Thief positioning and flanking

[TowerWizard]

The tutorial mentions backstab being triggered by flanking enemies. The problem is getting into that position.

1. Melee attacks can only be made in cardinal directions, not diagonals.
2. Moving out of melee attack range means the enemy attacks you (fair) and the turn is over (for some reason)
3. There is no "disengage"so as to ignore such "opportunity attacks"
4. Very limited movement, no jumping in combat, et cetera.

So, how are you supposed to consistently trigger flanking?

[Black Hammer]

Originally posted by TowerWizard:

The tutorial mentions backstab being triggered by flanking enemies. The problem is getting into that position.

1. Melee attacks can only be made in cardinal directions, not diagonals.
2. Moving out of melee attack range means the enemy attacks you (fair) and the turn is over (for some reason)
3. There is no "disengage"so as to ignore such "opportunity attacks"
4. Very limited movement, no jumping in combat, et cetera.

So, how are you supposed to consistently trigger flanking?

The thief gets an ability you can unlock that allows you to disengage for free, so that opens it up a lot.

Backstab is also triggered by enemies being vulnerable. So you can use the hide in combat ability then a bow, or stun or panic them with another character. The main issue with the stuns is that they only last until that enemy goes, so if the enemy's turn is between your stunner and the thief, you're SOL.

A lot of how this game handles status effects is a bit regressive like that: immunities and resistances are handed out like candy, even though your gear and skill options are very limited early on. Throw in how underwhelming a lot of spells are for your characters compared to enemies (they'll cast the same spell and easily do double your damage with it), and it's pretty clear you're supposed to just beat things to death with raw weapon damage.

Take the Reavers: their "level 7" archer shoots twice at some ridiculous +10 to hit and has an infinite supply of poison arrows. Have fun with guys firing machineguns from offscreen.

[TowerWizard]

Yeah, I am beginning to think this game is poorly balanced in other areas as well, sadly. The UI is unintuitive, and hard to navigate in some cases: click twice on a skill so level it up took a few headscratches to figure out. Also, the misclick penalty in combat is very high, with no undo-button... I mean, you can waste a spell and mana by clicking a tile with no character on it...

Thank you for the writeup. The game mentions vulnerable, but does not say how it is triggered.

[Black Hammer]

Originally posted by TowerWizard:

Yeah, I am beginning to think this game is poorly balanced in other areas as well, sadly. The UI is unintuitive, and hard to navigate in some cases: click twice on a skill so level it up took a few headscratches to figure out. Also, the misclick penalty in combat is very high, with no undo-button... I mean, you can waste a spell and mana by clicking a tile with no character on it...

Thank you for the writeup. The game mentions vulnerable, but does not say how it is triggered.

Yeah, a lot of things just aren't clear or simply don't work properly.

Enemy accuracy outpaces dodge so fast it's laughable. I did everything I could find to boost Iago's dodge; he still gets hit nearly all the time because enemies casually attack twice a round at 1-2 points higher attack bonus. Crits are also not explained at all, and since enemies get more total attacks than you, they print out crits like nobody's business, despite already having more effective health and actions than you.

For example, a lot of effects only last until the target's next turn. Defend Ally, Stunning Strike, etc. This makes these pretty worthless for teamwork, because there's no guarantee that target isn't going next, making the effect either pointless (Defend Ally) or at best less interesting than they could be (Stunning an enemy to open up a Backstab, for example, only matters if the initiative order works out).

Kat's pretty useless any time you can't get backstabs. Her dodge is pathetic, her to-hit chance is poor, and her damage without backstab is forgettable.

[TowerWizard]

At least I got the game on a sale. Time to move on. There are other games.

[Black Hammer]

Originally posted by TowerWizard:

At least I got the game on a sale. Time to move on. There are other games.

It's a short fun little game, aside from the combat being underwhelming. I'll probably finish it, and overall have enjoyed it, but yeah, combat's definitely the weak link.

[Ghoul Hunter]

Backstabs are triggered by other things too. Stuns, panic, sleeping, etc. It's better to set up enemies, than to try and traditionally flank them.

Blackhammer is feeding you misinformation, btw. Enemies go once, unless they have abilities that allow them to go more (same skills as your own talent trees). The enemies don't have ridiculous hit chance. On harder difficulties, they get to roll multiple times and pick the best roll. If you're playing on normal, you can tank someone up to be very hard to hit. Bosses usually can hit you very easily, though, even if you are tanky.

[TowerWizard]

Does the game tell me how to stun? Or are you talking about specific abilities? What triggers a panic? Like, how do you "set up" an enemy crab?

By the way, his or her name is Black Hammer, not Blackhammer.

I really like your portrait, by the way. Good old Doom. Those were the days.

[Vex Hasturr]

the tons of damage make hard positioning reasonable. also yes, there is skill to not end your turn by swapping

[Vex Hasturr]

Originally posted by TowerWizard:

Does the game tell me how to stun? Or are you talking about specific abilities? What triggers a panic? Like, how do you "set up" an enemy crab?

By the way, his or her name is Black Hammer, not Blackhammer.

I really like your portrait, by the way. Good old Doom. Those were the days.

stuns are skills. I saw hospitaller has one. Probably any character with Club skill branch has it. also there is spell in Earth school magic to stun 3 in a row

[Thril]

If you're getting detected before you can attack, maybe your stealth is too low? When you can't get close, backstab with arrows.

The mage's 'poison cloud' spell does an aoe stun. My MC is a mage and I use that one a lot.

Even without flank and stun, I gave Cat the skill to hide at start of combat, so that's a free ranged backstab. Then hide in combat every other turn. At level 14 with the full backstab tree, melee backstabs are doing 90 damage and 1-hit almost everything on Normal.