Turbo Charged Ships of the Line

[Vinegaroon]

Do ships of the line seem a bit fast to anyone else? I'm working my way through the British campaign on medium. Somehow the Second and Third Rates seem to be able to chase down my frigates and corvettas at full sail. I've tried multiple points of sail and they still manage to catch up. Is this a balance issue or am I overlooking a game mechanic.

[IRDCAM]

HMS Victory 8-10 knots, USS Constitution 10-13 knots. Area of sail, wind direction, ballast weight, hull condition (barnacles etc), all sorts of conditions have an effect on speed.

[albrightwillie0]

In the British campaign I was in pursuit of a 3rd rate with an Endemion class frigate rigged for speed. We were both on a downwind tack and my ship was showing 17.5 knots! I couldn't catch the Sol across the length of the map. Kind of insane.

[Vinegaroon]

Originally posted by IRDCAM:

HMS Victory 8-10 knots, USS Constitution 10-13 knots. Area of sail, wind direction, ballast weight, hull condition (barnacles etc), all sorts of conditions have an effect on speed.

Oh barnacles

[Pratorianer]

Really laugh barnacles now.
Search the HMS Victory on the internet and you will see how fast an HMS Victory 1st rank ship is. So let's stay with reality. In no universe with our physical circumstances can line ships function as speed boats.
Here you can clearly see either the game is still a long way from Early Access or the developers have given the AI ​​supernaturally strong values. Because no ship of the line could ever compete with the speed of frigates, corvettes, briggs or Snows, at least that's what my research on the Internet found.
It is possible that there were also ships that were slower, but I'm sure that only a few outdated ships could be at the time of the development of the ships of the line.

To the developers, please change that so the game cannot stay if you already bring reality into the game then please in all matters and not only in favor of the AI.

It can't be that the Linenen ships sail around my frigates, corvettes, briggs and snows as if they don't have any physical limitations like me as a player.

[JaM]

Ships of the Line quite commonly caught up to smaller ships... especially on windy days... especially French 74's when fresh from the port were quite fast.. Brigs or snows would stand no chance, and were quite commonly captured by patrolling Ships of the Line..

People have this common misconception where large ship had to be slow, but that was not really the case.. size was not that different, considering all ships of that era were limited by length due to construction limits of wood. What mattered most was the sail area, and small ships could not compete in that against larger ships.

So why were Frigates used for chasing other ships? Because Ships of the Line were just too costly to be used that way...they had much larger crew, which required a lot more supplies, and therefore could not stay out on patrol for so long.. PLUS, for the cost of single Ship of the Line, you could have 3 5-rate Frigates which could patrol 3 areas, instead of one... so Frigates were ECONOMICAL choice most of the time...

Yes, there were some exceptional frigates which were quite fast, yet, even those eventually got captured - Endymion for example was a copy of French Frigate Pomone which got captured by British frigates, so obviously, speed did not help her that much...

[Pratorianer]

Then explain to me why a liner ship that can make a maximum of 9 knots, smaller lighter ships that make 10 knots and more could not escape. I'm not a marine expert, but if I'm only 5 km / h fast and you are 10 km / h fast, I can't catch up with you, that's a fact.

The next point is you want to explain to me that such a large ship as a ship of the line is more agile and maneuverable than smaller and lighter ships. Then explain that to me.

But apart from that I have now played the missions 5 times and it's always the same result the 2 ships of the line consume my entire fleet, the AI ​​is too stupid to board because the enemy AI's ships of the line are just too fast, they have a higher load and crew but they are as light-footed as a balerina.
That just can't be right. Either the enemy AI has been made so overpowering that you try to create an artificial degree of severity or the game just isn't even ready for Early Access, that's my opinion.
And yes, in a direct broadside battle of the linership against the frigate, the linership will definitely win, but that's not how it works for me I have 4 frigates together that have more cannons than the liners and don't even scratch the wooden planks.
So you can tell me what you want I don't think so.

I forgot to mention that.
When I watch the enemy AI then I have the feeling that it is not tied to the physics engine. Like me as Player.

[Captain Jack Sparrow]

you can never shot down enemy ship's mast,so the chain cannonball is totally useless.it's not fair~~~

[tillackt]

What battle are you fighting where you are experiencing this behaviour?? So far I just haven’t seen this situation. I can 90% capture any ship.

You may find that chasing the ai ship is the wrong thing to do. Given all battles operate within a fixed, limited game area if you hold back they will turn around and come for you.

I’ve never had the big chase, though now you can slow them down a bit with chain shot to their sails after a while.

Use round shot for masts and chain shot for sails.

[JaM]

Originally posted by Pratorianer:

Then explain to me why a liner ship that can make a maximum of 9 knots, smaller lighter ships that make 10 knots and more could not escape. I'm not a marine expert, but if I'm only 5 km / h fast and you are 10 km / h fast, I can't catch up with you, that's a fact.

The next point is you want to explain to me that such a large ship as a ship of the line is more agile and maneuverable than smaller and lighter ships. Then explain that to me.

