget" choices what undermine your economic base.
3. You didn't suppress the unrest level prior to elections hence new party won it.

So, for half the game you preferred the short term results above all else and literally build your country around that fleet of yours. And in the midgame you let the change into long term policy happen. But you have no long term anymore. You have only your navy with something what resembles a country attached to it.

And this is the architecture of your mistake.

Can something be done about that?

Yes.

You should create political instability and see how internal balance will change. If leftwing party will start to gain ground than you should quell the unrest by whatever means necessary and go with plan B: scrap you precious fleet and build a new, affordable, one. If the situation will swing into right than you should keep the unrest level and after the next elections you will get your budget back.

Finally! That's the answer what I want. Thank you.

[BanzaiCharge]

Government type also influences budget, you can see it in the Politics tab, if you hover over the government type of a nation. You should keep Centre and Right wing parties in power as they provide the highest GDP growth and Province Growth bonuses. Nationalists suck. Avoid commies like the plague, -45% GDP growth bonus will kill your economy.

If you start a new campaign, avoid wars as long as possible. Wars halve your GDP growth.

If war in unavoidable, try to make it a very short one. Go with the infamous "Kantai kessen" (Decisive battle) doctrine: find the strongest fleet of your enemy and sink it. If they ask for peace, accept it. You will get war reparations and you can get a few provinces here and there.

Avoid invasions early game. They last for too long, and the prolonged war will put you behind economic behemoths like USA and France. If you laund an invasion anyway, do it with a high value province with oil in it. Map painting is for late game.

[Lucky]

Originally posted by glythe:

Originally posted by BanzaiCharge:

Government type also influences budget, you can see it in the Politics tab, if you hover over the government type of a nation. You should keep Centre and Right wing parties in power as they provide the highest GDP growth and Province Growth bonuses. Nationalists suck. Avoid commies like the plague, -45% GDP growth bonus will kill your economy.

We don't get to choose government type. They're completely scripted events with some RNG elements.

Current support for the ruling party is defined by the unrest level. In absolute monarchies you have to go all the way till revolution. For everybody else you just keep some unrest and the support will shift. This way you can even control government types of other countries.