Ironclads

[NT_Dave]

Just saw a test on YouTube. Unfortunately, as the tester had no real understanding of his ships, it wasn't very enlightening. Next, weapons availability was too limited or in error. For the Monitor-type ship, there was a 12" gun (no such animal) and no 15" inch Dahlgren gun (common). Likewise no rifled guns (such as the 7.5" Brooke Rifle on the Virginia. Finally, armored ships in this period fired solid shot - round, cylindrical blunt (bolts), or pointed at armored targets. They had no bursting charges. Shells lacked penetration ability, simple contact fuses did not permit any sort of delay. Modern armor-piercing shells are in the future. Thus, the widespread ignition of fires on target ships from hits is nonsense. Also, it was far too easy to hit the sides of the very low Monitor-style hull, which in reality was only inches above the water. Finally, it was too easy and quick to sink a ship. These warships pounded each other for hours with little effect, although thinner-skinned ironclads were quickly battered into submission by the big guns. But not sunk. So defeated ships need to be forced to surrender when sufficient damage is inflicted. Oh yes, ability to hit at great range (like 1000 yards) is too good. Fights took place with ships practically touching each other. I hope this is fixed before any release.

[Silamon]

The monitor vs Virginia scenario was an april fools joke that people liked enough that they left it in the game.

So yeah there are inaccuracies, but it was not really intended to be super realistic in the first place.

[NT_Dave]

Didn't know it was a joke. Which is too bad since I'd love to see an ironclad era capability permanently added to the game. The period between 1860 - 1890 is full of interesting developments and experiments.

[Silamon]

That time period is different enough that it could be its own game, I don't really think it has a place in UAD tbh.

[NT_Dave]

Perhaps so. Something like 1850-1900. With some era divisions. That would prevent the somewhat absurd "super battleships" I'm seeing in all the YouTube vids being created in an era where shipbuilding isn't sophisticated enough to justify. Those ship battles are getting boring, just like the unrealistic tactics of WoW. Could use the same game engine, easy to create as it's basically a mod of the main game. Could even be an add-on module, since it would be basically artwork and parameter changes. Hopefully the developers are seeing this.

[kenberg]

The battle of lissa 1866

Franco prussian war

Russo turkish war 1877

American civil war

And other's in the 1860s-1940s were you have one or both side's with type's of Ironclad's like-

Flat iron gunboat's

Monitor warship's

Coastal defence ship's

Armoured frigate's

River monitor's

And other's should at some point be in uad and not as a 2nd game.

[Rax Savvage]

ultimate admirals ironclad sounds baller though

[blood-phoenix]

Purely by chance, I happened to stumble across an article recently that got me fascinated by this time period, and I've been researching it for about a week.

All one has to do is spend an hour on the internet looking at pictures of the absolutely CRAZY variety of ship designs that were experimented with during the last half of the 19th century, to see that a game EXACTLY like this GAME RIGHT HERE, would have in that era an incredibly rich source material. Although, based on some of the previous work done by this company, it occurs to me that they may already intend to put words other than "Dreadnought" after that "Ultimate Admiral: title phrase"

"Ultimate Admiral: Ironclads" would have one guaranteed buyer right here. There was so much experimentation with new technology...with each innovation driving other changes. The whole introduction of metal armor was a response to the devastating effect of the new explosive shells on traditional wooden vessels. Steam allowed ships a form of propulsion that didn't rely on massive (and vulnerable) arrays of sails. For a time, as this new form of warship shared the seas with their more fragile sisters, the ancient tactic of ramming briefly regained popularity, with ships being built with massive armored prows that plunged in a downward angle - the opposite of what we're accustomed to seeing on a modern ship. Whenever I think of those steam-belching armored behemoths sinking enemy ships by simply crashing into them, I cannot help but recall the scene of the Nautilus from 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea!

But the greatest creativity came in attempts to answer the question of how to best arrange the powerful guns on these new vessels. Initially, they built "Broadside Ironclads" that followed the
familiar design of the Man-of-War that had dominated the oceans for so long. The HMS Warrior was one such. But so many varieties followed! "Central Battery", "Barbette", "Casemate", "Turret", all unique, and many more.

The one that has remained stuck in memory as the most fascinating, was the HMS Temeraire, a Royal Navy ironclad battleship that was completed in 1877 which carried an assortment of guns in the traditional broadside placement, but also two enormous 11-inch (279 mm) muzzle-loading rifles in barbettes on the deck. The guns weighed 25 TONS...their primary projectile was the 540 pound "Palliser" armor-piercing shot, which were fired with a "Battering charge" of 85 pounds of gunpowder for maximum velocity and penetrating power (GULP).