But apart from that I have now played the missions 5 times and it's always the same result the 2 ships of the line consume my entire fleet, the AI ​​is too stupid to board because the enemy AI's ships of the line are just too fast, they have a higher load and crew but they are as light-footed as a balerina.
That just can't be right. Either the enemy AI has been made so overpowering that you try to create an artificial degree of severity or the game just isn't even ready for Early Access, that's my opinion.
And yes, in a direct broadside battle of the linership against the frigate, the linership will definitely win, but that's not how it works for me I have 4 frigates together that have more cannons than the liners and don't even scratch the wooden planks.
So you can tell me what you want I don't think so.

I forgot to mention that.
When I watch the enemy AI then I have the feeling that it is not tied to the physics engine. Like me as Player.

no idea where you got the idea Ship of the Line can only make 9knots... Ocean class 1-rates were capable doing 10knots, Temeraire class 74gun ships could do 11knots or more...
Large ships have one clear advantage over smaller ships - their masts and rigging is more sturdy, therefore can withstand more pressure, and therefore could be under sail even at wind level, smaller ships couldn't keep their sail set...
HMS Victory for example was capable catching up French 5-rate Frigate Ambuscade and capture it...

So claiming Frigates were always fastest is obviously not true, as there are quite several examples where Ship of the Line managed to catch a frigate and capture it...

[Pratorianer]

Originally posted by Captain Jack Sparrow:

you can never shot down enemy ship's mast,so the chain cannonball is totally useless.it's not fair~~~

Yes, I can confirm this.

[Pratorianer]

Originally posted by tillackt:

What battle are you fighting where you are experiencing this behaviour?? So far I just haven’t seen this situation. I can 90% capture any ship.

You may find that chasing the ai ship is the wrong thing to do. Given all battles operate within a fixed, limited game area if you hold back they will turn around and come for you.

I’ve never had the big chase, though now you can slow them down a bit with chain shot to their sails after a while.

Use round shot for masts and chain shot for sails.

Sorry, I'm playing the game in German. I don't remember the mission name at the moment. I play the British Campaign, and that's an open sea battle with French frigates, American brig or frigates and 2 ships of the line. I tried to shoot the masts, tried to kill the crew. But these ships just don't take any damage. And as I said, I can't board them either because they move and turn faster than anything I have on ships.

And thx for the help.

[JaM]

chain shot is for tearing the sails...and it does it quite well... Solid shot is for taking down masts.. but you need to use good accurate guns with a lot of penetration (Desaugliers work quit well for this)

[Pratorianer]

Originally posted by JaM:

Originally posted by Pratorianer:

Then explain to me why a liner ship that can make a maximum of 9 knots, smaller lighter ships that make 10 knots and more could not escape. I'm not a marine expert, but if I'm only 5 km / h fast and you are 10 km / h fast, I can't catch up with you, that's a fact.

The next point is you want to explain to me that such a large ship as a ship of the line is more agile and maneuverable than smaller and lighter ships. Then explain that to me.

But apart from that I have now played the missions 5 times and it's always the same result the 2 ships of the line consume my entire fleet, the AI ​​is too stupid to board because the enemy AI's ships of the line are just too fast, they have a higher load and crew but they are as light-footed as a balerina.
That just can't be right. Either the enemy AI has been made so overpowering that you try to create an artificial degree of severity or the game just isn't even ready for Early Access, that's my opinion.
And yes, in a direct broadside battle of the linership against the frigate, the linership will definitely win, but that's not how it works for me I have 4 frigates together that have more cannons than the liners and don't even scratch the wooden planks.
So you can tell me what you want I don't think so.

I forgot to mention that.
When I watch the enemy AI then I have the feeling that it is not tied to the physics engine. Like me as Player.

no idea where you got the idea Ship of the Line can only make 9knots... Ocean class 1-rates were capable doing 10knots, Temeraire class 74gun ships could do 11knots or more...
Large ships have one clear advantage over smaller ships - their masts and rigging is more sturdy, therefore can withstand more pressure, and therefore could be under sail even at wind level, smaller ships couldn't keep their sail set...
HMS Victory for example was capable catching up French 5-rate Frigate Ambuscade and capture it...

So claiming Frigates were always fastest is obviously not true, as there are quite several examples where Ship of the Line managed to catch a frigate and capture it...

The Idea i have from Wikipedia i searched the HMS Victory and in the tchnical Information stands he made 9 knots. And i searched the Uss Constitution in the Wiki and there stand 13 knots in the technical Information. How i say i am not a Navelexpert i only can use the Informations that i can search in the Internet. So i excuse me if i was wrong with this informations.

[Pratorianer]

Originally posted by JaM:

chain shot is for tearing the sails...and it does it quite well... Solid shot is for taking down masts.. but you need to use good accurate guns with a lot of penetration (Desaugliers work quit well for this)

Not all of my ships have these guns, but most of them. And yet it doesn't help, it may be due to my crew or the officers that they are not so experienced. Or it's just up to me, it can also be. But why was I able to sink a single line ship in a few missions before then with not as powerful frigates as I have now.

[Ninjasquirrel]

Ships of the line are not slow, they carry the most sail area and have the deepest keels. Depending on conditions at sea they can potentially sail faster than a frigate. Larger ships generally keep their speed better in rough conditions.