But the truly amazing part was that they were mounted on DISAPPEARING CARRIAGES, which some of you may know were typically only featured in fortresses...it caused the guns to sink down into the surrounding barbette structures, where they were protected while reloading, rising back up over the edge of the barbette when ready to fire! (If you're not familiar with the concept, google "Disappearing Gun", a picture really is worth a thousand words sometimes - I only learned about them after I moved to Seattle, and saw the old coastal artillery forts that once guarded the entrance to Puget Sound).

[Silamon]

Originally posted by blood-phoenix:

Purely by chance, I happened to stumble across an article recently that got me fascinated by this time period, and I've been researching it for about a week.

All one has to do is spend an hour on the internet looking at pictures of the absolutely CRAZY variety of ship designs that were experimented with during the last half of the 19th century, to see that a game EXACTLY like this GAME RIGHT HERE, would have in that era an incredibly rich source material. Although, based on some of the previous work done by this company, it occurs to me that they may already intend to put words other than "Dreadnought" after that "Ultimate Admiral: title phrase"
*snip*

If you like learning about naval history you should check out Drachinifel on youtube if you haven't already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ygXLnRAm-A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28vougAE7LM

[CheeseMerchant]

Originally posted by blood-phoenix:

Purely by chance, I happened to stumble across an article recently that got me fascinated by this time period, and I've been researching it for about a week.

All one has to do is spend an hour on the internet looking at pictures of the absolutely CRAZY variety of ship designs that were experimented with during the last half of the 19th century, to see that a game EXACTLY like this GAME RIGHT HERE, would have in that era an incredibly rich source material. Although, based on some of the previous work done by this company, it occurs to me that they may already intend to put words other than "Dreadnought" after that "Ultimate Admiral: title phrase"

"Ultimate Admiral: Ironclads" would have one guaranteed buyer right here. There was so much experimentation with new technology...with each innovation driving other changes. The whole introduction of metal armor was a response to the devastating effect of the new explosive shells on traditional wooden vessels. Steam allowed ships a form of propulsion that didn't rely on massive (and vulnerable) arrays of sails. For a time, as this new form of warship shared the seas with their more fragile sisters, the ancient tactic of ramming briefly regained popularity, with ships being built with massive armored prows that plunged in a downward angle - the opposite of what we're accustomed to seeing on a modern ship. Whenever I think of those steam-belching armored behemoths sinking enemy ships by simply crashing into them, I cannot help but recall the scene of the Nautilus from 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea!

But the greatest creativity came in attempts to answer the question of how to best arrange the powerful guns on these new vessels. Initially, they built "Broadside Ironclads" that followed the
familiar design of the Man-of-War that had dominated the oceans for so long. The HMS Warrior was one such. But so many varieties followed! "Central Battery", "Barbette", "Casemate", "Turret", all unique, and many more.

The one that has remained stuck in memory as the most fascinating, was the HMS Temeraire, a Royal Navy ironclad battleship that was completed in 1877 which carried an assortment of guns in the traditional broadside placement, but also two enormous 11-inch (279 mm) muzzle-loading rifles in barbettes on the deck. The guns weighed 25 TONS...their primary projectile was the 540 pound "Palliser" armor-piercing shot, which were fired with a "Battering charge" of 85 pounds of gunpowder for maximum velocity and penetrating power (GULP).

But the truly amazing part was that they were mounted on DISAPPEARING CARRIAGES, which some of you may know were typically only featured in fortresses...it caused the guns to sink down into the surrounding barbette structures, where they were protected while reloading, rising back up over the edge of the barbette when ready to fire! (If you're not familiar with the concept, google "Disappearing Gun", a picture really is worth a thousand words sometimes - I only learned about them after I moved to Seattle, and saw the old coastal artillery forts that once guarded the entrance to Puget Sound).

Very interesting read.

from what you are saying it sounds like it could indeed be entirely its own game.alot of material to go around with

the main concern i am having however is how fun gameplay actually will be. ships that go around an average of 7-8 knots fighting other ships going the same speed. ships that are so heavy armored that they could not even take eachother out effectively would result in endless matches of putting the game speed to x10 to even get results happening. not even mentioning the target audience that besides a few History buffs of that period like you would not care for such a game being around. Iron Clads sadly do not have anything near of the reputation Dreadnoughts and Battleships have.

This sounds alot for something a modder should do. or at its best should be released as a DLC for this game. i would definitly suppor the idea for as much different designs and tech as possible in this game

[Silamon]

I said it could be it's own game, and it seems to be happening

Some of you folks might be interested in this as well. https://store.steampowered.com/app/1299330/Victory_At_Sea_Ironclad/